Purple Rock Survivor Podcast: Cambodia Episode 8 “You call, we’ll haul”

There were middle fingers and immunity idols flying around all over the place on Survivor: Cambodia, and the Purple Rock Survivor Podcast is here to talk about all how it all shook out.


Purple Rock Survivor podcast: Cambodia episode 8 “You call, we’ll haul”

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In this episode, Andrew Savage’s biggest fan (Matt) joins us as we discuss:

  • Andrew Savage’s winner’s edit
  • Kelley Wentworth and Chekhov’s Idol
  • One of the best Ponderosa videos we’ve ever seen
  • Ciera Eastin, Scrappy Mom-voting Underdog
  • Jeremy’s strengths and weaknesses
  • The advantage offered during the challenge next week

Fair warning, there is a profanity or two that slipped through on this one, and we were too lazy to edit them out.

Of course, we always welcome your comments. You can leave a comment here, tweet us @purplerockpod, or email us at purplerockpodcast on gmail. Thanks for listening and/or watching!

  • Vagabond

    I’m going to take a page out of the Andy play book and do a little prediction grandstanding. As much as I like Wentworth and Ciera, I think after this episode neither has a chance to win. The way the editors portrayed Savages exit from the game bodes very poorly for them both. For starters although I don’t hate Savage like many seem to, he is undeniably arrogant and paternalistic, two qualities that can easily make you look like a jackass on TV. They didn’t edit this as the women outfoxing an overconfident jerk (which I think would have been easy to do, I’m sure Savage gave plenty of ideal boot quotes) but instead frame the events as Savage getting taken out by a cruel twist of fate. Secondly, Wentworth and Ciera are both shown VERY prominently gloating and reveling in their ( I think short lived) moment of power. I’m sure other players have been excited and celebrated after a successful idol play but the editors chose not to show it. If either of the women were our winner this season I don’t think they show that bit of unseemly gloating. Therefore, Wentworth and Ceira, 0% chance.

    • sharculese

      I’m not sure the last part is right. I just went back and checked to make sure I remembered right, and, after the first vote for Carolyn comes in Mike loudly applauds.

      Edit: I think the bigger issue is that there just aren’t enough winners who needed idols to get there for us to have a decent sample size.

      • andythesaint

        There is exactly one person who successfully played an idol and won the game. Mike Holloway.

        Typically, if a bunch of people decide they want to vote you out and you thwart them, they try again. With Mike, they couldn’t.

        Now, Tony did celebrate when TCs went his way. But he never had a successful idol play.

        • sharculese

          Since Vagabond brought up Ciera as well I figured I’d expand the set to people who were involved in a successful idol play that benefited them, even if they weren’t the one protected, so Mike w/ Carolyn, and Natalie w/ Jaclyn.

          Also, we do get to see Tony gloating when Spencer plays his idol incorrectly.

          • andythesaint

            And when he wins the vote at the merge and Sarah goes home.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Remember, gloating is ugly when done by a woman.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Sandra with 2 idol plays in her season. Even if she was on the wrong end of the votes when Boston Rob was idoled away by Russell she benefited. Then Parv’s double idol play is what sealed a Villain victory.

            Question: Is Sandra the first winner to play an idol on themselves, even if it was unsuccessful?

          • sharculese

            I was limiting it to people where they clearly directly benefited from it, and I didn’t include Sandra because she wasn’t targeted and who the fuck knows how many paths to the end Sandra has.

            As for your second question, yup, Danni and Aras didn’t have one, Yul never needed his, Earl and Todd never had one, Parvati supposedly found one but decided not to keep it, Bob never had a real one, JT never needed one, and Natalie White… well…

          • Kemper Boyd

            I think if you include Natalie White as benefiting from Russell’s idol play then Sandra has to be included for Parvati’s as it set up their side in power. Sandra, did her thing from there but I honestly don’t think she’d have made it to the end with the Heroes in power. Last Villain standing probably, further than a couple of heroes possibly but the end, I dunno.

          • sharculese

            I actually didn’t include that though, mostly because I didn’t think to. The one I used was Natalie A. playing her idol on Jaclyn.

          • Kemper Boyd

            OH, sorry it’s amazing in 30 seasons that Natalie is the only name of two winners. Natalie’s play on Jaclyn was epic. It’s up there with Parv’s double play for me. Also include Natalie’s convincing of John to play his idol when Keith did. SJDS is a bad season but the post merge is exciting and Natalie is a baller winner.

          • andythesaint

            Earl had an idol. He wisely did not play it for Yau-Man.

          • sharculese

            Right yeah. My thought process was “someone in that alliance had an idol” and I shorted out after I remembered Yau-Man’s.

