Survivor Heroes vs Healers vs Hustlers Episode 12 Liveblog: “Not Going to Roll Over and Die”

Follow us on Twitter and Storify below for the twelfth episode of Survivor: Heroes vs Healers vs Hustlers!

Matt
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Matt

Matt has an irrational dislike for all contestants named Michel(l)e. Also if he ever takes a strong stance about why everyone else is wrong, it is he that is inevitably wrong.

Favorite seasons: Micronesia, Heroes vs. Villains, Palau, Philippines, Pearl Islands, Cagayan
Matt
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  • I been having a real bad week, Survivor, so I am begging you to be good tonight. So let’s do this!

    • StormofCuteness

      *sad face for you and this super sucky episode*

  • Hornacek
  • Marlin M.

    Hello 🙂

    • Hornacek

      Hey.

    • Violina23

      What’s up?

  • Taako From Teevhii

    Fighting rats. Perfect metaphor.

  • sharculese

    Who would have guessed that Ryan could grow a better beard than Devon.

    Honestly, he should probably keep the beard.

    • the sky is falling

      There’s no way devin hasn’t shaved, or that’s some odd facial hair

      • sharculese

        That’s all some dudes can grow. Other roommate is like that.

        • the sky is falling

          Weird,have never seen only goatee-growers

          • sharculese

            You’ve seen Boston Rob.

    • Violina23

      When he was making that growly, pained face during the immunity challenge, he reminded me of David Tennant. Which kinda disturbs me….

      • Purple Rock Emma

        I could see Kilgrave vibes. Or Barry Crouch Jr.

        • purplerockandy

          Ryan is so very Kilgrave. They both have the BEST social games.

        • Hornacek

          I’m gonna hope that was an autocorrect, because if you didn’t know it was Barty Crouch Jr you’d have to turn in your Harry Potter card.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            It in fact was! My autocorrect has actually been behaving very strangely, so thats probably one of the less egregious ones.

        • Violina23

          I hate the depiction of Barty Crouch because they kept making him do that stupid lizard tongue thing, essentially because they couldn’t trust the audience to believe the reveal.

          In general I did NOT like the GoF movie at ALL, until the end. They nailed the end.

    • Hornacek

      It’s against the Bellhop Dress Code ™.

  • Taako From Teevhii

    So “Chrissy and Ryan are super angry about Ben’s betrayal” escalated quicker than expected.

    • sharculese

      I mean, Ben is right about Chrissy, but he’s also trying really hard to lose a jury vote.

  • That is why Chrissy and Dr. Mike are bad Survivor players. I also think they somehow both wind up in the final 3.

  • Taako From Teevhii

    Another reward challenge before the title sequence. And with the family visit, it’ll be a long one before the break…

  • Hornacek

    Why couldn’t Ashley’s loved one be JP?

    • sharculese

      Ashley betrayed JP, something he will not forgive until he forgets it five minutes after it happened.

  • the sky is falling

    Everyone say hello to the first graduating class of the Russell Hantz school of jury management.

  • Maritimer

    “If I get a chance to get back at Ben, I’m taking it” … that’s going into the back pocket as FTC foreshadowing

    • Marlin M.

      as Ben reaching FTC?

      • Maritimer

        Yeah, with Chrissy voting against him and/or leading the jury against him

        • No, you are thinking too small Mari, I think she going to be the final tie breaking vote.

          • Maritimer

            If we’re all reading the tea leaves right on that, that is 100% what that statement felt like it could be setting up. Especially since consensus has coalesced around Chrissy as FTC loser

          • This is how Devon wins. It will be the season of people willing to recognise Ben’s gameplay vs people who hate Ben.

  • sharculese

    I’m really shocked Ryan didn’t say “my dad, because, in case you guys don’t know, I’ve never had a girlfriend.”

  • sharculese

    Jeff: “Mike, you seem kind of unfuckable.”

    • Hornacek

      Jeff: “Mike, who would ever want to marry you?”

  • Taako From Teevhii

    S38, BvW3: Get Rimm’red

  • Hornacek

    Jeff is obviously forgetting when Dawson hugged him … and more.

  • sharculese

    God Chrissy’s husband looks like he should be on a pamphlet for mid-quality sailboats.

    • gouis

      Every week you have just a solid slam dunk joke that falls through the cracks. This is it.

  • BadPlayer91
  • the sky is falling

    What is this challenge? In sync?

    • Maritimer

      How many NSYNC references will Jeff use?

      • the sky is falling

        It’s just blind luck, do not like!

        • Maritimer

          This is really dumb

      • Hornacek

        Players who Chrissy didn’t pick, say bye bye bye to your loved ones.

  • PurpleTally

    Is the band-aid on Ben’s shoulder for an injury or an inappropriate tattoo?

    • Hornacek

      He’s had that for most of the game. Either bandaid or sunburn.

  • Taako From Teevhii

    I don’t like this challenge, but I do like how it gets the loved ones involved without having them be challenge liabilities

    • sharculese

      It pleases me, in that it’s as boring for people who like challenges as regular challenges are for me.

      • the sky is falling

        Eventually they will just draw rocks for every challenge for the whole season.

        • sharculese

          It all looks the same on fast forward.

    • Hornacek

      But then we don’t get unintentionally hilarious scenes of Cochran and his mother walking through the challenge chatting with each other.

  • Hornacek

    How is this a challenge?????

    • Maritimer

      “challenge”

      • BadPlayer91

        YEAH, WHAT EVEN IS THIS?

        • the sky is falling

          I think we are all united in hating this. can’t wait to see how Reddit spins this as greatest challenge ever!

  • PurpleTally

    This really eliminates the strategy of blowing the loved ones’ challenge.

    • Violina23

      YES! That was my only explanation. Can we call it the Cochran Challenge?

  • This is the worst challenge Survivor has ever done and they once had an immunity challenge where the point of it was to fly a kite.

    • Alkanarra

      I can’t wait for the reunion so we can make fun of the Make-a-Wish kid who came up with this one.

      • sharculese

        That kid was awesome though.

        • Alkanarra

          Fair enough. I was mostly picking on how hard they worked to be positive that they made his final production into a damn near death trap.

        • Hornacek

          He did almost permanently hobble Missy.

      • Violina23

        Naw, we let our heart be warmed, and then try to forget the “challenge” ever happened

    • BadPlayer91

      I just don’t even understand it

      Like, how did a bunch of people with Salaries decide this is it?

      • I mean I enjoyed it because it me fantasy points but it was an awful challenge.

        • BadPlayer91

          The skill this challenge tests is the ability of your fingers to sense color! SKILLLLLL

          • When Jeff initially described it I thought it was going to test your ability to read the mind of your loved one and deliberately choose the same rock. But no, it was even stupider than that.

          • Hornacek

            When Ryan was given his bag he held it up towards his father, making me think he was hinting to him the color he was going to choose.

          • Hornacek

            If Matt Murdock was someone’s loved one, he’d ace this challenge.

    • PurpleTally

      Two words: SOS challenge

      • No because that challenge at least required creativity.

        • PurpleTally

          Yes, but also, ass feathers.

          • Diego Armando

            At least it lasted longer than 1 minute.

      • Adam B.

        TAGI IS GROGGY

      • Hornacek

        No one had a feather in their ass.

    • Adam B.

      Some of us remember the Blair Witch-edited “I’m going to tell you a story, then go to the huts to answer questions” from Borneo.

      • That at least required thought about putting the challenge at night.

      • Diego Armando

        “I don’t know”

        • Violina23

          I don’t remember a whole lot from Borneo, but that was definitely one of them…

    • Diego Armando

      They also once pick 1, 2, or 3 flags from 21 Challenge that can be instantly won by the team that goes first.

    • The waterboarding challenge from Nicaragua/Redemption Island says hello.

  • Taako From Teevhii

    Everything that Chrissy is mad at Ben for is what she did in picking who gets the loved ones reward. You couldn’t even hem and haw for two seconds?

    • sharculese

      I don’t think Chrissy has a lot of self-awareness.

      • BadPlayer91

        Or any. Like at all.

  • PurpleTally

    I am still mad that no one ever pulls a Penner and goes in for a last hug. Like, what is production going to do?

    • BadPlayer91

      Yeah, make them pull more marbles and call it a challenge?

    • sharculese

      Penner’s knowledge of the TV industry and what it meant he could get away with is kind of unique, and part of what makes Penner special.

      • PurpleTally

        One of my favorite stories ever is him threatening to sing Beatles songs (possibly some other copyrighted music) during Dana’s med evac.

  • BadPlayer91

    So like, did this season get filmed during a hurricane or a stormy season? Like, maybe they had a real challenge and it got blown away or destroyed? Or the boat with the schematics for any kind of challenge sunk, but the boat with marbles didn’t? Or they were sponsored by marbles? WERE THEY SPONSORED BY MARBLES?

    • Bundi

      *shakes fist at the big marble lobby*

    • the sky is falling

      Oh my god, spit my wine all over my carpet

      • Violina23

        I’m so glad I wasn’t drinking anything.

    • wonderand

      MARBLES!: tearing loved ones apart since 2017.

    • sharculese

      Marbles.com: It’s like stamps.com, except, instead of something useful, you get small glass balls for a game kids haven’t played in 60 years. Also, we’re only showing you the boring marbles.

      • Violina23

        Jeff didn’t even say “Balls”. WTF?

    • the sky is falling

      Jeff should have told each loser, “you lost your marbles”

      • Hornacek

        Nailed it.

    • Purple Rock Emma

      This comment was infinitely more entertaining than that challenge.

  • wonderand

    How many different, better-but-still-terrible variations of this challenge, using the same supplies, can we dream up?

    I’ll start: both people choose marbles simultaneously, then reveal. At least that would lead to excellent attempts at telegraphing choices through eyebrow-wiggling, reward families that spend too much time playing rock-paper-scissors, etc.

    • Taako From Teevhii

      Tiny bocci ball.

      • wonderand

        I would watch 15-20 minutes of that, easy.

    • the sky is falling

      2 words: Marble Dodgeball

      • sharculese

        You mean Crossfire? I’d be stoked if Jeff came out and was like, “today’s challenge is we found a bunch of old Crossfire boards at Goodwill, so you’re playing Crossfire. Deal.”

        • the sky is falling

          Or Hungry Hungry Hippos?

          • Violina23

            The waiting game sucks, let’s play hungry hungry hippos!

        • wonderand

          Sign me up IMMEDIATELY for Survivor: Board Games.

        • Diego Armando

          Crossfire…
          CROSSSSSFIRRRRRRRE!!!!!!!!

          • sharculese

            You’ll get caught up in the
            CROSSFIRE!

        • Violina23

          How about the Arena thingie from American Gladiators? (I’m blanking on its real name)

    • Diego Armando

      They each take turns throwing the marbles at Jeff. First player to make him cry wins.

      • Hornacek

        You have to throw the marble at your loved one, and they have to catch it in their mouth.

    • Dramus18

      Newlyweds game, using the marbles as the answers to yes/no questions about your relationship to your loved one or whatever. Have a hard no talking rule.

      • wonderand

        This is not terrible at all! It would also seed the conversations later AND give the winner pretexts to use when picking people.

  • Taako From Teevhii

    Ok, I like this use for a fake idol. I guess David did it too tho…

    • Maritimer

      The Bob strategy?

      • Taako From Teevhii

        Did he hide it? I don’t remember.

        • Maritimer

          No, he straight up gave it to Randy. But its more that its just about spiting someone you don’t like than having any real strategic plan

          • Taako From Teevhii

            Ben’s reasoning though is that they’ll look for it and then stop looking for the real idol. If someone gave me an idol, I’d be very wary of it being a fake idol.

          • Maritimer

            That’s legit. I just caught the part about being spiteful to Chrissy

        • sharculese

          No he gave it to Randy so that he could implement his strategy of everyone piling the votes on him, and then they all laughed at Randy and he had to apologize at FTC and only got Randy’s vote because Suzy gave Sugar a cookie.

          Because fuck Gabon.

  • sharculese

    Oh, shit, Ashley found some tall socks. Everyone tell her to watch out for Dalton Ross.

  • the sky is falling

    this season was bad enough without these raggedy twists they are trying out.

    • sharculese

      How is this trying something out? This is literally just the idol hiding format from the Cambodia pre-merge, except Lauren had the luxury of telling people.

      • Taako From Teevhii

        I think it’s different because you had cover in a pre-merge obstacle course. You could get caught, but it wasn’t entirely out in the open. This one will be clearly in front of everyone else.

        • sharculese

          But on the other hand, she has multiple people who know she’s going for an idol to help her out.

        • Taako From Teevhii

          So nvm. With no sit out bench, that was pretty easy for Lauren. Which just goes to show that making it a whole thing was *very* stupid.

  • Taako From Teevhii

    And I do not like this “you have half of an idol to go. Get it at the IC.” But it will be interesting to see how Lauren gets the other half. Fall off the platform in “exhaustion” and land on top of the shell?

  • Hornacek

    It’s the Koah Rong superidol crossed with the Cambodia hidden-at-a-challenge idol.

    • Maritimer

      Its not a super idol though is it?

      • Hornacek

        No but the KR superidol was in 2 parts.

  • Marlin M.

    that Family visit felt like a waste. They barely showed it.

    • Well they just had to show Ben being a jackass with a fake idol.

    • Maritimer

      I’d already forgotten it happened. Normally we get a big portion for that. My guess is its because those 4 don’t really matter anymore

  • Hornacek

    No good-bye to the loved ones?

  • Hornacek

    Is Lauren gonna have to fake a fall to pick up the other half of the idol?

  • sharculese

    The person who came up with “what if we made them spend the entire challenge listening to annoying sounds that they can’t stop?” deserves a raise.

    • Maritimer

      Unless they’re the marble person. This doesn’t make up for that

      • the sky is falling

        Still furious about that stupid challenge

    • This challenge is miles ahead of the last time it was played and is legions better then the reward challenge.

  • sharculese

    Yup, that was easy.

  • Marlin M.

    I dont like that Devon did that.

  • Hornacek

    I thought they’d have to walk over to the bench. It helps that Lauren’s on the end and is just sitting right where she needs to be.

    • sharculese

      I’m sure they made sure the shell was planted at Lauren’s post.

      • Hornacek

        Right but I thought she’d have to walk over to the bench, giving her only seconds to pick it up. But she had 15 minutes to get it.

      • purplerockandy

        More specifically, that Lauren’s spot would be on the end.

        • Hornacek

          Even if she wasn’t on the end, she had ~15 minutes sitting there. Eventually peoples’ attention would wander, and she could just pretend she was picking up random stuff. Without a sit-out bench, getting this shell was easy (unless you were one of the final two players still in the challenge).

  • Maritimer

    Well, that confessional certainly indicates this isn’t going to be routine

    • the sky is falling

      If that means Mike stays, then YAY

      • Maritimer

        I haven’t figured out who from the 4 is going. It feels like Ben, but I also feel like Ben makes FTC. I kind of want it to be Lauren to watch Reddit burn

        • BadPlayer91

          That wouldn’t be the worst, except that Lauren is the one person i’ve gotten invested in…

          • Maritimer

            I like Lauren too but i also don’t want reddit to be happy

          • Hornacek

            Does anyone?

  • PurpleTally

    Lauren not even trying to hide that shell.

    • sharculese

      I mean, why would anyone think it’s anything other than a shell she found and is playing with?

      • PurpleTally

        Exactly. At least Production could have done SOMETHING to make it less easy.

        • BadPlayer91

          Agreed. Particularly given that Ben referred to ‘his shells’ when making the fake idol, as if they all had been collecting shells, which I assume most players do when bored on a beach for 39 days. It should have somehow stuck out of been further away from her platform, that way there was ANY risk involved…

        • Violina23

          It should have been further away so she’d at least have to think about how to go out and get it without looking suspicious. The whole point of an idol hidden at a challenge is to make it RISKY to collect said idol.

      • Figaro

        Right. I think it would have been more suspicious if she had attempted to hide it.

  • Hornacek

    If Devon were to get voted out tonight then he lost this game for a shoulder massage.

    • I mean if it was by Ashley then I could see an argument for it.

  • sharculese

    WHY DO THEY JUST HAVE A GROSS ROTTING FISH HEAD IN A BUCKET????!

    • Taako From Teevhii

      To make a gross, rot-filled soup later.

    • Hornacek

      SYMBOLISM!

      • sharculese

        Is this… edgic?

        • Hornacek

          I think you just used a word that doesn’t exist.

  • Marlin M.

    how about if Ben idols out Devon?

    • Maritimer

      I think that’s on the table

  • Taako From Teevhii

    SPY SHACK!!!

  • Marlin M.

    idiots. lol

  • Hornacek

    The return of Spy Shack Ben!

    • the sky is falling

      Why would they not hashtag that moment, missed opportunity

  • Hornacek

    Wow – Lauren, Ashley and Devon have terrible poker faces.

  • You just had one job. You three had to make sure was secure for one vote and you could not do it.

  • sharculese

    Mike, one person saying they want to work with you doesn’t mean you’re back on top.

    • Maritimer

      Remember that time he played his idol for no good reason and that meant he was back on top? I’m not sure Mike quite understands how control works

  • Bundi

    i appreciate how delusional Mike is. One break goes his way, and he’s immediately “BACK ON TOP, BABY!”

    • Crappy

      To be fair he seemed to be the kingmaker this episode with remaining herslers openly vying for his vote. I am all for crazy plays but people this season constantly keep blowing their position in the game. Makes no sense.

  • Marlin M.

    Chrissy is so bad.

  • Hornacek

    Dr. Mike goes from being on the bottom to being on top back to the bottom on top again – his Survivor season is a roller coaster.

    • the sky is falling

      Something something, joke about sex

      • Taako From Teevhii

        You shouldn’t be having sex on a roller coaster.

  • Marlin M.

    Why would she do that? NOOOOOOO

  • Taako From Teevhii

    I have no idea what Lauren giving Mike the shell was supposed to accomplish.

    • Marlin M.

      a new entry to the dumb moves list.

    • Bundi

      Do we know if it’s authentic? She could literally give him any shell and he would have no idea.

      • Taako From Teevhii

        That’s true, but I think we’d get a Lauren confessional telling us that’s what she did.

    • Maritimer

      Getting herself voted out tonight?