        • Kemper Boyd

          I do wonder if because it’s so so early with so many people Wentworth can recover. Mike used his idol at 7, at 7 there is no wiggle room, no other threats for people to look at, at 11 there clearly are enough people for you to either fade into the background or make your vote available to someone for protection.

      • Vagabond

        But Mike was portrayed as a lovable puppy dog and the other people were shown as dour hateful humans ( I believe I heard someone refer to them frequently as the wet blanket alliance but I can’t remember who… )so the viewer can not only forgive Mike for applauding but enjoy it. I’m not sure that dynamic exists with this season.

        • sharculese

          Kelley’s been getting a fairly flattering edit as an adorable blonde moppet with a secret killer instinct.

          • Barbara Anderson

            I think Ciera is getting the really unflattering edit with her constant rolled eyes at TC. Also,I think it is significant that we have only really gotten Ciera for the past three episodes while we have been getting a little from Kelley this whole time. Yes, part of that is because of her idol, but part of it was showing her thought process. For example, we got a confessional from her in the second episode talking about why she was so quick to join up against Shirin and Spencer.

  • Roswulf

    I’m enjoying the retreat from full Savage Booster-ism. Two days ago, EDIT DESTINED WINNER! Now? Better television that Brandon Hantz or Will the YouTube sensation and awful person!

    • Other Scott

      Savage winner edit was real. He’s coming back via a jury only outcast twist in the Final 4.

      • Purplerockmatt

        #staywoke

      • Roswulf

        I think your spoiler sources are getting a bit garbled The Ponderosa videos culminate with an outcast twist whereby the jury decides whether to add Savage or special surprise guest Sad Lil at Final Four…

        Savage does not win.

        • Sad Lil

          Darn tootin’!

        • Prom King

          Savage only wins in life, never Survivor. That is known.

    • gouis

      Yeah that assessment was ridiculous. The Savage boosters never said “he’s such a fun arrogant villain!” They’ve spoken of him as a perhaps flawed, but true hero.

      • Kemper Boyd

        Savage views himself as a true hero, I’m sure he’s a much better person than the Hantzes, Johnny Fairplay or Will in real life but his brand of ego and petulance at any small defeat does not make good television for me.

      • purplerockpodcast

        I should clarify: I don’t think he’s a villain. I think that a segment of the internet fan base decided he was a villain because he’s arrogant and didn’t like Stephen. My point on the podcast was only that if we (the internet) are making him the “villain” of this season, I’m fine with that. Because I’ll gladly take Savage as the villain over people I actively dislike watching. (And yes, I recognize some of you actively dislike watching Savage.)

  • Purplerockmatt

    Oh another topic we thought about raising and didn’t get to, is whether Ciera is right in appealing to people to “play the game” and make a move here. I think the problem with that argument is that of the 9 people that were in taht alliance only 2 don’t have viable final three plans. But basically I think Stephen and Kimmi are much better positioned than the outside perceives him. I think Jeremy has connections to everyone in that group. I think Savage and Tasha are thinking final three together. And I think Joe is best served by sticking to Savage who actually wouldn’t vote him out. And finally Wigles isn’t thinking about this at all, but she is in a great spot to be everyone’s favorite goat when that alliance breaks apart. I think only Keith and Spencer aren’t in other people’s plans in that big alliance and Keith either doesn’t realize or doesn’t care. And Spencer does realize but won’t jump until he has the numbers. So Ciera’s big plea here is working off of faulty information, because I really think it doesn’t make sense for most of the people in that alliance to change course

    • Other Scott

      And it’s not like anyone who jumps would be in the Ciera-Wentworth final 3 plans either. That’s the problem with jumping from a large amorphous blob alliance where there’s really no such thing as a number 6 or 7 or whatever to a tight smaller alliance. The smaller alliance tends to stay tight.

      • Purplerockmatt

        precisely. it does make sense for some people to jump in some instances, but right now i think the power dynamics in that group are murky enough to keep jumping to a minimum

        • Kemper Boyd

          Also it doesn’t make mathematical sense AT ALL.

      • Kemper Boyd

        This isn’t a clear Rotu 4 situation where the bottom 2 of a six realise and have 3 others to jump to either. We are at 11 now. If two of you jump it’s still 6-5, unless Joe doesn’t win immunity it will be Wentworth, Ciera or Abi this week. You start thinking about how to flip your alliance when the numbers are right and the numbers are currently very wrong.