    • Alkanarra

      Let him know he’s safe because they won’t target him? Which he already knew was the case. So… OK, not that. Maybe letting him know she trusts him enough to… what? Return it to her later? Maybe she thinks it’ll take the heat off of her? But she could always just play it and accomplish that *and* be safe. Yeah, I got nothing.

  • sharculese

    Mike, you don’t get to accuse other people of making one of the stupidest moves in Survivor history. You just don’t.

    • Diego Armando

      But the sad thing is that this was dumber than his move.

      • Other Scott

        I actually don’t think it was – like I can SEE what Lauren was going for. Hey Mike, I’m giving you the half the idol so you know that I do not have an idol and thus am not a threat in this game compared to Ben. Please vote for him instead.

        And the thing is – it would have worked if not for the Ben idol no one knew about. But it backfired badly.

        I think it comes down to – if these players conceive that it’s a possibility that Ben has an idol then everyone plays this a bit differently.

  • Hornacek

    Oh no Dr. Mike is making another Plan B.

    • sharculese

      Can’t tell if this is a contraception joke or not, so I’m just assuming it is.

      • Hornacek

        It was not intentional. I think Dr. Mike actually said that he was going to come up with another “Plan B”.

    • Marlin M.

      Plan B is important. .

  • Maritimer

    Matt, it may be just me, but trying to follow the liveblog through the slideshow and its lagging about 10 mins behind on updating. The main liveblog page is fine

    • Purplerockmatt

      no idea man.

      • Maritimer

        No worries. Its the first time its ever happened to me but just wanted to make y’all aware in case its a bigger problem

        • Sylvisual

          When I did these I always found the slideshow format to be lagging. Use the actual Storify feed for the fastest results. (Click the Story logo under the header.)

          • Maritimer

            Thanks, I’ll try that next time!

  • This episode is the typing cat gif.

    • sharculese

      Guys, this for featured comment.

      • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

        I second the motion

    • the sky is falling

      No clue what’s happening here

    • Purplerockmatt

      I used it a lot in the liveblog tonight

      • *every night

      • Violina23

        I still love that gif and watch at least 3 iterations each time…

  • Hornacek

    Did Lauren give Dr. Mike the actual idol shell? She should have given him some shell she found on the beach.

    • Marlin M.

      Wouldn’t we have gotten a confessional she did that?

      • Streets_Ahead

        Not if they wanted to #Blindside us.

  • Marlin M.

    Im very afraid Lauren is done.

  • Taako From Teevhii

    Is matching tank tops going to be the theme for the jury this season?

  • Hornacek

    Did Joe shave his entire head? He’s gone Full Tony!

  • Chris Diorio

    If Lauren goes home, Reddit is going to FLIP

  • Taako From Teevhii

    So now let’s retract the “Devin’s a mastermind” theory.

    • Purple Rock Emma

      I mean, it’s all relative.

  • PurpleTally

    All I want for Christmas is for Lauren to have given Mike a fake shell and then to play the idol at tribal like “Surprise motherfucker!”

    • Crappy

      That’s what I was hoping for as well 🙁 Would have been epic, Genius style twist.

  • Maritimer

    Living for the fact that they cut away from JP as the jury came in, then cut to Joe as they were sitting. We never say his face

  • Taako From Teevhii

    What the fuck is going on?

    And don’t read that as an exclamation. I’m very exasperated.

    • sharculese

      What is this? Why is this?

      • Taako From Teevhii

        Who are these people? Why are they on my TV?

        • sharculese

          What is day? Who are vote? Can Survivor make a think?

          • Diego Armando

            Can we just retroactively disqualify everyone here and give the win to Jessica or Ali; they seemed to have some baseline competence.

          • Alycia Swift

            I got to disagree there. Jessica blew her game for a guy.

          • Dramus18

            Just give this season’s title to Cirie, Survivor owes her at this point.

        • Hornacek
  • sharculese

    You know how pre-season Jeff was saying the last couple of episodes were crazy, and we were all like “uh-huh, sure Jeff, fool me once and all?”

    Was Jeff… right for once?

  • Bundi

    MIKE!

  • Hornacek

    OH MY GOD MIKE THREW HALF AN IDOL IN THE FIRE!!!

    • Bundi

      I know the gameplay has been less than stellar, but I am kind of enjoying the stupidity. It just hit a certain point where like it’s so bad, it’s amazing.

  • sharculese

    Remember when we thought some of these people might be good at Survivor?

    Memories…

    • Alkanarra

      I’ve always been a “Boston Rob just made his competition look like fools” apologist, but I’m definitely rethinking that perspective. If you had dropped Cirie into this group she would have won the game twice.

      • Diego Armando

        No. Chrissy would have targeted her early.

  • Maritimer

    Is this extra vote transferable?

    • Streets_Ahead

      Even if it were it almost certainly isn’t once the person owning it is voted out since idols lose their powers when the holder is voted out even if it’s left behind.

      • Maritimer

        Yeah, that was a flippant comment when Lauren was offering to give it to whoever she was offering to give it to (Ryan?), based on the GC debacle. Its definitely out of the game now

  • Taako From Teevhii

    Here we go again. GC redux.

    • the sky is falling

      I’m logging a formal complaint with this live TC foolishness

  • Marlin M.

    Lauren you fucked up

  • 18 idiots make bad episodes, but when you pare it down to 7-8 idiots, it becomes…kind of good? Am I wrong here?

    • Taako From Teevhii

      It makes it … not bad? I don’t think it’s good.

    • forever1267

      I was entertained, and not just because I have Ben in my pool.

  • Maritimer

    Lauren’s done. Ben’s playing his idol. I hate this moving around at TC stuff. These people are stupid.

  • Hornacek

    And now Chrissy is refusing to vote for Ben! This is CRAZY!!!

  • Taako From Teevhii

    Lauren actually didn’t play her advantage or her idol. So Lesson #1 is don’t tell anyone about your idols or advantages. Lesson #2 is if you got the ammo, shoot your shot.

  • Marlin M.

    SO ben is winning?

  • sharculese

    FUUUUUUCK!

  • Streets_Ahead

    YES! Thank you! Good bye Lauren.

    • sharculese

      Anything to make Reddit feel pain.

  • Hey have you guys been enjoying the last fifteen minutes? I haven’t mainly because my cable just fricking died.

    • EmAndScoutInBK

      It’s better that way.

    • Alkanarra

      I enjoy how the first comment of this thread was you talking about how bad of a week you’ve been having and how you were hoping Survivor would cheer you up. Then not only is the episode a dumpster fire, but your cable goes out? What kind of genie did you piss off, jersey?

      • Not sure. On an unrelated note would you like some antique that I need to get off my hands?

    • purplerockandy

      I at first read that as “because my cabbie just fricking died” and was all “holy shit this got dark!” And also, “why were you watching and commenting in a cab?”

      • No it was just my Grandmother who died

        • purplerockandy

          We’re back to dark.

        • Hornacek

          Is this for real or is she sitting at home right now watching Jerry Springer?

          • Real

          • Hornacek

            Sorry. 🙁

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Sorry for your loss, and hope your week manages to improve somehow.

  • Marlin M.

    Lauren that was so damn stupid. Im mad, why would you make such a stupid move?

  • Maritimer

    Remember that time Lauren found an idol like 5 hours before this TC and then gave it away when it could have saved her? Remember how that’s not going to stop r/survivor from calling her a r.obbed g.oddess for the rest of time?

    • gouis

      I now feel retroactively justified for my Lauren skepticism.

      • purplerockandy

        I regret ever giving her a chance. Lauren has spoiled it for every future player.

        • Diego Armando

          Hope if for suckers.

        • gouis

          TBH your gushing reactions last week made me very uncomfortable. Glad to have you back.

        • Diego Armando

          You know what hope is
          Hope is a bastard
          Hope is a liar, a cheat, and a thief
          If you see hope… kick its backside
          Got no place in days like these

    • Crappy

      I was rooting for her as well but this was just downright terrible play. Up there with Erik’s blunders and worse than any of JT’s. Just bizarre to the extreme, it got Mike to her side but she could have just given him any good old shell and he would have bought it.

  • Marlin M.

    If Ben wins, thats just going to cap off a terrible season for me.

    • the sky is falling

      Don’t see how he gets the votes , I think don’t worry

      • purplerockandy

        Goes up against Ryan and Chrissy.

        • the sky is falling

          Ugh, that’s right

  • gouis

    Everyone on the internet this past week:

    “It’s good they got rid of Joe! He’s unpredictable and they have their alliance locked up!”

    • sharculese

      They did have to get rid of Joe, tho. He’s useful to someone, but you can’t guarantee that someone is you.

      • gouis

        You keep up the charade one more week to get rid of Chrissy. Then you turn on Joe/Mike.

        • sharculese

          But Chrissy didn’t really do anything this episode.

          • gouis

            It’s about #s bro.

          • purplerockandy

            Chrissy vote for Ben? Everyone voted for Ben. I’m not sure what point you think you’re winning here.

          • gouis

            I don’t even know anymore. Trying to make logical justifications for what these dunderheads should do makes everyone sound like an idiot.

    • Dramus18

      Voting Joe is probably correct based on the info they had at the time…but man did it not work out. At least letting the double agent thing play out burned some of Ben’s bridges, that might help Devon or Ashley in a FTC situation against him.

  • Hornacek

    Voted out by 1 vote!!!

  • Taako From Teevhii

    At this point, I don’t think I’ll be happy with any winner. I won’t be mad with Devon, but I definitely won’t be happy.

    • the sky is falling

      mike?

      • Taako From Teevhii

        Nope, his gameplay hasn’t been good enough. His personality can’t bring him back.

        • the sky is falling

          I would be happy with Mike only because of how unlikely it is

      • sharculese

        He’s terrible at Survivor and seeing him fall ass backwards into a win would basically make this Gabon 2.0.

        • the sky is falling

          I mean after that stupid marble challenge, it’s definitely in the bottom half

        • Crappy

          Oh yes, Gabon is the perfect comparison point for this season. I can already see it being top 5 or even fav season for a lot of folks in survivor community.

    • Crappy

      I would be fine with Devon and even Ashley. Both will be lower tier ones but they have not done anything big to blow up their game so far.

      • Taako From Teevhii

        I will say that if Mike goes on an immunity tear, I suppose that he’d be equal or better than Worlds Apart Mike. But without that, he’s falling ass-backwards into a win.

        • Crappy

          I would rather anyone else left won that Mike, yes even Ryan. Even though I can see myself playing like him if I was ever to play the game, I can’t stand him being insufferable about his moves when he has not done anything right yet. He would probably take it up 100 notches if he was to win.

  • Hornacek

    Laurens extra vote wouldn’t have mattered, but I can’t believe she didn’t bring it to tribal.

    She’s probably also wishing she hadn’t given that shell to Dr. Mike.

  • Bundi

    looking forward to FTC, when the jury inevitably refuses to vote for any of the final 2/3.

  • BadPlayer91

    Someone yesterday said that this episode could be us all finding out that they aren’t actually good at Survivor after all. Whoever that is, congrats. You were right!

  • NTOS: Chrissy just CANNOT leave well enough alone. None of them are good players, but she is NOT. A. GOOD. PLAYER!!!!!

    • wonderand

      NTOS: but–hear me out–what if we vote out a woman?

    • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

      DEVON!!!

    • ….and, after much deliberation, I want her to win. And I still think she can. Don’t @ me.

  • Marlin M.

    They all suck. Horrible gameplay.

  • Marlin M.

    Especially because Lauren got told they were gunning for her and she still decided to give Mike half of the idol. dumb dumb dumb.

  • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

    “possed ny people who can play this game” It’s Survivor Ghost Island!!

  • EmAndScoutInBK

    GD FUCKING DAMMIT.

  • Alkanarra

    I love the fact that they were able to take down Ryan and Chrissy because those two were hyper arrogant, and then they turn around and are even more arrogant. They’re making Michelle look like a goddamn savant.

  • Taako From Teevhii

    Ok, so hopefully this doesn’t get buried in the usual deluge of post-episode comments, but I can’t do the video post this week like I usually do. Andy also cannot (will not?) do it. So is there anyone who’d want to try their hand at it and fill in for this week?

    • sharculese

      I’ll do it if absolutely nobody else is willing to.

      • Taako From Teevhii

        That’s the PRP spirit.

      • I might be interested if someone can show a template and how to do it.

        • Taako From Teevhii

          I have a template and how to do it (though if y’all team up, that kind of teamwork will make the dream work)

    • So, none of the FIVE (5) people who are the actual staff of the website will handle this? Flip them in 2018. #LockThemUp

      • Sylvisual

        Watching the show is as much as I can do right now! Been crazy busy with work. (AKA raising taxes on Disqus commenters.)

        • Don’t worry, with the net neutrality repeal coming soon, none of us will be able to afford coming here next year. So you’re all off the hook.

          • Taako From Teevhii

            I’m upvoting this under protest. I don’t like to think about the inevitable post-NN reality, but the joke was solid.

          • Good jokes about horrible, painful things which shouldn’t be treated humorously or even discussed is my métier of choice. You’re welcome. Buy and produce one of my scripts.

          • wonderand

            Queer culture is ^

          • God, it’s so true. Unfortunate that I wasn’t born in a time where it was more likely for me to be a unique voice/get executed.

            (cf. aforementioned métier)

          • wonderand

            Awfully optimistic about that execution thing, eh.

          • I mean, specifically executed, as opposed to, you know, just walking around outside in 2017.

          • sharculese

            We also call that Jewish culture.

      • purplerockandy

        TBF, when Taako brought it up, I didn’t offer and didn’t actually ask the staff. So they didn’t say no.

        Also… they totally would’ve said no.

        • Purple Rock Emma

          It’s true! I do think I’ll actually write a blog this week though.

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      I don’t think I could do it. Especially from my phone. It was hard enough writing the most amazing Fan Friction article on this thing.

      • Alkanarra

        Wait, you’re Sad Lil?

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          And I would have gotten away with it if it wasn’t for you meddling Alkanarras!

      • Taako From Teevhii

        Could you even be trusted to include a non-Ryan confessional?

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          I would just post a clip of me gloating about how I’m gonna win Outcasts League.

      • Hornacek

        You should have said you would be too busy attending the National Bellhop Convention in Sarasota.

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          Like we would hold a convention right in the middle of the holiday season!

          • Hornacek

            I thought bellhops never took any holidays – they work 365 days a year.

    • purplerockandy

      Will not. As in “will not watch any more of these fuckwits than I absolutely have to”.

    • Purple Rock Emma

      Oh absolutely not.

    • purplerockandy

      You give a guy a thanks on the podcast and he immediately big times you. Nice. Real nice.

      • Taako From Teevhii

        Look Andy, I fell they this time, but those trombones are on their way, and this podcast is gonna have a genuine, bonafide marching band!

  • wonderand

    The thing that frustrates me most, maybe, is that if Lauren had kept her idol and kept it a secret and played it, we could’ve ended up in a “no votes count” tribal where no one brought a Plan C.

    • sharculese

      The thing is, that would require these people to not suck.

    • Maritimer

      See, that would be an okay use of a live tribal, them negotiating a plan then and there. I feel like the result would have be Chrissy but who knows

    • It would be Chrssy because she is the player people like the least in the game.

    • I worry Devon would have gone home in that case. Ben, Ashley and Lauren would all have been immune, so he’d have been the only target on that side. It would have come down to which way Ben voted.

  • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

    Also… A FRICKING IDOL AT 7!!!!!
    AND IT’S ON THE FRICKING GROUND!!!!

    • gouis

      Yeah just terribly ‘hidden’

    • sharculese

      No, it’s in the fire.

    • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

      She has three tribals to use it!

    • Well at least next week there will only be one idol in the game to find.

      • Alycia Swift

        We think.

    • Hornacek

      Ok Judd.

  • Mike Hirsch

    Oh god, this episode was like one long facepalm.

    • the sky is falling

      And I really thought the marble challenge would be the dumbest thing we would see

    • Now we know why Probst is literally begging viewers to apply.

      • Taako From Teevhii

        If they didn’t cast doofuses like JP, they might actually fill out a cast with good players.

        • Come on, you have to give me 3 hot guys. The issue is the other 15.

          • Maritimer

            They could be hot AND good at Survivor like Malcolm or Jay though

          • Meh, I don’t find either of those guys hot. I’m actually kind of hard-pressed to find one who covers both bases. Jeremy Collins, I guess, is the closest.

          • Maritimer

            Jay may be my hottest Survivor ever. Jeremy is up there but yeah, its a surprisingly short list. Like they only recently discovered guys can be hot AND good at Survivor. And I think Jay may have been an accident. He was supposed to be hot but not necessarily good

          • Taako From Teevhii

            Jay Starrett, Jay Byers, or two things?

          • It has to be the Michaela-ruining Jay. He isn’t my type. Even when I was young, he wasn’t my type. I’ve always been basic.

          • Maritimer

            Starrett. I’m not sure Byers qualifies as good at Survivor, but he is way up the hot list.

          • Alycia Swift

            Earl. Tom Westman. Ethan.

          • Definitely Tom and Ethan, but that was so so so long ago that I don’t trust myself.

          • Taako From Teevhii

            Cole, Devon, … Patrick. All three hotter and better players than JP.

          • I mean, they’re all barely clearing that second bar.

          • Taako From Teevhii

            I consider “Willing to do something and does it badly” to be more commendable than “Never does anything ever and therefore doesn’t fuck it up.”

          • For a minute there I couldn’t figure out if you were talking about Survivor or you weekend plans.

          • Diego Armando

            Repeat it with me everyone: It can be two things.

          • You guys overestimate me so wildly, and I love you for it.

          • forever1267

            Why can’t it be both?

        • the sky is falling

          You can throw this whole cast in the goddam toilet. for me, this season is the worst ever. at least Gabon had Randy

        • forever1267

          uh, “Abs”, Like, hello? I thought I explained this already, like! #SoSoShallow

      • sharculese

        We need exciting Survivor fans like Dan Foley to really bring the heat next season!

        • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

          Maybe I can get in

          • The show is sorely lacking in werewolf representation.

      • Mike Hirsch

        I feel like I’ve taken for granted that each season is going to have a clutch of decent players who are able to play the game well. Not so!

      • Ms. Sweaterfan

        If they really are hurting for worthwhile applicants, it explains so much – why they had two all returnee seasons so close together, how dumb everyone is this season, how JP ever got through casting… I’m worried, guys.

        • Taako From Teevhii

          It also explains Redmond’s tweet. They’re really ratcheting up their standards for the cast.

        • So wait is now my chance after all these years? Oh, I’m not dumb! I could do this. *looks up application*

        • Remember that supposedly MvGX had a really hard time casting women, especially WOC, and look what happened there. I guess MvGX was the start of this new age of concerned casting.

          • Hornacek

            “Concerned Casting” sounds like it should be the name of a band.

    • BadPlayer91

      It reminded me TOO FUCKING MUCH of the awful F6 tribal in Nicaragua. Where everyone said everything out loud, and no one had any secrets, and still no one did anything.

      • Purplerockmatt

        god that tribal was the fucking worst

        • Mike Hirsch

          Is that the one where Benjen goes home?

          • Purplerockmatt

            No it is the one where Eddard dies

        • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

          But Fabio is such a underated winner! #survivorreddit

          • Isaa

            I prefer /r/Survivor to reading the comments here.

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            oh snap #deathtoIsaa #deathtoSNP

          • Isaa

            I mean I just feel like they’re better at seeing the good in any season.

          • sharculese

            We’re just funnier than Reddit.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            We also don’t feel the need to pretend a season is good in order to exert our superiority. We maintain our superiority complexes the natural way: through smug and petty comments about other people!

          • gouis

            I am all here for this.

          • Diego Armando

            And by being perfect.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            I don’t even own a reddit!

          • gouis

            Old guy confirmed.

          • gouis

            OK Ryan

          • Kemper Boyd

            Cool, no one is forcing you to read this.

          • Isaa

            I just wanted to take a look at other communities, not expecting them to be so angry and toxic.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Babes, if you think this is angry and toxic then I’m very happy for how easy your life has been. I hope you never discover what those words really mean.

          • Isaa

            (not to mention conceited and condescending, seeing the replies)

          • Kemper Boyd

            It’s a real skill to be as right as we all are, even when disagreeing with each other but we manage

          • I think you’re wildly misinterpreting the replies. I put your “I like r/Survivor better” comment as a featured comment because I think it’s funny when people make fun of us. I’m not sure why you deleted it, but I’m guessing it’s because you thought I was singling you out or mocking you in some way. I assure you I wasn’t.

            I make fun of r/Survivor all the time, both because they actually suck sometimes and because they have some tendencies that are easy to make fun of: their dismissal of large segments of the fandom by calling them “casuals” and thus disregarding their opinions, their hatred of “big moves” that are actually just moves that make sense if you’re trying to win a game (and make for better TV), and their hipster fandom of early boot players that nobody really cares about.

            Our site embraces people with differing opinions, as long as they aren’t dicks about it. We playfully fight with our listeners/commenters all the time about how they overrate San Juan del Sur. Everyone generally understands that it’s just a TV show, and someone else disliking a season doesn’t mean you have to dislike it.

            And yes, a lot of us dislike this season. I haven’t yet found a forum that only engages in positive praise of Survivor, but that’s because I’m not looking for that. I enjoy discussing the show’s greatness and its flaws.

          • Isaa

            I hope I am. It just seems very hostile from the perspective of an outsider looking in. I’ve never seen /r/Survivor dismiss or hate “big moves”, more just mocking the massive emphasis Probst likes to put on them above all else. I’m sorry for everything that’s been stirred up from my comment. I deleted it because I don’t like making waves like that; it just further fuels my own mental issues. Also if you don’t have a James Miller altar at your home you’re not a real Survivor fan tbh.

          • I don’t know if you were on r/Survivor during Game Changers, but they were pretty vocal in their hatred of Zeke and his embracing of big moves. They even started a campaign to send Varner videos of support to help him feel better after the episode where he’d publicly outed Zeke.

            Your comment didn’t stir anything up. It was funny. Kemper probably responded too harshly, but Kemper can be a dick sometimes (a dick that I love…gotta be a better way to say that).

            If you’re going to stick around here- and you’re very welcome to do so- just accept that we mock each other constantly, with the understanding that it’s all bullshit because we’re just discussing a show we all enjoy. (That last sentence of yours is a good example of the kind of stuff that tends to go over well here.)

          • Isaa

            I started posting there shortly after Game Changers, and anything referring to Varner after the season has been overwhelmingly negative (I assume that trying to profit off of it with a book tipped the scales and removed any and all sympathy). I can’t speak on the Zeke hate because I admittedly haven’t seen him play yet; I’m on Season 20 of my marathon (though I’ve also seen – and enjoyed – 21).

          • Isaa

            I think the biggest difference is that /r/Survivor prefers to value the contestants as characters rather than as players, though they still analyze gameplay and moves a lot.

          • DrVanNostrand

            That’s fine. You’re welcome to come back and give us another chance when you turn 16.

          • Isaa

            Edgy

    • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

      My face hurts

      • Alycia Swift

        So more like face slaps then.

    • Kemper Boyd

      At least lauren knows she was fucking moron

      • Lauren’s reaction was giving me some President Sarah vibes.

    • Crappy

      Yeap, this cast has to be one of the worst group of survivor players in terms of actual game skill. Devon, legit, is probably the best player out there. Ashely is fine too as in no real black mark against her. I was defending Chrissy some weeks back but she is pretty poor player as well and Ben blew up his game Mike style this episode.

      • Mike Hirsch

        I feel almost like, although Ben absolutely made some terrible choices…that it’s all going to, like, work out for him? Like that he’ll come out of this episode largely unscathed, and he ABSOLUTELY SHOULDN’T AND I’M ALREADY ANGRY ABOUT IT.

        • Crappy

          Ben is at the bottom now though. Ideally only way he reached end is by wining out or another idol. But you never know with these people, they already hinted in the NTOS that some other plan may crop up.

  • By The Numbers

    “But why?” is all I have to say after that. This whole episode was people doing things for no reason. Ugh

  • BadPlayer91

    This was like the less-good, awful strategy version of Game Changers’ “live tribal”

  • Sylvisual

    Probst: “We like to cast fans!”
    *twelve hours in*
    “Ok maybe not all fans are made equally. SOMEONE PLEASE APPLY!”

    • Taako From Teevhii

      Do we know who of this cast was a recruit besides Cole and probably Alan?

      • Sylvisual

        Desi, probably.

        • Desi, actually.

          • sharculese

            Desk, Actually: the sequel to Love, Actually where you mostly just see the cast in the background of scenes where other people are talking.

          • Sylvisual

            No, Desk Actually is the sequel to “It’s just a fucking stick”: The journey of a piece of wood through reality television.

          • Mike Hirsch

            With songs by Harry Nilsson.

        • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

          Probably Patrick? I don’t follow casting rumors

      • Streets_Ahead

        She wasn’t a recruit but it didn’t exactly sound like Lauren is a fan.

    • sharculese

      “We need fans like Dan Foley and Artis, not recruits like Earl and Parvati.”

      The whole recruit vs. fan thing has always been contrived, and I wouldn’t be shocked if Jeff buys into it, but I’m sure casting doesn’t.

      • Max_Jets

        WHAT THE HELL DID ARTIS DO TO YOU AND DID YOU EDIT SURVIVOR PHILIPPINES

        • DrVanNostrand

          Artis did nothing…. which is exactly the problem.

    • the sky is falling

      Even this late in its run, I’m sure 5-10,000 apply every season. fire casting dept.

      • Sylvisual

        Somehow I read this as “cast fire dept” and was like “JEREMY ALREADY WON”.

        • sharculese

          Also Tom Westman.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            BOOOO!!!

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            YAAAAAAY!

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            BOOOO!!!

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            YAAAAAAAY!!!

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            Tom westman Foreevah!!

          • Hornacek

            Wiggum Never!!

          • Alycia Swift

            And Keith Nale though he was more of comic relief.

            They need to cast a female firefighter.

          • Wasn’t one of the Redemption Island players a female firefighter?

        • Also, JP.

  • EmAndScoutInBK

    Mike – bad player or worst player?

    • sharculese

      Bad player. There are worse players. Drew Christie still exists.

      • EmAndScoutInBK

        Valid.

        • sharculese

          I owe you an e-mail and I promise I’m going to do that in the next few days.

      • BadPlayer91

        People keep saying Bad Player and it confuses me at first…

    • Sylvisual

      Colton quit twice.

      • EmAndScoutInBK

        Valid.

      • danomite10

        He didn’t quit the first time.

        • StormofCuteness

          Yes, he did. He faked his illness, right?

          • Prom King

            Nope. Probst just pretended he did when he quit during his second season. It was a dick move by Probst but it was Colton so I shrugged it off. That pain was real.

          • StormofCuteness

            Whoa, I totally believed Probst. How do we know though? I wouldn’t trust a word Colton said.

          • Hornacek

            Probst said during BvW when Colton was quitting “So you’re quitting again like last time?” and Colton never corrected him. As far as I’m concerned, Colton quit both times.

            I think Colton admitted later (or maybe just after OW) that it wasn’t his appendix that took him out of the game, just stomach pains. It’s been heavily suggested that Colton saw the writing on the wall and knew that he wouldn’t going to do well, and he used those pains as an excuse to leave the game instead of being voted out.

          • StormofCuteness

            Yes, this is exactly what I thought had happened.

          • Hornacek

            Don’t worry, the truth is still on our side.

          • Prom King

            Uh no. It ended up being a bacterial infection, not appendicitis – which I just found out from a quick Google search. That can still cause acute pain, and did. The doctor called on the scene insisted that he be medically evacuated when his heart rate doubled after being touched by her – and numbskull Probst was there when that occurred.

            This is all quite fresh to me because I rewatched the season recently (don’t ask me why) and that scene stood out because it is a part of my job to work with people who are dealing with a lot of physical pain.

            And there was no “writing on the wall” – Colton at that point was fully in charge of one tribe. He was the only threat to Kim’s dominance that season, and as awful as he was, his departure contributed to the season being so boring (after being so offensive).

            Don’t be a Probst, Horny! Colton was despicable in that season but there’s no need to re-imagine what occurred as something that was so Colton to do. He’s despicable either way.

          • Hornacek

            Sorry, but Probst said during BvW that Colton quit during OW. It has been stated that Colton didn’t have appendicitis and he knew it, and that he used it as an excuse to leave the show under his own terms because he was not in control of the game and wanted to leave on his own terms. Colton may have been in charge of his swap tribe, but they were being decimated by the other tribe – he knew he was not going to be successful after the tribes merged. Sorry, but Colton quit both times – facts are facts.

          • Prom King

            Uh no. My point is that Probst was lying or mistaken. Rewatch the episode if you need to, but the doctor called on the scene insisted that he be medically evacuated when his heart rate doubled after being touched by her – and numbskull Probst was there when that occurred. Sorry, but Colton only quit once –
            facts are facts.

          • Hornacek

            If Probst was lying or mistaken when he said during BvW that Colton had quit during OW then they never would have aired it – they would have cut that line out. Plus Probst said it to Colton and Colton didn’t deny it – he agreed with Probst.

            Colton was hurting when he was medevac’d but he was faking that it was appendicitis. As has been said since that season (and since BvW), Colton realized that he wasn’t going to have the control of the game that he wanted to, so he was engineering his own departure from the game so he wouldn’t get voted out. If this was his only season, then maybe I’d believe him. But we saw him do a very similar thing in BvW! No one on his tribe was putting up with his shenanigans, and he knew he was going to get voted out, so he quit. Once is a a coincidence – twice is a pattern.

            Sorry, but facts are facts – Colton quit twice.

          • Prom King

            Uh no. Do you really think that a television show would never air a lie or mistake and then just gloss over it? Because that’s hilarious. So do you also think that they would tell Probst to pause after he lied or made his mistake so they could go and check the tapes? And after realizing he lied or made a mistake, that they would then come back and tell Colton to quit again and Probst to react again – but this time without lying or making a mistake? Because that’s also hilarious. That was a live moment, there’s no going back for a re-do despite Probst’s stupidity.

            And hey, Colton actually did deny it, right after Probst lied or made his mistake, by saying that he ended up being treated for a bacterial infection. The idea that you think that Colton agreed with Probst is, again, hilarious and so easily proven wrong, if you only checked the tape yourself before posting.

            And hey, Colton wasn’t “faking appendicitis” – he was told by Tarzan (incorrectly) that it sounded like he had appendicitis. The doctor called on the scene also thought that’s what it may have been – but whether it was or wasn’t, she had to have his pain checked out. She was mainly concerned that his heart rate doubled after being touched by her (a scene in which numbskull Probst was actually present) and it was her call that Colton be removed. Again, if you only checked the tape before posting, you’d know all this.

            During the episode where the doctor called on the scene insisted that Colton be medically evacuated, Colton had 4 soldiers on his tribe (Jonas, Leif, Tarzan, and new addition Alicia) and appeared to have some sway with Christina. He also had Troyzan on the other tribe. Kim had 4 soldiers (Sabrina, Chelsea, Kat, and new addition Jay). Who knows where Michael was. There’s no way Colton was being voted out anytime soon. The very idea is hilarious.

            Sorry, but facts are facts – Colton only quit once. You should really check the tapes before going on about this. But you’re like a dog with a bone sometimes – even when the bone in question is actually a make believe toy rather than an actual bone – so I expect to be reading a response from you shortly!

          • Hornacek

            The show chooses what to show, they air scenes out of order, they choose the narratives, but they would not have Jeff, the host, executive producer, the show runner, say on the show that a player quit the game in their previous appearance, knowing that is a lie, and keep it in the show. That’s just crazy. When Jeff said that in BvW, that is what Jeff and the show believed.

            Also, Colton never disagreed when Jeff said this. You would think that if Colton had not quit the game in OW that he would have said “Hey Jeff, I didn’t quit last time!” But he didn’t. He agreed with Jeff.

            And if you’re saying that he was emotional at the time and was only thinking about wanting to be with Caleb (since he left his tribe and went over and hugged Caleb), you would have to convince me that Colton loved something/one more than he loved Survivor, and I don’t believe that. He was playing the game when he quit OW and he was playing the game when he quit BvW. Both time he realized he was not going to control the game as he had planned and knew that he would be voted out, and both times he decided to take matters into his own hands and quit so that wouldn’t happen.

            Did I say that Colton was faking his pain in OW? It sounds like you’re saying that I said that, but I’m pretty sure I didn’t. Let me check … yep, I never said that. I said he was faking his appendicitis. Jeff has said that Colton didn’t appendicitis, that he used his other pain to pretend it was his appendix and quit the game.

            Colton’s swap tribe and Kim’s swap tribe did have the same number of players. But Colton’s tribe was, as he said, the misfits. They were losing challenges, and were likely to lost most, if not all, of the challenges before the merge, resulting in either Colton being voted out, or his swap tribe being so down in the numbers at the merge that he would be voted out soon after the merge. So the idea that Colton was not going to be voted out soon, either pre-merge or right after the merge, is ridiculous and hilarious.

            Now, who is more trustworthy about whether a player quit – Jeff, who has been the show for 35 seasons (and while he stretches the truth/lies when promoting the show, is also fiercely protective about the integrity of the show), or Colton, a player who we know is racist, classist, a narcissist, and we definitively saw quit the show once. Plus we have Jeff, someone who was there both times, say on the show that Colton quit both times. This is eyewitness testimony, plus evidence we the viewers have seen themselves.

            Sorry, but facts are facts. Colton quit in BvW, and he used hi stomach pain to fake a more serious medical condition to quit the game because he knew he did not have the control in the game that he wanted and knew he would be voted out, and his ego would not allow that.

            It’s funny that you’re calling me a dog with a bone, when I could easily make the same claim about you. There is actual evidence and expert testimony to back up my claim, but you refuse to accept it. So I just as much expect a response from you shortly too.

          • Prom King

            Uh no. You clearly haven’t checked the tapes yet because you are making the same incorrect points. And a lot of your points seem to be coming from the idea that since Colton is loathsome (agree) then every negative thing you say about him must be true. *Shrug* Anyway, I’ve made my points, repeatedly, so there’s no need for me to make the same points a 3rd or a 4th time because I’m not here to change incorrect perspectives. But still, facts are facts: Colton only quit once.

          • Hornacek

            Sorry, but Probst said on the show that Colton quit the show twice. If that didn’t happen, the show wouldn’t have aired him saying that – for all of Probst’s faults about exaggerating when promoting the show, he would not lie on the show to a player, and the show would not air it if it wasn’t true. Hard to argue with the host/show-runner definitively stating something on the show and it not being refuted by that person on the show (but you have tried).

            Even if I ignore my personal opinion of Colton’s character, he quit in his other appearance. This is like someone saying “I didn’t kill this person” even know they admitted they did on TV, and we know they killed someone else at a different time. Why should I believe them when I know they did it before?

            This reminds me of a debate I had on RHAP with a regular commenter where I said that Dreamz stole the truck from Yau-Man, and they said that it was a gift and he didn’t steal it. It didn’t matter to them that I explained that the show said more than once that Dreamz stole the truck (I even explained to them the textbook definition of a verbal contract). Jeff said it on the show. Jeff said it many times after that season. Rob has said on the podcast more than once. But this commenter just ignored all of the evidence and was so sure they were right.

          • Prom King

            Uh no. You clearly haven’t checked the tapes yet because you are making the same incorrect points. Anyway, I’ve made my points, repeatedly, so there’s no need for me to make the same points a 3rd or a 4th time because I’m not here to change incorrect perspectives. But still, facts are facts: Colton only quit once.

            You are also quite wrong about Dreamz and the truck, which is both hilarious and unsurprising. Apparently yet another example of Jeff lying or being mistaken! I’m sure there are numerous examples because the man is a deluded tool. Anyway, not holding up your end of the bargain does not equal stealing. It equals lying. Yau-Man (and everyone else) planned on giving Dreamz the truck, so in many ways it was a gift with conditions. Who puts conditions on a gift? A sneaky, wonderful Top Three character like Yau-Man, of course! He really channeled his inner villain for that bit. I remember reading the outraged reactions from hordes of mainly white people who felt like this was symbolic of what was wrong with inner city black kids, while the people that I knew understood what went on during that deal. Namely, that Yau put conditions on a gift that even Yau himself would probably not have honored. Facts are facts: Dreamz did not steal a truck from Yau-Man

            But by all means, do continue living in your fantasy world. It’s a hilarious world to read about (although a rather depressing one too because oh the humanity – and it is certainly the world we are living in under Dump, so there’s that unpleasant resonance). Since the knee-jerk masses who react blindly and predictably to everything they are told to react to, who buy Probst’s garbage hook line and sinker, and who are basically apologists for Probst (and I guess Rob too?) also all live there… you certainly won’t be lonely there.