        • andythesaint

          This might be true. But Ciera doesn’t have the luxury of waiting. She needs people to THINK it’s in their best interest to flip now. Even if it might not be.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Oh yeah, she HAS to be appealing but it makes sense it’s currently falling on deaf ears, it may very well be 2 tribals after her boot that someone thinks about what she said and takes action.

    • Roswulf

      I would separate whether Ciera was right to appeal, and whether her targets should have listened.

      I see no problem with Ciera hammering the idea that the people on the bottom of the majority should make a move, and that she is available for wackiness whenever. She’s in a bad spot, and it’s not like nuance is the way to convince Wigglesworth and Keith Nale to be adventurous. And if it’s annoying, well, maybe that helps to make Wentworth target #1.

      But her big plea was rightly ignored, for the reasons you state. I’m just not so sure it’s because of faulty information, as opposed to Ciera either lying or not caring if her comments were true or not.

      • Purplerockmatt

        that is a good distinction actually. I was more analyzing whether people should have listened to the appeal, not whether it was a good appeal.

    • andythesaint

      I’m sure they all think they’re in final plans (or at least those who think about the finals at all), her point is that some of them are WRONG. Like she was. She thought she was in Tyson’s final 3. She was wrong. And by the time she realized it, the only thing that could help her was a rock. So her plea is to use the available players to make a move now before it’s too late (like she should have with Caleb).

      To your bigger question is if she’s right, the answer is “of course”. Even if her info is wrong, you gotta take the shot. If someone falls for it, it’s worth it.

      • Purplerockmatt

        right but I’m saying the problem right now is that people will find out they are wrong later, but right now they have evidence in their favor they are right and that evidence weighs more heavily to them than jumping to ciera’s side would

        • andythesaint

          Which is precisely true of Ciera in Blood vs Water. Tyson and Gervase were giving her assurances, Hayden and Caleb were not. But Tyson and Gervase’s assurances were lies, much like Jeremy’s might be for some of the people she’s talking to. Moreover, even if Tyson was telling the truth: Ciera would have had a hard time to beat him. The same could be true of the people’s she’s talking to: join and use the people who need you more and that you could potentially beat.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I think that HAS to be her next plea is there are 8 of you, so 5 of you aren’t in the final 3. But look at who you think you are in the final 3 with, can you actually beat them? If not why are you in the final 3 with them?

      • tocantins

        Yes, I think what she means is, if you think your final three is A-B-C and someone else’s is D-E-F, then you better start thinking right now if you have the votes to make yours happen when there are only 6 or 7 of you left, because if you don’t, then by then it will be too late.

        • Kemper Boyd

          I think this is a great point, it’s a question of “are you in majority when it comes to final 7?” and “how are you making your final 3 happen?” I genuinely think Jeremy has this worked out to as certain a point as anyone can in Survivor but some of the others don’t have a clue.

    • Prom King

      I think anyone who openly appeals to their fellow players “to play the game” is playing a poor social game – which is the most important game to play when it comes to winning. Saying those things to the camera, fine. Saying those things directly to other players comes across as both desperate and condescending.

      • andythesaint

        It might come off as desperate because she is in a desperate situation. Either of those could have been her last tribal council.

  • andythesaint

    MY THOUGHTS MUST BE RECORDED!

    -Stephen did not know how much danger he was in. He wrote that in his People Mag blog: “Of course I knew Savage was throwing my name around. He’d been throwing it around for three weeks, why should he stop now? But I had no idea how truly close I was to getting eliminated.”

    -Someone on the comments pointed this out, and I’m disappointed no one else has picked up on it (here or elsewhere), the girls didn’t choose Savage for strategic reasons because they had no idea that their votes would matter. Unless Kelley led them there (since she knew there was a chance), this was just deciding who to throw their fuck you vote to. Now, there’s good strategy to choosing Savage, but that wasn’t their primary motivation.

    -Another good reason for Ciera to not name names at the reward: Kimmi came back and told Stephen what she said.

    -About Ciera’s final 4 of 5 people: even if the math is wrong, she’s actually completely right. Because there’s two final fours at play with the two figureheads: Savage’s final four is himself, Jeremy, Tasha, and Joe. Jeremy’s final four is himself, Tasha, Savage, and Fishbach. So there’s a three, with the fourth depending on which of the two alphas win.

    -I’m not sure Ciera should jump in. Standing there on small footholds might be better odds for her than out swimming other people. (Not that they’ll get to plan, but it would help their alliance more if the had the advantage AND the idol)

    -Some final Andrew Savage thoughts: I wanted to see what a post-merge Savage would be. We were robbed of it due to a horrible twist (and his inability to deal with said twist). What we got wasn’t much of a surprise, and now that itch is scratched. We see what happens to the rah-rah team guy when the team phase is over. Because while that type isn’t necessarily my favourite type, I do find it interesting. I like to see different approaches to the game. (Now I should add that just because he failed here, he may not have then, just because the game was different then and his tribe and their bonds were different. But, still, there are aspects of Survivor that he just isn’t built for).