          • Hornacek

            It’s funny that you start off by saying that I haven’t checked the tapes, because the only proof that’s necessary is right there on the tape where Jeff says to Colton in BvW that he is quitting for the second time, that he quit during OW, and Colton agrees with him. It’s right there in the show. You can’t argue with that (although you certainly have).

            OMG, you also don’t think that Dreamz stole the truck! Oh, now I don’t feel that bad about this exchange. If you happen to be incorrect about something this basic in Survivor, it’s no wonder that that you also get Colton not quitting twice wrong too. This just changed from a little frustrating to enjoyable.

          • Prom King

            Uh no. LOL you obviously still haven’t checked the tape! What’s wrong with you? The proof is there Horny, stop parroting things and do the actual research. And I don’t mean the YouTube version (which interestingly cuts out Colton’s pushback to Probst about quitting twice), but the actual show that aired. My God, all the words you could have saved if you just checked it out, because it’s right there during the episode. Same goes for the One World episode when the doctor literally tells Probst she is taking Colton out of the game and Colton literally says he doesn’t want to go.

            Yes of course I know that Dreamz didn’t steal a truck because I don’t truck in carefully constructed delusions of the sort that you and Probst apparently enjoy. I don’t automatically swallow what is being spoonfed to me by editors who want to create a controversial narrative and Probst who wants to create a villain for his audience to root against.

            I’m sorry that this exchange was ever frustrating to you. Although I’m always faintly annoyed by delusional people, they are also often amusing to me in an oh humanity sort of way (which is how I’ve retained my sanity during life under Dump)… so I’ve been enjoying this exchange ever since you first stuck your head into my response to Storm. Perhaps I just watch too much CNN, because at this point your responses illustrate pretty familiar behavior – complete with false narratives, a person who is insisting something is true simply because he says it is and who has a lot of deluded people who agree with him, despite actual evidence to the contrary. People who are consistently wrong are often consistently funny. You are a funny guy!

          • Hornacek

            It’s hilarious that you keep using the phrase “check the tape” (aside: it’s the 21st century, what’s a tape?) when that action actually invalidates your argument. If you had watched the actual season when it aired, you would have seen Jeff say to Colton “You’re quitting, just like you quit last time?” and Colton replied “Yes.” It’s right there in the episode. Please don’t just watch mini-clips online to form your narrative- go and watch the actual season on DVD or Hulu or CBS All Access or something. Your confusion could have been cleared up long ago.

            It’s funny that you think you know more about what happened with Colton on OW than Jeff, who (a) was there, and (b) witnessed all the behind the scenes action that none of us saw. Yes, I’ll take your word over an eyewitness who has much more information, oh my sides are hurting from laughing.

            Ditto for Dreamz stealing a truck in Fiji. Jeff said he stole it. The show says it. Even Rob C, the nicest and least confrontational Survivor podcaster, agrees that Dreamz stole the truck. Again, am I supposed to believe some random guy on the internet, or (a) the host who witnessed it, and (b) a former player who podcasts about the show so much he formed his own podcasting network? No contest.

            Also, I can’t tell if all of your random asides and non sequiturs are you trying to be funny or antagonistic. Sorry to say, it’s not working for either. Keep reaching for that rainbow!

          • Prom King

            Uh no. Check the tapes, genius. I watched actual episodes when they aired (duh) and a second time through CBS all access. And I don’t just buy what Probst tells me because Probst is biased and his perspective is subjective, like many, and I don’t actively try to be a fool, like few. But hey, you do you, I can’t stop you. Keep drinkin’ that kool aid.

            Sure, I’ve been a wee bit antagonistic because you’ve been an annoying dog with a bone on this topic, as you are whenever you get your grip on such bones, with me and so many others. It can be annoying af. But I take measures by amusing myself because why get truly angry over trifling shit. Gotta stay sane somehow!

            Anyway, facts are facts: Colton only quit once and Dreamz didn’t steal no truck. Check the tapes, double rainbow!

          • (double post, for fairness sake)

            Please, both of you, stop this now. I’m subscribed to comments so this entire stupid argument keeps getting emailed to me, and I really don’t care which of you is right – you’re both coming off badly. This shit belongs on RHaP.

          • Prom King

            You’re right, will do. Didn’t really take into consideration that this definitely stupid argument is getting group emailed with every post. Sorry! Embarrassing.

          • Please, both of you, stop this now. I’m subscribed to comments so this entire stupid argument keeps getting emailed to me, and I really don’t care which of you is right – you’re both coming off badly. This shit belongs on RHaP.

          • Hornacek

            Reya, I’m sorry, I didn’t know you were getting notifications for all of these replies. Your frustration is completely justified. All I can say in my defense is that I don’t like bullies.

            @disqus_LuoWO0onmu:disqus , let’s just agree that one of us is right and we’re never going to convince the other one that they’re wrong. If you still want to continue this, create a new thread and @ me so we don’t bother Reya.

          • Prom King

            Just posted below in reply to Hornacek.

    • the sky is falling

      Not worst, that’s overstating. naonka exists

      • EmAndScoutInBK

        She may have strategically been better actually – she was in the majority.

        • the sky is falling

          If you wanna defend naonka, that’s all you. She was a horrible person

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            I didn’t say as a person. That’s different.

          • Oh boy. Is bringing up Na’onka the Survivor version of Godwin’s Law?

          • Mike Hirsch

            …the guy from Cocktail?

          • Mike Hirsch

            Wait, no! That was Coughlin. Coughlin’s Law!

          • sharculese

            Godwin’s Law states that, as an internet argument continues, the probability that one party in the argument will compare the other to Hitler approaches 1.

          • I thought it was comparing anything in the discussion to Hitler/The Holocaust, since rational people would obviously avoid that comparison, because nothing could compare.

            Speaking of which, Trump is trying to overturn Godwin’s Law.

          • sharculese

            That’s the end result of Godwin’s Law, but what I wrote above is the proposition Godwin actually made.

            The original quote: “As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Hitler approaches 1.”

          • Oh, I thought Godwin was a fictional figurehead, like Mr. Peanut.

          • the sky is falling

            The end result of Trump is Mueller’s law, hopefully.

          • Purplerockmatt

            Mr. Peanut is real man

          • Monocle Power!

          • sharculese

            Mike Godwin. He was an early Usenet poster.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Nerd.

          • sharculese

            I comment on lefty law blogs, which means I comment with people who are old enough to have fond memories of Usenet.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            I stand by what I said.

          • sharculese

            I said I comment on lefty law blogs. That’s not a refutation of the accusation that I’m a nerd, it’s a confirmation.

          • DrVanNostrand

            In fairness, Naonka is virtually indistinguishable from Hitler.

        • Max_Jets

          She was even pretty well liked by her cast and had a good chance of winning. I might even say that she’s more entertaining. Ya know what? Naonka>Dr. Mike in several ways THAT’S WHERE WE ARE WITH THIS SEASON

    • Mike Hirsch

      What about the woman who did slam poetry before her Redemption Island duel?
      I suppose we should clarify what level of bad you’re looking for.

      • EmAndScoutInBK

        Unclear, not around long enough.

        • Mike Hirsch

          Good point.

      • Prom King

        I’m somehow happy and sad that you reminded me of her just now. And I still can’t remember her name. Also there’s no need to tell me.

      • Hornacek

        Semhar?

    • the sky is falling

      Mike not even in top 20 of worst players.

      • EmAndScoutInBK

        Debatable.

    • gouis

      I mean Lauren just gave him her idol piece and then was voted out immediately. It’s Reichenhacian.

      • EmAndScoutInBK

        Her move was only bad because HES SUCH A BAD PLAYER

        • gouis

          Not really? It was bad no matter what.

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Oh we fundamentally disagree on this.

          • gouis

            Giving up her idol to Mike is a good move, especially when she doesn’t bring her advantage and just blindside him last episode?

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Her advantage was irrelevant to this tribal. She gave him the idol to secure his vote. If he wasn’t a fucking moron and didn’t burn it because he’s an idiotic player ( it was already powerless!), she doesn’t go home. And no, it wasn’t because he was trying to send her home – he voted for Ben.

          • gouis

            I am a little confused why you’re so fired up about this being Mike’s fault. Lauren also sucks at Survivor pretty clearly.

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Disagree.

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            She made a bad move by giving half her idol to a bad player. Otherwise, her moves till now had been pretty good. But no, she didn’t anticipate just how bad mike is and that he would burn the idol before seeing if Ben had one. Because that’s a stupid thing to do.

          • wonderand

            Having to guess-anticipate bad logic is so much harder than anticipating sound logic. What an exhausting season for everyone remotely rational.

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            This is my point

          • wonderand

            (I agree with you, if that wasn’t clear!)

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            It was – you made my point better than I did

          • Every 6 months, America gets the Survivor season it deserves.

          • sharculese

            That’s unfair. Sometimes it’s like 2 and half months.

          • Violina23

            So, in other words, it’s punishment for the election?

          • gouis

            I don’t think Mike was 100% in on voting for Ben before the decision was made. There was no reason to trust him once you have the idol. Just play it and Ben goes home anyway.

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            But why? Why didn’t he know who he was going to vote for? He knew who the two targets were going in, and they had a majority with or without Chrissy and Ryan. He shouldn’t have hadn’t to be making a decision at tribal. And again, BURN IT AFTER THE FREAKING VOTE.

          • gouis

            So let’s take your postulate that Mike is the worst player ever. Then giving him part of your idol has to be one of the dumbest moves ever given how terrible and unpredictable he is.

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Not that he’s the worst ever. That was hyperbole. She made a bad move that i somewhat understand in trying to lock up his vote. She did not understand how bad he was. But again, her move’s badness is predicated on how bad he is

          • Prom King

            Yep. Terrible move by Lauren. Just as terrible was Mike wanting to put on a show and burn not just a potential advantage but a potential ally. He didn’t even get out who he wanted to get out. Ugh Mike.

          • DrVanNostrand

            I’m curious what would’ve happened if he didn’t burn it, Lauren got voted out, and the leather string thing was left at camp. Could he go into Lauren’s bag and make the complete idol? It’s a stretch of a hypothetical, but there isn’t much else to say about this episode.

          • Prom King

            What, there’s a lot to say! Well there’s a lot to react to, maybe not a lot of what ifs to contemplate. Because everyone pretty much enacted every what if scenario possible.

            I think he wouldn’t be able to do anything with it because the person who finds the idol has to actually give up possession of an idol for someone else to use it. Can’t be taken or stolen.

          • DrVanNostrand

            Does half of an idol that actually has no value count as an idol? (You’re probably right though)

          • Prom King

            My magic 8ball says that half an idol only cancels half of the votes.

          • purplerockandy

            But why does Mike give a shit if Ben or Lauren goes home? He obviously had a preference, but it’s completely win/win for him.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            I don’t think Mike particularly cared whether Lauren or Ben went home, so Ben having an idol wasn’t a big deal for him.

          • Streets_Ahead

            But if she played her idol then Mike might be drawing rocks or something. I’m not saying Mike is a good player but Lauren having an idol is at best not really helpful for him and at worst it gets him sent home which with these few players left would be a real danger.

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            They only draw rocks if they run out of people to vote for. There were plenty of people left to vote for

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            The vote just switches to Chrissy

          • Purple Rock Emma

            I mean, he can’t guarantee that. It seems most likely, but I’d rather have someone I was considering voting for anyway go home than risk a live tribal with no previously discussed target.

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            chrissy was the original target before bens name was thrown out, so it’s not as though no names at been thrown out already

          • the sky is falling

            Whether pr not Mike is a good player, Lauren is by no means one of the top 30 best players

          • Taako From Teevhii

            Who said she was?

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Oh, and it DID help secure his vote.

          • the sky is falling

            Yes, it’s a fundamental difference. Because to me anyone in the final 6, can’t be a bad player

          • Taako From Teevhii

            Special Agent–wait a second.

          • the sky is falling

            You don’t disparage the specialist to me, I won’t hear it!

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Well that’s just not true to me

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Philip, Mike, Mick, Jan, etc

          • the sky is falling

            Phillip was not a bad player

          • Upvoted for either peak trolling or peak delusion or both.

          • the sky is falling

            It’s not trolling, my position is that Phillips strategy was deliberate, I wrote a thing. em is just mad that player she liked was blindsided and taking it out on Mike. I love em, but we are on disagreement here.

          • Taako From Teevhii

            Not trolling. So delusion then.

            (also, this is me trolling)

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            We try not to troll people on this site.

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            we do a very bad job of it

          • Taako From Teevhii

            I will believe this when I realize that I haven’t heard about a migrant German shepherd in six months.

          • sharculese

            But German shepherds are so basic!

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            That was all @hornacek:disqus’s fault.

          • the sky is falling

            The only canon dog shows are Lassie and Benji

          • Taako From Teevhii

            What disrespect to Clifford.

          • the sky is falling

            He’s a cartoon

          • Taako From Teevhii

            He’s also a dog.

            And Special Agent Phillip is a cartoon of a human being.

          • the sky is falling

            That’s why I like him. although, sure tthis season is way better than one with Phillip /s

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            You’d give him some of the crispy!

          • sharculese

            Nobody thinks of the television series when they think of Benji.

          • the sky is falling

            Dangit!

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            They think of Oh Heavenly Dog.

          • Hornacek

            Oh, for the love of Benji!

          • Hornacek

            There’s a voice …

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            …that doesn’t need to be heard.

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            Fan Friction baby

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            No. I think he genuinely bad,

          • the sky is falling

            It’s a valid opinion, just not mine. so be it

          • Hornacek
          • Prom King

            Only if Phillip’s strategy was to never win under any circumstances.

            I suddenly have just realized a connection between Russell and Phillip’s strategies!

          • the sky is falling

            Woot, it’s all clear now, that’s my personal life strategy, no wonder I identify with them.

          • DrVanNostrand

            If it was a deliberate strategy, it was a dumb one, because it is a strategy that can’t possibly win. Unless his strategy was just to extend his fifteen minutes of fame and get invited back to another season that he also couldn’t possibly win. If that was the strategy, I guess it was a success, but that’s not *my* definition of success.

          • the sky is falling

            Agreed again, it was a dumb strategy, but I enjoyed Phillip a lot more than most of this cast until the last 2 weeks

          • DrVanNostrand

            I definitely don’t like Philip as much as you, but as long as you’re not arguing his strategy is a solid winning strategy, I’ll chalk it up to “Different strokes for different folks.”

          • the sky is falling

            Oh, yeah, I’m delusional, but not so much to think that it was a good strategy. Just personally enjoy wacky players. Have a feeling Shepphard wasn’t the first player who was playing for second or third place.

          • DrVanNostrand

            It can be two things!

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Lol wut

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            Jenna, Vescepia, Fabio, Natalie White, Ethan….

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            I’m confused by this comment? Are you suggesting they are bad players? With the suggestion of bob, I think you’re wrong on them.

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            oh yeah. Ethans a stretch Ill admit

          • DrVanNostrand

            All of those people (except Bob) would be top contenders on this season.

          • Prom King

            None of those players are bad players, especially V and Ethan. They are just far from the best winners.

          • Max_Jets

            Bob, Susie, Sugar, Matty, Kenny, Crystal

          • the sky is falling

            My point is that they made it to final 6 so did something right. much like how there is no undeserving winner…. Except for Michelle

          • Max_Jets

            I know, I could probably defend a couple of the players I listed too. Michele though? She’s better than Bob at minimum.

          • the sky is falling

            Michelle was fine, I just like to say no one won that season, dumb joke really…

      • Hornacek

        She was just voted out. She wasn’t thrown off a waterfall.

    • Maritimer

      He’s gotta be on the Top 10 list at this point. At least among people who made the merge

      • the sky is falling

        Wrong

    • Mike Hirsch

      Oh, what about Rocky or Lisi?

      • EmAndScoutInBK

        Lisi definitely. I hated rocky, but some people didn’t I guess.

        • Blurry Denzel

          Rocky is one of the worst ever to be cast.

      • the sky is falling

        Or franchesqua

        • EmAndScoutInBK

          No.

          • the sky is falling

            She was better than mike?

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            We can’t know, imho – not around long enough. But being a first boot, even twice (esp on a returnee season with outside shit coming in) doesn’t give us enough info. First boots are often unlucky

          • the sky is falling

            Fair enough, sorry if I came across as attacking. I usually love your commentary on the show. I’m just a dumb American white guy with weird ass opinions about Survivor. love you, dear!

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Love you boo

          • the sky is falling

            I never know if internet comments are taken seriously or not just like to make sure it’s clear I’m not TRYING to be an asshole. men usually have no idea what’s going on

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            I have put my foot in my mouth on more than one occasion.

          • Taako From Teevhii

            This is not meant to be directed at you, but your comment made me think of it, hence the reply.

            I saw somewhere that it’s not enough that you’re not trying to be an asshole. You have to try to not be an asshole. I think it’s good advice (especially for men).

          • the sky is falling

            Ok that’s fair

          • Prom King

            YES

      • Hornacek

        “ANTHONY! ANTHONY!!!”

    • Mike is conundrum to me, because while he probably is the worst player stagectically in the final 6, I see a way how he becomes the winner of this season.

      • Mike Hirsch

        Is it called “stumblefucking your way to victory”?

        • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

          No its call jenna morascing it

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Disagree. The edit was not kind to her, but Rob C has said she would’ve even beaten him, so I don’t think she stumbled her way into anything.

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            She gave her immunity to Hedi when it was between her and Hedi!!! And at final three it was matt picking who he lost to

            Plus, Rob C is a suck up who would say anything to sound good and non confrontational

          • sharculese

            The plan to vote for Christie was pretty locked down at that point. In TEoS Rob said that on the canoe ride to tribal he was sitting next to Christie and she leaned over and told him she was willing to vote with his side, and all he could think was “welp, too late.”

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            Jenna didn’t know that. Keep the figgin immunity necklace yo

          • purplerockandy

            He probably also likes to think that he wasn’t THIIIIIIIIIIS close to winning Survivor all the time.

        • sharculese

          No, it’s called Crowleying.

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            Typing Cat!

          • Prom King

            Crowley has multiple challenge wins, awesome/terrible use of fake idol, and was rarely a target. All Mike has is he just tossed half an idol into the fire.

    • Violina23

      Bad.

  • BadPlayer91

    So, is this episode a good argument for why too many advantages can be terrible? Cause here the intersection of idols and advantages resulted in confusing and chaotic gameplay. Could this be because players were overwhelmed by all the odds and options that could come up? Did everyone vote Ben because it was the easy thing to do in a game filled with too many different things?

    • The intersection of idols and advantages resulted in confusing and chaotic gameplay because no one could keep their mouths shut, basically. The one idol to be successful was the one no one knew about.

      Also I think everyone voted Ben because they were tired of him, really.

  • Marlin M.

    Lauren could have brought her advantage and place one of the votes for somebody else. Could have been saved.

    • Other Scott

      I just think no one realized there genuinely COULD be another idol out there – they probably thought Lauren’s was the rehidden Mike one, they didn’t realize that production went back and re-hid Ryan’s as well

  • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

    Trivia question. Name the two two time players who have never been voted out.

    • Marlin M.

      colton one of them

    • Streets_Ahead

      Jenna Morasca for one gotta think about the other.

    • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

      Edit three two time

    • Mike Hirsch

      We can’t name him! He’s redacted!

    • EmAndScoutInBK

      Redacted, Morasca, Colton, hantz

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        Hantz played three times. Unless you mean Brandon, who was voted out.

        • the sky is falling

          Technically voted out, but really, removed from game

        • Hornacek

          He wasn’t voted out – he was the author of his own fate!

      • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

        Hantz is wrong. Otherwise, Nice job!

  • EmAndScoutInBK

    I just realized that they were so dumb that literally only one of them had to vote for someone else to split the vote. Lauren could’ve voted for Chrissy or Ryan because Ben was all by his lonesome.

    • Streets_Ahead

      You know what would have made it easier for Lauren to do that? An extra vote.

      • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

        You stole andys line for the podcast!!!

        • Violina23

          Not enough rage.

      • WHY DID YOU LEAVE YOUR EXTRA VOTE BACK AT CAMP LAUREN??? YOU KNEW YOU WERE IN DANGER! WHY?!?!?!

    • Maritimer

      They may have lost that revote though: Mike-Ryan-Ben to Ashley-Devon (worth the try though)

      • Taako From Teevhii

        But among Chrissy, Ryan, and Mike, it sounded like two of them were leaning Lauren at one point. You know Lauren, Devon, and Ashley are voting for Ben. So just have two people split it and be safe. (and I know that this is technically different from what @disqus_FeYRrg1QKY:disqus is saying, but the split was still possible)

        • Maritimer

          That’s true. She had about 3 different ways out of this and chose to take none of them

          • the sky is falling

            Did she vote herself out?

          • Maritimer

            Not quite but she got voted out because of avoidable mistakes. She closer to Erik’d or Tyson’d herself

        • That’s why I kinda got excited for Ryan and Mike’s sabotage because I thought they would take the shot for Devon or Chrissy.

  • gouis

    Love that Lauren went back to being surly and curt right when it would have been to her advantage to not throw all her advantages away and snipe at everyone.

  • Marlin M.

    when is the finale?

    • Taako From Teevhii

      Two weeks from now, I believe. Five-person finale.

      • Marlin M.

        Ben better get voted off next week.

  • Blurry Denzel

    I guess last week was the wrong time to start talking shit about how the Lauren rebellion would win me the Outcast league. I guess the third time wasn’t the charm.

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      As we say in the industry: I hope you enjoyed your stay!

      • Blurry Denzel

        I didn’t. You’ll hear about it on Yelp.

    • Diego Armando

      To be fair, you could not have seen that coming.

  • Adam B.

    Ben, you IDIOT, you have a majority. DON’T FUCK IT UP. And my goodness did he overplay this thing like a four-year-old in a superball factory. All he had to do was shut up, keep his four, and eliminate the others. This hurt my brain.

    • Taako From Teevhii

      His reaction was to the other three targeting him tho…

  • Marlin M.

    Ill see and wait how it ends but this might be in my bottom 7.

    • the sky is falling

      You have a bottom 7? That’s a weird excel spreadsheet.

  • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

    So FTC a tie between Mike and Devon? With chrisssy in third? So she would vote for Mike?

    • gouis

      Stop with this tie nonsense. It’s not canon and if it happens the internet will have ruined it by talking about it for 6 months

      • To be fair, Probst ruined it with his insistence on what would happen in a F3 during Game Changers.

        • purplerockandy

          Which just as easily could’ve been him fucking with Culpepper, as Jeff loves making the person who made the F3 choice feel bad as it was about setting up the next season. A set up, btw, that is completely unnecessary. If we do indeed get an FTC tie this or any season, they’ll have to explain the fuck out of it as it happens and not say “you all remember what I said at the Game Changers finale, right?”

          • Hornacek

            For years people have asked “what happens if there’s a tie at FTC?” and Jeff would only say “We have a plan for that, but we’re not going to reveal it.” Then he finally reveals it last season, completely unprompted – I mean it wasn’t even close to a tie, and he had to really stretch the math for the hypothetical GC alternate final three.

            So either he revealed the plan because (a) he figured there might never be a tie and he just wanted to tell someone, or maybe (b) when that reunion aired there had already been a tie so he wanted to prepare the audience. like when a Previously On Survivor reminds us that someone has an idol/advantage.

          • purplerockandy

            Or because the only way he can twist the knife in Culpepper is to reveal the tiebreaker.

          • Hornacek

            But does Jeff really want to twist the knife in Culpepper like that? Is Brad someone that Jeff would want to torture like that?

          • purplerockandy

            Because “oh look at that, you would’ve won if you made a different F3 decisions” is one of his favourite bits.

          • Hornacek

            But Jeff likes Brad. I feel that Jeff would not do that to a player that he considers one of his alpha male bros – he’s more likely to do that to a “lesser player” in his opinion.

          • purplerockandy

            And I feel like you’re wrong.

          • Hornacek

            I feel like I’m not. Jeff loves his alpha male players and wouldn’t want to make them feel worse than they already do once they’ve lost.

            But, potato, potahto.

          • purplerockandy

            You’re right. He sure went easy on Colby for the same error. And Malcolm for losing the F4 challenge.

          • Hornacek

            In those situations the person just missed out on winning by a single vote, or was someone that was a fan favorite and would overwhelmingly had won if they had made it to the FTC. With Brad in GC, he was not a fan favorite (although he became one for a few episodes in the middle of the season, but quickly lost that status) and Sarah soundly beat him in the FTC. Despite Jeff’s alternate history, there was no situation where Brad “almost” won for want of a nail.

            Explaining how a tie works did not come up organically in the GC finale. Jeff had to go through several levels of hypothetical hoops in order to get to the situation where Brad would have tied for the win in the FTC. It was pretty obvious that he wanted to explain in that reunion how a tie would work, and he was going to come up with a hypothetical situation that would allow him to do that, no matter how awkward or convoluted it was.

            Now why Jeff felt the need to explain how a tie would work – whether he just wanted to explain it so people would stop asking him, or if he wanted to explain it then so we’d already know for this season – no one knows.

          • purplerockandy

            I’m not sure “choosing Tai instead of Sarah” is that convoluted.

          • Hornacek

            It felt like Probst had to go through 3 different “If this had happened” scenarios in order to get to a scenario that would result in a hypothetical situation where there would be a tie. Even when he got to a final three, most of the jury would not agree with him – it seemed like he had to strong arm a few of them in order to get to a tie.

            Again, it did not feel like a way for the explanation of what they would do if there was a tie to come up organically in conversation. It really felt like Jeff forced it in there, and no matter what any of the players said, he was going to come up with a hypothetical situation where a tie would happen.

          • purplerockandy

            I think you feel this way because you’re misremembering the segment.

            Here’s what happened: Probst starts in on his standard question about “let’s poll the jury of what would’ve happened if final immunity winner made a different choice”. Culpepper IMMEDIATELY interrupts to try and stop it because A) he probably doesn’t need this shit in his life and B) it is a stupid hypothetical that proves nothing.

            Probst tries to plow forward. Culpepper continues to object. Probst will not relent. Culpepper eventually does. The jury is polled (with Sarah voting instead of Tai). The result is a tie. Probst explains what happens with a tie. Troy says he’d have voted Culpepper. HAHA FUCK YOU BRAD CULPEPPER, you ruined your chance to win.

          • purplerockandy

            So if this was all a set up for Probst to prime the audience for a tie that has happened for the next season, how would he have done if this theoretical game hadn’t resulted in a tie between Culpepper and Tai?

          • Hornacek

            Hey, I’m not saying that HHH ends with a tie. I’m saying that Probst seemed determined to explain at the GC reunion what they would do if there was a tie, and he was willing to find a way to bring it up organically, and the best way to do that was try and come up with a hypothetical situation where a tie happened. But instead of just saying “If A had happened there would have been a tie”, it really came off like he had to say “If A and B and C and D and E had *all* happened, then there would have been a tie”.

            I think it’s just as likely that he just wanted to tell everyone so people would stop asking him about it, and he thought “There’s never going to be a tie, people ask me this every season, I just want to tell everyone so they’ll stop asking me.”

    • Maritimer

      Ben and Devon. And she votes for Devon. That’s where I’m at right now. Especially given Chrissy’s “revenge in any possible way” confessional

      • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

        I can see that

        • Maritimer

          That said, I was coming around on the Lauren’s winning this train until about an hour ago so my opinion’s not worth much

      • Alycia Swift

        And I wouldn’t blame her one bit. Ben has pretty much backstabbed all of his alliances.

        But he’s also been a jerk about it.

        Actually this seems to be the season of the jerks.

        • Maritimer

          Yeah, he could have easily had that conversation about betraying her without being a jerk but that was apparently too much for him. And that’s why she won’t vote for him, not the betrayal. Ben’s got a bit of “I know more about life than anyone else” thing going on

        • Hornacek

          Hey, Heroes vs. Healers vs. Hustlers! The Jerk Store called and they’re out of you!

  • sharculese

    Guys, I’m watching this tribal council again. Spoiler alert: it’s still bugfuck.

  • Marlin M.

    I feel like production hates JP. They cut his shot when they mention his name in the jury, lol

    • sharculese

      Or they got a block of wood in the shot and didn’t realize the difference?

      • Inanimate carbon rod would win player of the season over JP.

        • sharculese

          Bob Crowley’s not on this season, tho.

  • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

    TEAM DEVON BITCHES!!!!!

    • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

      Gonna keep posting this till he wins

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        He’s gonna have to get invited back before that happens.

        • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

          #bellhopwrong #deathtoSNP

    • Figaro

      Devon’s definitely winning this right?
      He’s arguably the only one of the remaining players that hasn’t really been shown in a negative light at all. He got that Aras-esque helicopter/drone shot from earlier in the season, and he’s also possibly the most strategic of the remaining players. I was quite impressed tonight when he called for them to vote NOW at Tribal – he obviously saw that Mike had settled on voting Ben and wanted to get the ball rolling before Mike could be swayed or change his mind into voting for Lauren (not that it ultimately mattered but still).
      Plus his Mum seemed super sweet.

      • Prom King

        I doubt it. I knew more about Michele than I do Devon. Hell I know more about Cole than I do Devon. All I know about him is his job title. It’s hard to imagine Devon or Ashley winning. Enjoyable character though.

        • purplerockandy

          All I knew about Michele was that she was a bartender.

          Which wasn’t even true at that point.

          • Hornacek

            And she got a thai massage.

          • Prom King

            You knew that she was a bartender and that apparently she knew how to read and handle people and stick up for herself because she was a bartender. That’s still more than Devon.

    • UseYourCommonSense

      Devon is not winning, other people don’t perceive him as a mastermind.

      • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

        Two points to destroy your argument.
        1) who on this season IS a strategic mastermind?

        2) Being a strategic mastermind is exactly how Russel Hantz has won survivor three times and Natalie white is a useless, forgotten runner up

  • sharculese

    I’m gonna pile on Mike a little more because why the fuck note: Mike, the idea that ever since Guatemala, you have been waiting to just fucking waste an idol is bullshit, and, even if it’s true, you already fucking did that.You are bad at trying to make good TV. You’re not even Joe. You’re replace Joe. Let that sink in.

    • Also, he didn’t even do his math right. Didn’t he say 15 years? If he did, he’s not even close to seasons as well as actual years.

      • sharculese

        Guatemala was 2005, so he wasn’t that far off.

        • the sky is falling

          Sorry shard, this means David wright returns before Mike

          • sharculese

            That’s fine. I think David is obnoxious but at least he’s not terrible at Survivor.

          • Max_Jets

            Well I sure as fuck hope so

  • Diego Armando

    Wow. That was a trainwreck.

    Ben is now the first person to send someone home with only his vote (outside of a Final 3).

  • Diego Armando

    Devon needs to win this. He is the last, best hope for the season and the only remaining competent player.

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      He is the Jay Byars of this season. He will not win. But he will return. Hopefully on an all-archetype season with Jay, a Christie brother, Joe Anglim, and Malcolm.

      • sharculese

        “He is the Jay Byars of this season. He will not win. But he will return.”

        That… doesn’t describe Jay Byars.

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          He will return…

          • Taako From Teevhii

            Are you sure you’re not thinking of Jay Starrett?

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            That is exactly who I was thinking of! Who is Jay Byars?

          • Taako From Teevhii

            Hot Jay from One World. “Bumpuzzled” that you forgot him.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            I don’t remember him.

          • Taako From Teevhii

            An understandable side effect of blocking out all memories of One World. I get it.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            But he’s so hot.

          • Hornacek

            Calm down, Nicole.

          • sharculese

            This makes so much more sense now.

  • Diego Armando

    In regards to the prediction thread: we were all wrong. To paraphrase Brad Jones “I didn’t see these twists coming because those only happen in stupid seasons.”

    • Maritimer

      There was zero hint coming into this episode it would be her. It wasn’t even really hinted until the last like 20 mins

    • Are you quoting Cinema Snob right now?

      • Diego Armando

        You better believe I am. That was from his Midnight Screening of The Loft.

        • I love me some Cinema Snob. I also love the use of him here because he hates reality tv.

          • Diego Armando

            Especially Survivor.

            I saw him at a Q&A in Detroit 2 years ago. I think I took a picture with him and asked him if Chloe approved of his site.

    • Mike Hirsch

      This season is like when you play Hold ‘Em against people who have never played and are terrible and stay in hands they should have folded and they KEEP. WINNING.

  • Diego Armando

    That please apply makes so much more sense now.

  • Marlin M.

    how do you put the spoiler tag?

    • sharculese

      text

      except without the spaces

    • the sky is falling

      text T whoops, Charlie Browned that, haha

  • Marlin M.

    So apparently Probts told Dalton Ross that FTC is his favorite of all time and that next week’s episode is insane

    • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

      It had better be Also will someone teach me how to do spoiler tags

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        Look at the post before this one.

        • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

          yeah but how do I make mine do that

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            what you want to say without the question marks. Try to copy and paste this and take out the ?s.

            Okay not that.

            wywts with no spaces inside the s.

    • Maritimer

      I’m not surprised next episode is insane given that there’s basically no committed alliances left besides Devon-Ashley and possibly kind of still Ryan and Chrissy

    • Like I competely understand why Probst says that. I also think that no matter how good that FTC Probst is hyping up will save the season. Espically if Dr. Mike is the one who winds up winning because the tie vote (3 Mike- 3 Ben or Devon- 2 Chrissy) that seem like this season is building up to. .

  • Dubious Rob

    Is there anyone left on this season who can play Survivor well? Anyone? Bueller?

    Devon and Ashley telegraphing their alliance at the challenge was dumb. For all her worry about being seen as a “power couple” with JP, she sure didn’t care that everyone now sees her and Devon as a tight pair.

    Lauren giving Mike half the idol was dumb but understandable. Leaving her extra vote back at camp is indefensible.

    • Mike Hirsch

      Usually I feel like the show wants me to root for people. This year it’s like the editors gave up on that. Like they threw up their hands and said, “these people are terrible, and we’ll just let that be the story.”

      • Marlin M.

        their fault for casting so many bad players.

        • Streets_Ahead

          They don’t try to cast good players.

        • I guess Ali and Roark were meant to be the good players?

          THANKS RYAN.

    • DrVanNostrand

      Devon is a bright light. No one could possibly be upset that someone is allied with him.

  • Mike Hirsch
  • the sky is falling

    I think we are all missing an opportunity to pile on SNP and reinforce that Ryan still sucks.

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      He certainly sucks at getting voted out of the game.

      • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

        #bellhopwrong

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          Be careful with the hashtag, young @SurvivorWerewolf:disqus. It has a power that may be to powerful for you to handle. Some day I will have to tell you the tale of the hashtag that may no longer be spoken of. Sadly, today is not that day.

  • Saturday Night Palsy

    I remember seeing a short video on The Internet about the show “Lost” after it wrapped. It was basically a couple of minutes of rapid fire “And what about the…” of unanswered questions from the series. I feel like this season could have one of those videos about inexplicable moves.

    • the sky is falling

      You leave LOST alone! They answered the damn questions , just in a stupid way

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        That show had a garbage ending equivalent to the ending of the Dark Tower books. Utter crap.

        • the sky is falling

          Sigh, I know. I’d still be on board for a Dharma Initiative spin off, I have a lost tattooo….

        • Max_Jets

          Hey, man, I cried like nine times!

      • Violina23

        I didn’t hate the end of Lost, but the writers clearly wrote themselves into a corner and had no idea what the fuck to do.

        • the sky is falling

          Lost is a big deal to me, I didn’t expect or want answers, but the whole sideways story was dumb to me. That literal plug in the island was disappointing. Still one of the best tv shows ever made

          • Yeah despite it’s faults it’s still one of my favorites. But they left the door open for another show to beat it.

        • But here’s the thing… they knew when the series was going to end, they knew how much time they had, and they had years to map it out and get it right AND THEY STILL MESSED IT UP.

          I loved Lost through season 4. 5 and 6 are a big bag of very good stories and absolutely horrible stories and the Finale somehow managed to be both.