    A lot of what I was doing this year with the Savage talk/trolling was simply pointing out the inconsistencies in how people were judging him vs how they judge either and questioning their motives for doing so. I’m not sure that’s very helpful, but it is something that interests me. That said, I do recognize that Savage invites such inconsistencies with his holier than thou attitude, but still: it’s hard to criticize hypocrisy if your criticism is in itself, hypocritical. (Although I also need to throw in my standard qualifier: if rooting against someone on Survivor is part of the fun for you, then by all means. We all engage in different ways).

    I think the biggest thing with Andrew Savage is that he’s about as emotional player there is. He may not seem it with his alpha male pose, but every emotion with him is on his sleeves and written on his face. The guys touched on it: when things good bad for him, he shuts down and sulks. When they go well, he’s all superlatives and “greatest thing ever”. He “loves” his Bayon brothers. Tasha is like a sister. Spencer is a phenomenal kid. Bayon is the greatest tribe ever. Many find it annoying. I find it kind of endearing.

    At least until this episode, when I decided that I’d seen enough. I was ready long before it became clear he was in danger of leaving. So I’m happy to have gotten the full Andrew Savage experience. That thread is now closed.

    • andythesaint

      One thing I just thought of: I’m sure Jeremy did tell Stephen about Savage as Matt suggests. The problem is that Jeremy ALSO didn’t know how close it came to being Stephen. He didn’t know that Joe and the three girls were on board.

    • sharculese

      It’s also a challenge that favors a low center of gravity. We are talking about something that has previously come down to Andrea vs. Brenda.

      • Barbara Anderson

        But on the flip side: Tony almost won this same challenge in Cagayan.

    • Purplerockmatt

      there is no way Jeremy’s final four doesn’t include kimmi. why wouldn’t jeremy want to be sitting next to Kimmi there?

      • Other Scott

        I took it less as Final Four and more as “In Jeremy’s mind, the heads of the alliance are…”

        Though in all honesty, that was a good final 4 for him too. He’s crushing all of those people. May want to sub Tasha out just to make sure he wins final immunity.

      • Kemper Boyd

        I came to say this: Jeremy’s final 4 to be honest is Jeremy, Stephen, Kimmi and whoever. I got the impression early on that the meat shield alliance was designed to do what it has, to mean that if the opposing alliance began picked off members of his alliance it would take out a strong player who wasn’t him. I never understood he really wanted Savage at final 4 or 5 with him.

        • Purplerockmatt

          yeah i totally agree. In effect Savage served exactly the purpose Jeremy wanted him to in taking the idol hit for Jeremy. the meat shields are there to protect jeremy from being the early target or the idol target but they aren’t who he is planning to take to the end

  • Diego Armando

    I’m guessing the advantage is the stick. I think Stephen will jump and end up with the advantage. It would fit his edit so well. I think Wentworth will be targeted because Jeremy and Tasha will realize that she has the most connections and will target her.

    • Other Scott

      Stephen would have to win some sort of challenge like thing though – even if it is just swimming. That seems unlikely.

      • Diego Armando

        It just seems like he is itching to make a big move and winding up with an advantage would fit the edit we have been shown so far. I think it will backfire on him though. I still stand by my Kelley prediction. I think Stephen will be the first in the water.

        • tocantins

          I think even Stephen realizes that even if he were to be the only one jumping, he still wouldn’t get that advantage.

    • sharculese

      The problem with making the garbage idol the advantage is that when you show it to people, they can think ‘weeeelllll, s/he did win a secret advantage in that challenge.’

      For this to work optimally we need the addressee to have no reason to believe this is anything other than bullshit.

      ETA: Unless the intention is that whoever the winner shows it to assumes they’re being lied to because that’s the fakest looking fake idol of all time. That could work.

      • Diego Armando

        Sorry, I meant clue to the stick.

  • sharculese

    When John brought up the reward vs. immunity thing I thought it seemed a little early for an individual immunity challenge, but then I realized how awesome it would be to force someone to pick 3 or 4 people out of that bloc of 9 to take on reward.

  • Roswulf

    On the Abi burning people list…she turned against Spencer back in the Shirin vote. And while Tasha wasn’t on the tribe at the time, she would be completely aware that Abi flipped on Tasha’s Angkor bros.