          • Violina23

            They knew these things for Battlestar Galactica too — and they fully admitted (after the fact) that the cylons never had a “plan”. I really did enjoy LOST (most of it) but that still doesn’t convince me that they had NO f*ing clue how to get themselves out of the hole they dug.

            I was on board. I didn’t need all the answers. But the pieces of the puzzle needed to at least fit SOMEWHAT together so we could spend the time after the show ended speculating about everything else. Instead the whole thing just… ended, and it felt pointless to even talk about further.

          • Yeah what gets me is even after they settled on an end date they dug an even deeper hole for themselves during season 5 with a time travel plot that really did nothing for the overall narrative and felt like fan service.

      • DrVanNostrand

        They answered NOTHING. They might as well have said, “It was all a dream!”

        • the sky is falling

          I mean, I’m not saying they didn’t botch the ending, they did. but they technically answered most of the questions. Unfortunately, most of those answered boiled down to, “it was a magic island and stuff” and there is a mystical wine stopper holding the evil in, just terrible

          • DrVanNostrand

            That’s fair. It was still a very good show, but it had at least one major flaw.

          • the sky is falling

            IT had A LOT of flaws. There had to be a better resolution to it than what they came up with. I remember having a perpetual sinking feeling for the entirety of season 6 that they were screwing it up. A better conclusion may have been Jack waking up in the exact same spot where the show started.
            Might have pissed people off even more, but then at least the whole show could have just been a time-loop they were all stuck in to repeat for eternity.

            Once Walking Dead ends, pretty sure they will reclaim the crown of worst series ending of all time.

    • sharculese

      So you’re saying this season is a story of huge ambition running up against a lack of planning that ended in people furiously spinning their wheels just to get to the end?

      Yeah, that tracks.

  • Diego Armando

    Is Andy going to be angrier at this episode than the Thanksgiving one?

    Yes

    • Purplerockmatt

      most assuredly boss

      • the sky is falling

        It was clearly the dumbest episode of a dumb season. I blame this on PRP for not pre gaming it

        • Diego Armando

          Even the Challenges sucked and they upped their Challenge game this season.

          • the sky is falling

            Man, that marble challenge, wtf?

        • purplerockandy

          I will never regret not giving this season any more of my time than I already have.

    • the sky is falling

      We can only hope

    • Well with my bad week, I need someone to the way I feel right now.

    • Roswulf

      I’m going yes- last week gave Andy hope.

      And it just got snatched away.

  • Diego Armando

    I still somehow have an intact Pick 4 Team. It happened in the stupidest possible way.

    • StormofCuteness

      This flabberghasts me…you picked 4 of these?

      • Diego Armando

        The men.

      • Diego Armando

        BBB also has an intact team. Ben, Chrissy, Mike and Ryan.

        • StormofCuteness

          This doesn’t change the fact that it is shocking anyone picked (on purpose) 4 players still in the game.

    • Prom King

      I am very impressed! I’ve been down to Ben for what seems like weeks.

  • Ms. Sweaterfan

    You guys, I still think Chrissy could maybe win this thing

    (and not just because she’s my only remaining hope across both of my fantasy teams)

    • the sky is falling

      Does she have the votes? I don’t see it, Mike has a better shot than chrissy

      • Ms. Sweaterfan

        ¯_(ツ)_/¯
        I have the least idea of who will win this season of any season in recent memory

        • the sky is falling

          Yeah, it seems very much up I. The air, the gameplay has been very poor, no clue

        • Mike Hirsch

          I’m thinking maybe Ben? It seems like we’re supposed to maybe sort of be on his side, despite him being not great at this.

          • the sky is falling

            Dunno man, they have been painting him as an asshole the last few episodes, Ben would be a surprise

          • Ms. Sweaterfan

            Plus he has alienated literally everyone remaining in the game and most of the jury. But then again, with this season who knows…

          • the sky is falling

            That the key point, this season is full of randomness and poor strategy

          • Mike Hirsch

            Yeah, and I won’t dispute that. And he probably *shouldn’t* win, and yet…I don’t know, it feels like he may despite all that.

          • the sky is falling

            I mean it depends on final 3 I guess , against Ryan and Ashley he wins?

          • I have Thoughts on Ben’s edit. Mainly that they really don’t know what to do with him, because he’s a marine, and a hero, and in most circumstances that would get him a glowing edit because who wants to trash the marine with ptsd on tv? But I also hypothesise that he is going to get to tribal council and Not Win. (My current theory: a tied vote against Devon, which he loses when third-place finalist Chrissy breaks the tie). So I think Ben’s edit is an awkward fudge of the hero edit they want to give him, coupled with the awkward reality of needing to show why he might lose in the final.

          • Figaro

            That sounds pretty spot-on to me, but do you think that the editors may also be making more of an effort to show more well-rounded players overall as well? By which I mean that both their strengths and weaknesses are shown. Possibly as an evolution of the way they edit players since Adam’s win?

            Arguably everyone left has been shown to be making both good and bad moves which, for me anyway, is far more interesting than the editors trying to hide the bad moves of a winner’s game, or vice-versa. Lauren made some great moves last week (enough that people thought she was the top-pick to win) and made some terrible moves tonight, but her edit was great because we got to see all of it. Similarly Ben was presented as calm and level headed at the start and has become more paranoid and overbearing as the game has progressed but I love seeing that because it’s realistic and there’s no way anyone can play 24/7 for 40-odd days and not make mistakes. I guess ultimately I want to see winner’s flaws and how they overcome them to win, and I thiiiink (/hope) that the editors are making more of an effort to actually show that.

          • If Ben wins, I will certainly be subscribing to this theory.

          • Maritimer

            While I wouldn’t exactly be thrilled with a Ben win, I would like this idea that its launching us into a new era of editing where they show us the winner’s game, mistakes and all, versus protecting them in the edit

          • purplerockandy

            Maybe we’ve been getting more “well rounded” winner’s edits of late because we’ve had more shitty winners of late.

          • Maritimer

            Can’t rule this one out

          • Other Scott

            This is the answer – the stuff with Adam and Taylor and Adam being gaslighted and tribal and looking horrible, it’s a big enough and an entertaining enough part of the season that they’re not going to leave it out to make their winner look better, especially since the Mom with cancer thing means they’re already going to get one of the most well liked winners in the history of the show.

            The top priority for the TV show is to make an interesting and/or exciting product, and if there are things that happened out there that are relevant to the story, or are interesting, the editors aren’t going to leave it on the cutting room floor just so their winner is never shown in a negative light.

          • UseYourCommonSense

            But didn’t they already do that with Adam?

          • Maritimer

            Yes, but one is an anomaly, two makes a trend

          • purplerockandy

            We are in a post-Ken world, after all.

          • Prom King

            Eh, they’ve been showing winner weaknesses since Brian Heidik and Jenna Morasca.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Some say the reaction to Jenna’s win is what led to the “winner’s edit” as we now know it. What winners got edits like that between Jenna and Adam?

            (Granted, it could be what Andy said and worse winners get worse edits… excluding Brian because that’s more of a worse people thing.)

          • Prom King

            Huh. Off the top of my head, I actually can’t think of anyone. Great point.

            Mea culpa, Figaro!

          • Maritimer

            He looked some bad in that exchange with Chrissy. And it wasn’t ambiguously bad this time like some of his past disputes

    • Diego Armando

      Yes, she can because someone has to win. This wasn’t a good episode for her, but it wasn’t for anyone (except, Ryan, because he did nothing).

      • Mike Hirsch

        Ryan was the JP of this episode.

        • the sky is falling

          They Jp’d this whole season

    • Violina23

      They are going out of their way to show that she is pissing EVERYBODY off. I still see “losing finalist”.

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      You and the hope! You’re like the bright butterfy Devon of the Outcasts League! Both just doomed!

    • Prom King

      Fingers crossed! But ideally it will be a tie between Chrissy and Ben, and then a stare-off.

    • DrVanNostrand

      OWD

  • Diego Armando

    I have a discussion question for the Podcast: Was Lauren giving Mike half her Idol dumber than FFSDT promising to give Sarah her Legacy Advantage if she got voted out?

    I think the answer is yes, but I could be swayed.

    • Taako From Teevhii

      Did MOD&BOCQOTA&TFMFFSDT verbally try to leverage her advantage into Sarah helping her? Because Lauren just handed over half the idol without saying anything.

      • Mike Hirsch

        Yeah, based entirely on what we were shown, Lauren’s move was dumber.

      • Diego Armando

        No. She suggested that telling Sarah exactly what the Idol did and her plan to give it to Sarah would make Sarah trust her enough to keep her around. Actually, that is exactly what Lauren did.

    • Roswulf

      Yes. When in doubt, giving up immunity is the dumbest move.

  • Dubious Rob

    In terms of terrible gameplay, we’re not quite in Nicaragua territory yet, but we can’t be far from Gabon. In fact, I’m starting to see some similarities in the players:

    Mike = Bob, but instead of winning challenges, he makes terrible moves for no reason; could stumble into a win
    Chrissy = Susie, an older woman with bad social skills who could still come within a vote of winning simply by virtue of who she’s up against
    Devon = Matty, but smarter
    Ashley = Crystal, but can actually win things
    Ryan = Kenny
    Lauren = Randy, a curmudgeon who trusts the wrong guy when it comes to idols

    I’m not sure where that leaves Ben. Maybe he’s the Sugar of this season, destroying alliances right and left and getting everyone to distrust him? It’s not a perfect analogue, I realize.

    • I think Ben is absolutely the Sugar.

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        I know what you’re doing here.

      • sharculese

        Not sure he sniffles enough.

      • Crappy

        I just don’t understand why Ben decided to blow it up tonight. Even if the core 3 were planning to target him, as long as they were not going to do it that TC, he was fine. He could have played his idol at F6 or F5 and tried to win 2 immunities. Tough but better position that his current one at the absolute bottom.

        • Prom King

          I think it was because he had no idea when they would be coming for him. It’s not like they would warn him in advance about it. But I agree that he’s now solidly at the bottom.

          It would have to take something crazy and super outlandish like Chrissy targeting the last woman besides herself for him to come out on top!

    • Diego Armando

      They both found idols, so sure.

    • Prom King

      The Ben comparison to Sugar has me smiling so hard. Genius

    • DrVanNostrand

      “Crystal, but can actually win things” is an oxy moron. You have chosen her only defining quality and negated it in the same sentence.

  • the sky is falling

    Silver lining, new season in just over 2 months

  • Violina23

    I… have no idea what I just saw.

    But it was entertaining to watch.

    Also, there was so much idiocy I almost don’t know where to start…

    No, I’m kidding. I love you, Lauren, but you essentially voted yourself out.

    • the sky is falling

      I think we all thought the marble “challenge” would be the low point to f the episode

    • That sound you heard was all the bodies falling to the ground as they dove off the Lauren bandwagon before it collided with the side of the mountain.

      • the sky is falling

        You guys better pregame the next season, you jinxed this one

        • Gonna have the randomizer tell me to root for right now so I can begin working on a hype page.

          • the sky is falling

            I think a guy who works for Redmond is on the next season

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Yeah. The guy that looks like a Bee-Gee.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            It’s worked so well for you in the past.

          • the sky is falling

            Also, nothing can ever top your hype post for Tony on GC, that was fucking epic

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            That’s not how you get the featured comment.

          • sharculese
          • the sky is falling

            Never saw that one, that is strong

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            That’s how you get the featured comment!

          • sharculese

            John was stoked for Dan Foley. Never forget.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            We need our own PRP shirts! For the commenters!

          • the sky is falling

            I would buy a “worst armchair survivor podcast” t shirt

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Especially if I could get one in either black or white.

          • the sky is falling

            This site needs to rank the commenters. Here’s my list
            1 sharc
            2 Mike Hirsch
            3 hornacek
            4 em scout
            5 takao
            6 Denzel
            7 bad player
            8 SNP
            9 Barbara anderson
            10 sweater fan, ms.
            Not necessarily in order, just my personal fave top 10

          • purplerockandy

            I’ll let you in on a secret: they’re all for the commenters.

            You think I’m here to make friends? Me?!?

          • If only I hadn’t thought to myself “I’ve got two women and one guy. I should add one more guy to balance it out.”

          • Diego Armando

            Mike was right there.

          • I actually chose to write about Mike, but then I looked at his social media and found nothing I could use. If there had been more material, it actually would have been Mike.

            It’s still funnier that it ended up being Dan, though.

          • the sky is falling

            Nah, the one share recommended is it, this episode was the typing cat gif of episodes

          • the sky is falling

            For the record, I called epic commenter sharculese, shard and share this week

          • sharculese

            At least you didn’t call me shart.

          • I knew Tony probably had the biggest target on his back. But I wanted to believe. And I was so happy to have him on my TV again…for 2 hours.

          • the sky is falling

            Sigh

          • Maritimer

            Well, randomizer is basically how we pick reward winners now apparently, so why wouldn’t you keep with Survivor’s theme?

  • Violina23

    Hey guys,

    Maybe the big ending that Probst is touting is finally getting a final tribal with a tie? You know, because they are all terrible players, and jurors are not legally allowed to abstain?

    • Violina23

      … and now I realize that this has already been discussed further down. Oh well, I was excited by my revelation.

      Also, I made Fishbach’s joke about Lauren reaching into the fire, but I took it one step forward to GoT and called Lauren the Unburnt. I was proud of my tweet.

      • sharculese

        Yeah, that’s kind of been the speculation since before the season began.

  • Amanda LaPergola

    I give up on this season. I have no one left to route for. Maybe Devon. Maybe Ashley. Certainly not Chrissy, Queen of the Pick Me Ass Hoes.

    If Chrissy PMAHs her way to the end, it will be a generations-long set back for women. Who go on Survivor.

    • the sky is falling

      Root for Ashley or Mike to cement this as worst season ever

  • the sky is falling

    This site needs to rank the commenters. Here’s my list
    1 sharc
    2 Mike Hirsch
    3 hornacek
    4 em scout
    5 takao
    6 Denzel
    7 bad player
    8 SNP
    9 Barbara anderson
    10 sweater fan, ms.
    Not necessarily in order, just my personal fave top 10

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      The reason I don’t like that idea is because of what happened with the AVoCADo. Too much of a cool kids club.

      • the sky is falling

        What is avocado?

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          It was (is?) an open forum for AVClub commenters. It was invite only to test the waters. The original invites were the moderators and they were very much a tight clique (pretty much the opposite of thw PRP crew). Everyone just tried to get into their good grlaces. The whole thing was just a popularity contest. It was (is?) pretty sad.

          • the sky is falling

            de, that sounds pretty gross. I’d take that over AV club as it is now, ugh, they destroyed my fave site

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            I just took this site over both of those sites. I like sub-standard armchair Survivor talk. Especially if it’s anti-religion.

          • Didn’t realize we checked quite so many boxes for you.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            That and the fact that you guys are international!

          • Purplerockmatt

            Like a criminal syndicate that James Bond is gonna take down!

        • Roswulf

          The largest of the AV Club refugee communities. I have no interest in getting in a fighting match with SNP, but I will say that I’ve had a very different experience with it than SNP, and post there a lot. If you are looking for a general cultural equivalent to this place (akin to the old AV Club), I think it’s as good as you can find. Definitely better than what the AV Club was in its last year or so of Disqus.

          But again. YMMV.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            By all means, give it a shot! Some good folks went there. It just wasn’t to my liking.

          • Roswulf

            Apologies for my prickliness on this by the way. I just want all the AV Club refugee locations to be friends, and then Kinja will magically go away and websites will be able to make money through quality long form critical writing and….somehow this would lead to the players on this season of Survivor being less dumpster-fire-y.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            No, you’re good! I shouldn’t trash talk like I did. There are good folks there. It may work for you (or anybody else), it just didn’t for me. Too heavy on personality.

      • sharculese

        I got invited to the Avocado by Dikachu, which still stands as my third greatest internet achievement, after GENDER FRAUD and being instrumental in destroying the official Coldplay message board, because Dik is awesome and it was flattering, but I think I posted there like twice.

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          He invited me there too. I hung around for about two weeks?

          • sharculese

            It reminded me of the short lived AV Club BB forum that went up after the transition to disqus – good in theory, but limited by how few people were there. And I’ve seen that happen with a spinoff forum before, see again: when I helped destroy the official Coldplay message board.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            I remember when I first started commenting at the AVClub the first two people to aknowledge me were ElDan and that jerk Judge Reinholt. Good thing that guy vanished into the ether!

          • sharculese

            My first two were Scrawler and Douay Rheims-Challoner. When Scrawler told me she loved me Encyclopedia Brown/HP Lovecraft cross-over post was when I felt like I had arrived.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Scrawler was almost up there with Cookie Monster. My Cookie Monster like was a good day. It was like Ice Cube’s blimp.

          • sharculese

            Did you ever get a Todd like? I said something about Mad Men once that was smart enough that Todd liked it and it felt real awesome.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            No. And once I was scolded by E. Buzz Miller. That sucked.

          • sharculese

            Well, at least “he” turned out to be kind of a creep, so that puts you in the clear.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            He did? You know that he died, right?

          • sharculese

            He didn’t. He was never real. It turned out the whole persona was an incredibly elaborate catfish.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            No shit? And who was the woman he met on the site?

          • sharculese

            Opera_punk? She was the one behind it.

            There’s a long google doc that recounts the research that went into figuring this out: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ohKDsB_xvX_qL1naHHAvKLkcaZGBnKUhEovUWLItBKQ/edit

            But, bottom line, Dom never existed and his death was a hoax.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Hilarious! Why would they do that? What was the gain?

          • sharculese

            Nobody knows.

          • Purplerockmatt

            he apparently has a habit of it. There are other sites where they played the same game. it is insane

          • Purple Rock Emma

            She was also not real. In fact, I think she’s less real than Dom, right?

          • sharculese

            I guess. It’s really hard to say because of how weird it got.

          • Purplerockmatt

            Todd once replied to a comment I had with something along the lines of “yes everybody listen to what mratfink is saying” it was very flattering

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Scrawler defended me once and that definitely made me feel like I was really part of the commentariat.

        • Purple Rock Emma

          Jeez, I didn’t even get invited by Matt.

          • Purplerockmatt

            you never asked!

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Who asks to be invited to things? Who am I, Ryan?

          • Purplerockmatt

            well now that you said it…

          • Purple Rock Emma

            How DARE you.

          • Purplerockmatt

            I didn’t say it! You said it!

          • Hornacek

            Who invited whom to Blackjack and Hookers?

          • Purplerockmatt

            Blackjack and Hookers is actually a tontine

          • Hornacek

            Thank you, Flying Hellfish, for teaching me that word.

      • StormofCuteness

        Oh shit, I completely forgot I belong to the Avocado!

    • 1. Sad Lil
      2. Everyone else

      • the sky is falling

        I’m glad to be number 2. first loser

    • sharculese

      oh. *blushes*

    • StormofCuteness

      *Tries not to be offended*

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        EXACTLY WHY THIS IS A BAD IDEA!

        • the sky is falling

          You’re right, this was a terrible idea. Looking at it this morning there are several commenters I left off the top 10. Pretend that didn’t happen. WHOOSH!

          • BadPlayer91

            I was just assuming this was the product of that wine you mentioned, but given I was in there I wasn’t about to complain…

      • Kemper Boyd

        Let’s go and form our own club. The No Sky is Falling Club.

        • StormofCuteness

          I feel like Chicken Little. 😂

        • the sky is falling

          Too late, I’m already president of that club.

    • purplerockandy

      I love all my children equally.

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        Every parent tells this lie.

        • purplerockandy

          They were just lying to you, Palsy.

    • Kemper Boyd

      Fucking harsh bro.

      • the sky is falling

        Yeah it was a bad plan from the start. I regret my decision to make this list.

    • Hornacek

      While I’m happy to be #3 (yay bronze!), the fact that @BarbaraTheWitch:disqus is 9th seems like nonsense to me. Her gossip alone should have her near the top.

  • the sky is falling

    FYI: I don’t listen to all the podcasts, mostly here for commentariat, but I am VeRY excited for Andy’s rage about this perplexing episode

  • Roswulf

    Whelp. This was our fault for complaining about this season being boring.

    I can’t even.

    I am impressed that Devon’s name seemingly was never mentioned at tribal. Go Devon!

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      He will. Maybe next episode.

      • purplerockandy

        Not while there’s another woman for Chrissy to target.

        • StormofCuteness

          I mean, right?

    • Bear in mind that if Lauren hadn’t fucked up with the idol, it would have gone to a revote with Devon the only option on that side.

      He got very lucky there.

    • Ms. Sweaterfan

      While the ridiculous live tribal was happening, I kept thinking that all Ben or Lauren had to do was ~quietly~ get the 3 stragglers unified in voting Devon and they would have had a foolproof plan. But I guess nothing is foolproof with the level of foolishness this season…

      • The one constant this season has been that Devon is a bright and beautiful light and voting him off is completely unthinkable for everyone present.

        • purplerockandy

          He’s gonna need to win one challenge to win this whole thing.

  • Rusty Shackleford

    Woof.

    • Roswulf

      “What’s that Lassie? You want me to throw an idol in the fire?”

  • forever1267

    “But They don’t KNOW we know they know we know” – Friends , er, Survivor

  • StormofCuteness

    I just want to say that I want to take back my championing of Lauren, but then she immediately recognized her own stupidity…which is almost something.

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      Oh, Lauren. The hope you gave us was unfounded. There will be no satisfying winner this season.

      • StormofCuteness

        SMDH 😡

      • DrVanNostrand

        OWD!

    • Roswulf

      Almost Something- The Survivor Season 35 Story

      • StormofCuteness

        Yes, exactly this.

    • Rusty Shackleford

      There was a shot of her w her canteen. It was made to look like she was preparing to leave, but I wonder if she realized she F’d up and was trying to put out the fire but then production was like NOPE.

    • Kemper Boyd

      The saving grace is that. Joe’s saving grace was that he took his blindeside as a game move and enjoyed it to some extent. At least Devon will win and this season won’t be as bad as if Ryan did.

      • StormofCuteness

        We can only hope.

  • StormofCuteness

    I am actually angry at how stupid this got, but I am even more annoyed by how much I hated the worst challenge possible!

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      Some peole are just naturally better at picking similarly colored rocks out of a bag than others. It all depends on love.

      I wonder if the intention was to give Ryan a shot.

      • StormofCuteness

        Intention? Someone intentionally did this?!

        I can’t even.

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          Well, somebody involved okayed it.

        • Maritimer

          My only guess at this point is that there was some kind of massively party the night before then that morning somebody went “oh fuck we forgot to build this challenge” and this is what happened.

      • DrVanNostrand

        Obviously Chrissy loves her husband more than Ben loves his wife. That’s how it works.

    • Assistant Dragon Slayer

      This. I feel like I’m channeling Andy right now.

    • i and 1

      I was thinking the whole time that the way to win would be maybe be something like to tell Jeff that this exercise was not a challenge at all, and people need to take affairs into their own hands, and rise above any slavery to absurdly-presented chance. Maybe then run over to their particular loved one and hug them. Maybe the others would be given 10 seconds to join them, and win the right to march off to a BBQ with Jeff.

      Anyhow, that is still possibly what the challenge really was.

  • Max_Jets

    I knew the reputations of Gabon and Nicaragua before going in, so I was able to find some entertainment in them. Now I know what it’s like to watch this shit play out live and wow it is not fun.

    • purplerockandy

      “But it’s so much better on a rewatch”

      • Max_Jets

        HA, rewatch… I’ll wait for the “full game” video edits of Alan and Jessica and pretend the rest of this season never existed.

        Last week was still good but will forever be tainted by what happens after.

        • purplerockandy

          I will never trust someone’s opinion of Nicaragua and Gabon unless they were forced to endure them week after week without knowing what would happen/who would succeed.

          Also, if they don’t agree with my opinion. Very untrustworthy.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            I’ve only watched in real time since Caramoan, but I would have thought that South Pacific was the most unbearable to watch without knowing the outcome.

          • Max_Jets

            I feel like Gabon and Nicaragua would be worse if you clung to any hope throughout the season, as you slowly (quickly?) watch it slip away. And at least SP’s front runner was playing well.

          • purplerockandy

            It wasn’t pleasant either.

          • Prom King

            It was. Better on the rewatch (and other cliches), but it actually was.

            Although not that much better because it’s not like a rewatch erases Brandon Hantz misogyny and Coach’s hypocritical religious fanaticism and that whole other tribe of unbearable douchebags (minus Cochran and his mom).

            This was also one of the rare seasons where my winner pick actually won, and that was pretty much the sole saving grace for me the first time I watched it. On the rewatch, the main thing that was enjoyable to me was focusing on how awesome the winner actually was – she’s subtle enough that I missed a lot of expressions and dry humor the first time – without ever being nervous about her safety.

          • Max_Jets

            “Coach’s hypocritical religious fanaticism”
            This is most of South Pacific’s appeal.

          • Prom King

            Watching that, to me, was like how it was for other people watching that one episode of Game Changers. Just repulsive beyond belief.

          • Max_Jets

            I’ve mentally compared Varner’s boot episode and Brandon’s boot episode before wondering why I have such different takes. I rave about the latter, and am down on the former. But I do think Varner’s boot is basically a good episode. The problem is we still have to watch a season play out after that. The events of the episode are still affecting the season but the show is not confronting its effects, which makes me both uncomfortable and uninterested. The reverse is true for South Pacific. The religious elements are kind of background for most of the season, addressed by Sophie here and there but not really fully emphasized. Then it all culminates in Brandon’s boot and suddenly everything is front and center and it’s dark but it’s FASCINATING. And then we get to watch the comeuppance in the following episode – the fake cult member takes down the cult leader.

          • Prom King

            It’s interesting to compare the two. I don’t mind dark. I think it just comes down to what different people can deal with on their tv screen. Personally, the Varner episode was painful but I thought it was also pretty awesome because it brought an issue that’s important to me front and center. I sorta feel the same way about the Dreamz experience in Fiji, which was compelling to me on a personal level but super not-enjoyable for most people to watch. On the other hand, there is nothing fascinating to me about fake religious bullshit and so seeing it on my screen is just the worst for me to watch. Especially when it is being enacted by multiple people.

          • Prom King

            I watched Gabon week after week and the person I was rooting for from episode one won. Awesome season!

            Nicaragua is another story. Sometimes fun but mainly infuriating and depressing.

          • purplerockandy

            Yeah, well… I never trust your opinion period.

          • Prom King

            You should continue to not trust it. We watch Survivor very differently. You seem to have the same experience watching Survivor as I did when watching The Walking Dead. All that rage at characters not doing what I want them to do!

          • One of them rides around on a motorcycle! A vehicle that offers no protection from the elements or zombies! When it’s been established that loud noise attracts zombies!

          • Diego Armando

            I can testify that knowing what happens in Thailand still makes that season horrific.

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          Rob’s winner’s-walkthrough interview with Mike is sure gonna be something.

          • Max_Jets

            Be careful what you say to me, I may yet throw my laptop against the wall tonight.

          • Rusty Shackleford

            Damn that’s grim and right on the money.

      • Max_Jets

        I envy that you have a podcast you can rant on.

      • DrVanNostrand

        I’ve heard that said about South Pacific, too.

        (Edit: Holy shit. I wasn’t even talking about Prom King, but there it is right below!)

    • Max_Jets

      What was Mike’s confessional towards the end of the episode? “Don’t underestimate Dr. Mike” or some shit like that. Literally all the power that was given to him was a result of everyone else’s mistakes and he STILL fucks it up & has the nerve to tell us he’s any good! GO AWAY

      • Head Architect Sylvia

        He’s so dull he probably knows doing stuff like that will at least guarantee him a bit of screen time. I guess? Everything he says/does just seems so unnecessary.

  • Assistant Dragon Slayer

    You can relax, Australian Survivor. The 2017 crown ain’t goin anywhere.

    • Figaro

      I was actually thinking while watching that the ‘mime animals’ challenge from Australia would have been one million times better and more entertaining for the Loved Ones Challenge, while still being easy (and inexpensive) to run if they didn’t want to do a challenge course.

      • Assistant Dragon Slayer

        I had the exact same thought, but it would take too long to run with 14 people. They already imported the hoop challenge, they would be crazy to not eventually do the charades challenge eventually.

    • Crappy

      155000% better than this season. I am meh but not actively angry at this season because I got my survivor fix and more from australian s2.

      • Kemper Boyd

        This is still better than NZ.

        • Crappy

          NZ was too low in production values for me to enjoy. I stopped watching just before the merge.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            Too bad, it was super-exciting and full of intrigue after the merge. Just kidding.

          • Hornacek

            #FakeNews

    • Kemper Boyd

      Better than NZ.

  • Assistant Dragon Slayer

    Is the bag-of-rocks challenge even in the top 10 of dumb things that happened in this episode?

    • Max_Jets

      No 🙁

    • Roswulf

      I think it was the dumbest thing. Look, playing Survivor is mentally hard. Almost everyone loses, and you don’t know who to trust, and you are tired, and cameras are staring at you and…

      Realizing that challenges shouldn’t be “randomly select rocks from a bag” is not hard.

      • i and 1

        Yeah, I don’t know if I am gonna be able to read all the comments here, but Iam stunned at the apparent outrage here about the episode as a whole. I thought it was a great episode—but that challenge was just an insult. An overlong coin-toss dressed up as a bracketological mind game for idiots.

        • It can be a great episode and still have people doing extremely dumb things. Dumb things can be entertaining.

          • Diego Armando

            See that episode of Kaoh Rong where Debbie went home. Everything was stupid, but it was kind of fun.

          • Max_Jets

            Aubry and Cydney made a good move! I will not back down from this.

          • Max_Jets

            Dumb things are better when it’s a result of someone else’s greatness.

          • i and 1

            Yes, and I should be careful not to come off like someone astonished at people booing a heel in wrestling. My point really is just that it’s been pretty entertaining recently!

          • I agree. I was just trying to point out that everyone (correctly) piling on about how dumb these players have been doesn’t necessarily mean the episodes were terrible. I think some people are seeing criticism of the players’ moves and mistaking it for criticism of the season/episode.

            (I should clarify that it’s also possible to hate the episode/season because you can’t stand how poorly these people are playing.)

          • Other Scott

            I’m pretty sure Andy thinks this episode was terrible at the very least

          • Spoiler: Yes.

      • That is how you decide who is captain for the actual challenge, not the actual challenge itself.

  • Prom King

    Its been fun reading people melt down about this episode! Personally I loved it, especially live tribal. But then I’m an idiot who loved Gabon so that pretty much says it all in a nutshell. If the whole season had been like this episode then it would have crossed over into Nicaragua or Wolds Apart territory for me, but so far I’ve low-key enjoyed the underwhelming pre-merge and have really enjoyed the post-merge. Purple Rock is usually all about the strategy and about supporting fun, non-asshole type players who are genuinely good with strategy and the social game, so I get why this episode must have been the worst kind of trainwreck for most people here.

    But Ben and Chrissy are fun characters to me, despite also being jerks. There’s different sides to both of them and I really appreciate how they aren’t two-dimensional villains like say Joe. And I love the jerks as long as they don’t cross over into Nicaragua-level jerkiness. The back and forth between those two and other characters was fantastic despite the severe strategic fail demonstrated by pretty much everyone. That shot of Ben lurking behind the trees while his three alliance mates talked about him was classic. Those kinds of scenes are the main reason why I watch Survivor; strategy comes second.

    Also I teared up at the family visit. Clearly I’m the worst sort of Survivor fan! I should just exile myself to Survivor Facebook, sigh.

    EDIT: although I did really, really, really hate that family “challenge”. That was the worst.

    • DrVanNostrand

      I think a fair review of this episode would be, “If you loved Gabon, you’ll love this episode!”

    • ivrdolj1

      Joe wasn’t a two-dimensional villain.

      Agree with the rest.

  • Well that was effing stupid.

    Hey, at least reddit was wrong!

  • When Devon gave up immunity and said Ashley having it was just as good as him, I immediately announced ‘that’s it, Devon’s going home’.

    Luckily for my pick-4, Lauren then did something even dumber.

  • So: if Ben wins the stupid blind-luck reward challenge rather than Chrissy, does this episode ever happen?

    I feel like Ben was already emotionally vulnerable, and losing out on that time with his wife probably emotionally destabilised him (and created some sort-of-warranted extra paranoia when Chrissy got a chance to work Ashley over) in a way that would never have happened if the core four got to spend a nice afternoon bonding together alongside their loved ones.

    Maybe Ryan or Chrissy or Mike ends up finding the idol instead, but fwiw I think the Stupidest Challenge Ever is possibly directly responsible for Lauren’s exit. (Honourable mention to the assist from Lauren for two of the Stupidest Plays Ever in tandem – leaving the advantage at camp, and giving Mike half the idol).

    • The Lauren/Mike play has its defenders. But the advantage is so stupid. Do we have confirmation on if it is dead now?

      • I’d assume it’s like if you get voted out and leave an immunity idol back at camp – it doesn’t matter if someone else finds it, they can’t use it.

        • Hornacek

          I assume that as soon as that person gets voted out, someone from Production goes to camp and takes away the advantage/idol.

    • Ms. Sweaterfan

      Super interesting thought. If Ben had won the reward challenge I think he would have probably gone home this episode. I assume he would have chosen Lauren, Devon and Ashley for the reward, leaving Chrissy and Ryan with Mike. They probably would have found the idol and worked on a plan to convince the new majority to take out Ben.

      • And Ben would have felt safe because he had his alliance and would not have played his idol.

        • I’m not convinced Ben wouldn’t have played his idol. If he got a whiff of any of his alliance flipping (and we now know they have dreadful poker faces) he’d have played the idol. If Ryan/Chrissy/Mike had failed to convince someone to flip and just played an idol, Ben has to play his too.

          I do think that the family reward all together would have made Ashley/Lauren/Devon less likely to flip (that episode at least).

          • Yeah, I think they say “Let’s wait on Ben until next time” because he is not doing that great in immunity challenges.

          • And also because completing the execution of your current plan before destablising your entire alliance and /leaving dangerous players who are not on your side in the game/ is entirelytherightmovegodwhyarethesepeoplesodumb

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            TBF, though, we hammered Ryan and Chrissy for thinking they could do just that.

  • Probst is happy with the marble challenge. According to his interview with Wigler, “”With the loved ones, we wanted to try something different…Something very simple that would involve the loved ones actually participating, and ideally something that would speak to the connection of family. Our amazing challenge department came up with a very simple game that we tested many, many times to try and find the right balance. Survivor is all about taking risks, and we force ourselves to do the same thing as evidenced here…I was happy with it. We very well may revisit that again with a variation on the theme.”

    I feel like this is not the right lesson to learn from this challenge.

    • Ms. Sweaterfan

      I personally also thought the challenge was stupid, but if I try really hard I can kind of see two advantages: 1) it made for some really good closeup shots of Survivors and their loved ones being emotional 2) it was impossible to throw (I personally think the correct strategy is probably to throw this challenge, but I can see the producers thinking this is a plus)

      • But there are other ways to do this like Word Association or a How Well Do You Know Your Loved One-style game.

        • Ms. Sweaterfan

          And those would def be way more fun to watch. I really don’t know what they were thinking with this one :/

        • Maritimer

          Exactly. Do the Pearl Islands challenge if this is your goal

          • The Pearl Island challenge is so iconic, why not replicate it somewhat?

          • Purplerockmatt

            right then we can see which loved one is someone they met at the airport on the way to the island

          • Cough Darrah Cough

      • DrVanNostrand

        #1 is not an advantage.

    • Which while I disagree with Probst, I can see his point of how this gets more time with the loved ones. It is a shame then that this time was when spend the least amount of time with them in a while.

      • I agree with that. In the past four seasons with loved ones, there has only been only 1 really meaningful loved ones visit (not challenge) which is MvGX (sure Cirie and her son/Monica, but yeah, no). When they merge so early, they have to have loved ones with a fairly big crew. That means less time with the loved ones either in camp or at the reward.

        • Actually yes – the show wasn’t really interested in any of those loved ones interactions, was it? It was purely about Chrissy’s attempt to flip Ashley, and then Lauren’s idol find back on the beach.

      • Alycia Swift

        Getting more time with the loved ones – they could have accomplished that by making them participate in a real challenge like they used to. I realize the caliber of the loved ones’ skills (athletic level) vastly differed but tough.

        • Diego Armando

          Why not have them do the Newlywed Game Challenge from Pearl Islands; that was hilarious.