  • Roswulf

    I’m surprised at John and Matt’s certainty that Wigglesworth will not jump. Immunity has very little value for her right now, and we’ve already seen her be the first to jump in the water for a swimming race back in Episode One.

    • andythesaint

      I think the issue is that giving up on a challenge doesn’t seem like Wiglesworth MO at all. Nor does overt game moves. Were she to jump, she’d have the best odds of any non-Joe to win the race.

      • Roswulf

        I understand the argument, but I would argue there’s a real chance Wigglesworth doesn’t think any farther than “I can choose between standing and swimming. I am good at swimming!”

        • sharculese

          What if the preview reverses cause and effect? What if Wigles wins an idol clue and then just straight up tells everyone in her alliance because she doesn’t care?

        • andythesaint

          She’s probably pretty good at standing too tho. Like when she’s standing behind trees in all the footage.

          • Roswulf

            Hmm, is anyone’s life sufficiently dull that they’ve been watching Wigglesorth secret scenes?

            Has she been hiding by standing behind trees, or hiding by swimming underwater?

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Someone claimed on AVC that her secret scenes are dynamic, which I have a hard time believing, but no desire to prove.

          • andythesaint

            I’ve watched. That person is either lying or has a different definition of dynamic.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I mean they are way more dynamic than her on the show being that she is speaking more than a sentence.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I watched one confessional to make sure they were indeed filming confessionals with her and she was in fact speaking in them.

          • Other Scott

            Honest question: What would a Kelly Wiglesworth winner edit look like?

            I’m guessing she wouldn’t be *this* invisible, but it’s not like they could ever make her a prominent player and still make the show good.

          • gouis

            She would get a lot of heartfelt confessionals where she says she’s not sure if she can do this, and that maybe the game has passed her by. But dangit, she’s going to tough it out anyway!

          • Other Scott

            *shudder*

          • andythesaint

            They would have other people talking about her and what it was like playing with Kelly Wigglesworth.

          • Roswulf

            I’m thinking extended plotline about the wacky complications of living on an island with TWO Kelly Ws.

          • DrVanNostrand

            You can always tell a Milford (wo)man.

  • Barbara Anderson

    I keep going back and forth on Ciera’s actions at TC. Yes, it is great that she is so disgusted by the majority alliance, but she is showing herself as being as rigid as Savage was. I liked her calling out the five in control, but she may burnt any connection she could have had with them. She’s scrappy but she is being edited to look like a brat. Although I do love her eye-rolls gifs, how many of them do we need in an episode? I just don’t know what to do with Ciera.
    In contrast, I love Kelley’s reasoning for not naming names because she wants to work with them down the line. At this point, I am scared for Wentworth because Ciera and Abi-Maria could be good goats for that Bayon alliance down the line because they have burnt so many bridges at this point (which you all mentioned in the podcast). Wentworth needs to be picked up by another alliance soon or she’s screwed.

    • tocantins

      I don’t see this bad edit for Ciera, I think since the merge here edit has been top tier. In fact, if not for her absolute absence pre-merge, I would even say she is a contender to win (edit-wise, that is).

      • Barbara Anderson

        I can see that, but I don’t think she can win. Yeah, she probably has a guaranteed vote in Kass if she gets there, but I don’t know how some of the people in the majority right now would handle working with her. But, I am still new at reading edits, so I fully admit that I am probably misreading this. After rewatching this TC multiple times, I noticed how often we got Ciera making faces. Yeah, Kelley made faces too but it seemed to be edited only in regards to idols being in play. I am just so confused by her. Is this reaction what people had with her in BvW?

        • Purplerockmatt

          yeah i think so. andy and john had pretty divided reads on her in BvW basically due to this divide

          • Barbara Anderson

            I can see that. I wonder if we are getting so much of her lately because she is going soon.

        • Kemper Boyd

          I like Ciera, based on the fact she is pretty unique in Survivor. She would never have been cast without her Mom because she isn’t eye candy and your 23 year old women on Survivor are eye candy first and foremost.
          She is 26/27 now was a teen mother, was viewed as naive and easy to manipulate in BvW but clearly had more intelligence than she is ever given credit for and has a grasp on the game. Yeah she puts herself in bad positions with her mouth but that stuff is entertaining.

      • Prom King

        Ciera: 0 chance at winning Survivor.

        Her edit so far:

        – invisible for a long time; barely present in first episode
        – makes a bold move and (along with Abi, off-screen) blindsides Woo
        – thinks Joe is on board to vote Stephen but is disappointed; Savage is blindsided not due to Ciera but to Wentworth and, inadvertently, Jeremy

        It is an interesting edit but I don’t think a winning one.