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          Exactly. Probst is spinning a false choice. We learned plenty about Darrah and her “boyfriend”, Colby and his brother, Cochran and his mom, etc etc BECAUSE of the challenge.

    • Roswulf

      Eh, at least he’s saying at the end “We are not going to do this same challenge again”

      I am amused by the idea of them testing this challenge over and over for balance.

      “By god, the person in first position keeps losing! Lets paint the rocks a different color!”

      • I just wish he treated it the way he treated the reward challenge that ended up being the end of Joe’s game in KR.

      • I spent the first half of this challenge convinced that it was rigged for Ben to win, and everyone else was holding a bag of white rocks against their partner’s bag of black rocks, and vice versa.

        Chrissy disproved that theory, obviously.

        • i and 1

          Yeah, I was pretty sure the first round would end with everyone losing and discovering that the loved ones and players all had bags of same-colored rocks, and we would then move on to some sort of rock wagering or rock throwing type game. Because I never imagined it could really possibly be what it actually was.

          • Roswulf

            My girlfriend was immediately horrified by the challenge, and I reassured her that this must be part of an “asking questions about loved ones” thing or something.

            And then she was smug and we were both annoyed.

          • Ms. Sweaterfan

            I talked through Jeff’s initial explanation (if there even was one??) and so when they started getting eliminated from the challenge right off the bat I was like “what? what’s happening? this can’t be it!” So stupid.

          • My wife was all excited to see if she could match my answers, because she thought it was going to be that as well.

        • purplerockandy

          SAME!

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          It’s too trivial to get worked up about, but the fact that they prepped 14 individual bags, rather than two bags of 14 marbles each, is super-fishy.

    • BadPlayer91

      I need to apply for the “amazing challenge department,” because I could rattle off a dozen better challenges to get the loved ones involved…

      For example: Have it be each player CHOOSES a marble, and you see if they match when revealed. Then at least there is some element of choice rather than just random chance.

      • purplerockandy

        Yeah, the problem there is that a collection of 14 Americans will just continue to choose the white marble.

    • Diego Armando

      Why not have them turn their backs to the other and allow each person to decide what color marble to pick. At least that way there’s some base strategy.

    • Hornacek

      In his EW.com column today, Dalton Ross asked Jeff about this challenge. He said “This originated from a simple problem of too much story and not enough time in the episode. We only have 43 minutes in a one-hour episode. You have to carefully allocate where the time goes. We wanted to involve the loved ones but we didn’t want it to take as long as a full-on challenge because we wanted to have plenty of time for the actual love.”

      So … this would make sense if almost every previous season didn’t have a loved ones visit with a full challenge taking up a normal amount of time. This explanation only makes sense if they had filmed these 3 days with a usual loved ones challenge taking up the usual amount of time, and after the tribal Production realized “We need to cut something down to leave in all this pre-tribal and tribal craziness. I know! We’ll go back and redo the loved ones challenge, this time making it something that’ll only take a couple of minutes.”

      • Max_Jets

        Not really. They want to have more time to show the loved ones rewards, because in these episodes you need to fit in their visits AND shifting gameplay. The loved ones visit ended up being glossed over anyways though because of everything else happening in the episode.

        • Hornacek

          But as they were planning out this season’s challenges and preparing to go film this loved ones challenge, why would Production say “We have to make this a short challenge because there is going to be so much more before the next tribal that we have to include in the aired episode”? They would have no way of knowing this – at that point there was just as much likelihood of it being a Pagoning-vote with either Chrissy, Ryan or Dr. Mike getting voted out by the majority.

          Jeff’s explanation only works if they knew in advance of the chaos that was going to take place 2 days later before (and at) tribal.

          • Max_Jets

            They want the loved ones visit to take up more time. “Shifting” was the wrong word for me to use – obviously they didn’t know what would happen – but they have to focus on game and loved ones any time they do the loved ones visit but they only have 43 minutes. They will likely try to use a similarly short challenge for loved ones in future seasons.

          • Hornacek

            It just doesn’t make sense that in every loved ones challenge before this, the challenge has taken up a normal amount of time, and the editors worked around that to put it into the episode. It doesn’t make sense for them to say “We have to have a much shorter challenge before this day of filming” because they suspect they’ll have more strategy talk to fill up this episode.. They should *always* be thinking this during filming. There is no way they could have known (unless the show has hired a psychic) that this episode would have to have a lot more time devoted to pre-tribal strategy so they would deliberately plan and enact this short of a challenge.

          • Max_Jets

            It’s not about this season! It’s a realization that maybe things have been too rushed in the past in episodes with loved ones visits and they wanted to cut down time on the challenge to both focus on the loved ones and the game itself for the episode. Maybe it’s needed especially in the later (HvV on) seasons because of how fast the game moves.

          • Hornacek

            The show has done fine for 34 seasons having reward challenges with a normal amount of time, and then the editors take that reward challenge, the accompanying immunity challenge, strategy talk, and tribal council, and edit them together into a 43 minute episode. What if the show says “There’s going to be too much other great stuff that will go in this episode, we have to have a very short reward challenge”, then they do that, and then nothing else exciting happens – it’s just a Pagoning-type of vote? Then the show says “Man, I wish we hadn’t done that short reward challenge – why did we think there was going to be lots of other great footage?”

            It just doesn’t make sense to plan out a shorter reward challenge unless you already know that there is going to be other footage that you want to air. And they can’t be 100% sure of that. We’ve seen enough boring episodes where nothing interesting happens after the challenges and before tribal.

            The only time it makes sense for the show to plan to have shorter reward challenges like this would be in the first few episodes of a 3-tribe season, because they know they want to include more camp-life footage of the 3 tribes. And the show goes one step further and doesn’t have any reward challenges in these episodes.

          • Max_Jets

            TO MAKE MORE TIME FOR THE LOVED ONES REWARD – TO FOCUS MORE ON THE FOOTAGE OF THE LOVED ONES ENTRANCE AND THE FOOTAGE OF THEM AT CAMP
            The loved ones at camp was still glossed over, because of everything else that happened in the episode, but that was the goal.
            Are you reading what I’m writing?

          • Hornacek

            But what you’re describing happens every season. With that logic, they should make every reward challenge so that it only takes place 2 minutes because they should assume there will be enough footage at camp and at tribal that they will want to air so they don’t want the reward challenge to take up too much time.

            There was no way this particular season that they would have known when this challenge was about to take place that it would have to be a shorter challenge because they would have lots more camp and tribal footage for this episode. Unless they’re psychic, they would not know that. There was just as much of a chance that they did this extra-short challenge, and nothing interesting happened at camp or at tribal, and then they would be saying “Man, this episode is short – I wish we had done a normal-sized reward challenge.”

            For 34 season, the show has done normal-sized challenges, recorded everything at camp and tribal, and then picked the best to put in the episode. When they’re out on the island filming this, they have no idea if there’s going to be interesting things happening tomorrow that will take up the majority of the episode.

      • DrVanNostrand

        Loved ones visits are stupid anyway. Cut out half of the hysterical crying garbage, and everyone talking about how their loved one is the “greatest person I’ve ever met”. Then you can fit in a real fucking challenge.

        • Hornacek

          Why do you hate love?

    • UseYourCommonSense

      That challenge sucked.

  • Spergatory

    On the bright(ish) side, the only thing Devon did wrong this week was make it clear he’s part of a duo, and it didn’t even matter. I’m pretty sure Devon could snap Ryan’s neck in front of everyone at this point and they would all just be like “oh, that Devon, he’s such a card!” He’s somehow invisible to everyone’s threat radar, despite the fact that he is a universally beloved bronze Adonis.

    Honestly, I don’t even think giving up the immunity challenge was a mistake because it makes the target bigger on Ashley as the only two-time immunity winner of the season.

    • i get the definite impression Devon doesn’t really want to win immunity that much and put a target on himself. And…somehow it’s working?

    • Maritimer

      If he’d just quietly “accidentally” dropped his disc and told Ashley later he threw it, it would have been fine. But somehow being public didn’t even burn him. I feel like it ends up burning Ashley in the end somehow

      • Alycia Swift

        As it usually does with the women. Remember she was targeted back at the beginning instead of JP.

        • Maritimer

          Its usually the male at this point, because “challenge threats” (versus premerge where its “challenge asset”). But I guess Ashley would be the challenge threat of the pair

    • Hornacek

      “I’m pretty sure Devon could snap Ryan’s neck in front of everyone at this point and they would all just be like ‘oh, that Devon, he’s such a card!'”

      So, Devon for president?

  • Taako From Teevhii

    @sharculese:disqus are you down to co-write the video post with @barbarathewitch:disqus ?

  • gouis

    But edgic told me Lauren was winning????

    • Kemper Boyd

      Edgic is the worst.

      • Max_Jets

        I like how people trash edgic on this website while other people are basically doing edgic (without the name) in other threads.

        • Purplerockmatt

          let me just say that there is difference between trying to read and guess the edit the show is presenting and listening to and categorizing the music cues to support a reading of the edit that you want to believe

          • Max_Jets

            Sure, but the music cues ARE part of the edit and the “that you want to believe” part would be a flaw in the person “using” it, not the system, just like regular ol’ edit reading. Same shit, different name.

          • Purplerockmatt

            of course and my objection with edgic has always been its pretensions at impartiality not the hubris of trying to read the edit

          • Maritimer

            Nobody here pretends its an exact science though, that’s always the part that has bothered me. That they think know the secret key to the edit and will know the winner before anyone else

          • Max_Jets

            & I believe a lot of edgic users don’t either!

          • Maritimer

            Probably true. I mean, as I’ve shown, i do go read the Edgic stuff. But the dominant voices in that community certainly do (and have a tendency to shout down opposing views) and that’s kind of who I’m mocking

          • Purplerockmatt

            also never forget that a lot of edgicers are spoiled

          • Maritimer

            Yes, that too. A lot of their “exact science” is based on already knowing who wins and fitting their “analysis” to that, and that’s when it destroys seasons. I intended to fully avoid it this season until it got pointed out somewhere that they clearly had no idea who the winner would be

          • Max_Jets

            Which also affects people who aren’t spoiled because they start to believe the narrative being pushed by the spoiled.

          • Maritimer

            *cough* Kaoh Rong *cough*

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            It’s the rigid, formulaic thinking that’s grating as well. Like shots of a snake must mean the person in the next shot is supposed to be the villain and can’t possibly just be cool B-roll, or the edit “protects” the winner by hiding their mistakes, as if Mike Holloway or Adam don’t exist.

          • Max_Jets

            I mean, I do think Mike was pretty protected and I join the ridiculous club of people that think that maybe the editors genuinely were trying to throw people off with Adam’s win (not of the “edgic” crowd, but people who can read an edit). But it’s similar to the way people pick out little things that happen in novels or movies – maybe the author or director intended it to be significant, maybe they didn’t. That’s never been my cup of tea, but some people find it interesting.

        • Kemper Boyd

          Shut. Your. Hole

        • Hornacek

          This, except replace “science” with “edgic”.

          http://loltheists.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/flanders-.jpg

        • Prom King

          I am definitely one of those hypocrites. I mean if the rest of Survivor fans did edgic correctly like I do, then I’d be fine with them!

        • DrVanNostrand

          The problem is edgic is wrapping up these completely subjective analyses in pseudo data analytic language so the dumb edgicers can pretend that they’re fucking Nate Silver. They’re not. What they do is virtually identical to the general edit-reading that we do. I have no quarrel with any edgicer who grasps that, and just likes to use edgic as a way to organize their thoughts.

    • Maritimer

      Go read the Edgic board right now. Its a disaster and its hilarious

      • gouis

        I wouldn’t wish that upon my worst enemy.

        • Maritimer

          There are threads that are basically “since its not Lauren it must be X” for each of the players left (and one titled “In defense of Lauren’s winner’s edit”). I like watching things burn.

          • Purplerockmatt

            my god i need to see this. This is what i live for

          • Kemper Boyd

            please do screenshots.

          • Maritimer
          • Purplerockmatt

            doing the lord’s work. also this shows how bullshit edgic is, they aren’t even applying their own criteria! just going off gut!

          • Maritimer

            They are literally just making it up at this point

          • sharculese

            They were always just making it up.

          • Maritimer

            Well, yeah, but making it up while following made up criteria at least

          • Kemper Boyd

            This is everything.

          • I stole some of these to post on Twitter. Trolling the edgic crowd might be the thing that gets me into this season.

          • Kemper Boyd

            this is the anti-edgic crowd.

          • Maritimer

            If anything will, its trolling

          • purplerockandy

            TAP IT INTO MY VEINS!!!

          • Diego Armando

            TAKE THAT EDGIC! FRIEND DIEGO KNEW ADAM WIN EARLY HIS SEASON!

          • Ms. Sweaterfan

            Because of this post I actually went to reddit to see what people were saying. I HOPE YOU’RE HAPPY

          • Maritimer

            I was trying to save people from going over there!

          • Purple Rock Emma

            “edgically hidden” jesus christ

          • Maritimer

            Possibly my favourite part about the Edgic people is that they think Survivor specifically takes them into consideration when making editing decisions

          • Hornacek

            Are you saying “Jesus Christ” reacting to reading “edgically hidden”? Or is there a Jesus Christ analogue (i.e. Devon) that is “edgically hidden”?

          • Maritimer

            Here’s a fun sampling, in a second post because I’m only so capable. The only person they don’t seriously consider is Ryan

          • Purplerockmatt

            Ha because I personally am thinking Ryan is the winner

          • Maritimer

            There’s a thread that Ryan is obviously a losing finalist I didn’t capture there, but nobody over there thinks he’s the winner, when I’m with you, he’s just as in contention as most of these people (Devon’s still my number one)

          • Kemper Boyd

            Lolz.

          • Diego Armando

            Weird. I have thought Ryan was winning for a long time (prior to last week and even then I didn’t write him off).

          • Maritimer

            Yeah, but they hate Ryan. So obviously he can’t be the winner

          • Diego Armando

            Wow.

            I have the answer for them. No one is getting a Winner’s Edit.

          • BadPlayer91

            BUT HOW WILL WE KNOW WHO THE WINNER IS?!?!?!

          • Kemper Boyd

            I like that Edgic acts like the season ends before the finale and it’s the only way to know which of the final 5 wins.

          • Maritimer

            Right. Winner’s Edit only happens in specific situations. Somebody here is getting a lower case winner’s edit, but that’s the point, we aren’t supposed to know who is going to win

          • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

            It’s because survivor was trying to trick them!

      • sharculese

        Holy shit, there’s a Lauren subreddit. What is wrong with these people?

        • Maritimer

          I hadn’t even noticed that before. That’s certainly…something. They’ve been obsessed with Lauren for quite a while but a dedicated subreddit … I don’t know what to say about that

    • Even when I was high on Lauren, the lack of somewhat personal content was glaring.

    • UseYourCommonSense

      Lol…that was just superfan wishful thinking.

  • Ms. Sweaterfan

    So some of the talk downthread about how both Ben and Chrissy seem to be getting negative edits got me thinking. I really tried to rack my brains to think if there’s anyone left who hasn’t gotten a villainous edit, a dodo edit or an invisible edit, and I came up with an answer that I’m not happy with. I think it’s Ryan, guys.

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      #BellHope

    • Mike Hirsch

      It could happen.

    • I think we got a villainous vibe from him. He’s getting called weasel, he’s dismissive of the 25 year old surfers, etc. The only problem with his edit is that we don’t have anything personal that isn’t “I am a virginal nerd”.

      • Mike Hirsch

        Which he keeps mentioning.

        • Purplerockmatt

          what if that was the sympathetic, endearing, personal content we are getting to humanize the Ryan winner’s edit?

          • sharculese

            That would be like if “Spencer-tron 5000 learns to love” was the humanizing part of Spencer’s winner’s edit.

          • Purplerockmatt

            exactly. so it’s totally happening. Ryan is winning

          • But (we assume) Spencer did get laid. Ryan has not.

          • Mike Hirsch

            Probst doesn’t understand basic human emotions, so this could be a good point. Maybe he thinks this is appealing!

          • sharculese

            There’s no way Probst finds Ryan talking about how he can’t get laid appealing. I’m sure he’s constantly thinking about good it would feel to put that nerd in a headlock and give him a good noogie.

          • purplerockandy

            I disagree. Ryan is playing so hard into Jeff’s worldview of what a nerd is that Jeff HAS to be loving it. It’s important to remember that America’s most popular TV show is about nerd stereotypes.

      • Prom King

        There’s only one real weasel this season and that’s Dr. Weasel to you!

        I agree, though.

    • This is so disrespectful to Strategy King Devon.

      • We sorta got a little bit of a comeuppance edit last week though.

  • Would you all rather have a season that is very bleak with few bright spots (like Game Changers) or a mediocre season with brief signs of fantastic game play snuffed as quickly as Lauren’s torch?

    • BadPlayer91

      Is there a third option that is just good, high quality Survivor?

    • Kemper Boyd

      this is a hard decision. The issue is no game play has been more than a sliver of a possibility of good. I can’t decide.

    • Blurry Denzel

      The latter has made me angry at times while the former has made me angry AND sad while watching Survivor. I’ll take this season over GC.

    • Roswulf

      The weaselly but true answer is “it depends”.

      For me I think it comes down to the overall arc. I care a lot about who wins when I evaluate a season. A bleak season with a few bright spots….and a satisfying winner is something I like a lot. The bleakness makes the end all the more satisfying. Think Fiji.

      A bleak season that ends with the darkness closing is another matter altogether.

      • Assistant Dragon Slayer

        Sarah was unsatisfying from an entertainment perspective, but she completely deserved the win based on gameplay. That’s almost certainly not the case with the winner of this season.

        • Roswulf

          Sure, I didn’t mean to imply otherwise.

          For me, I care much more about liking the *story* that ends with a player winning than player skill. Give me Mike’s flailing-but-noble victory in Worlds Apart over Sarah’s competent death march of the boring alliance any day of the week.

        • Prom King

          If Ben or Chrissy win, I will be satisfied. Their gameplay has been erratic and often unnecessarily personal, but still better than pretty much any other cast member this season.

    • Harvey Dent

      I like this season a lot for its utterly chaotic gameplay and moves that makes little sense at all while having pretty good characters. Granted I like Gabon and think Nicaragua is fun, so eh.

      • Harvey Dent

        Also to add on…when it’s super obvious who wins like it was with Game Changers, the season starts to just drag

      • i and 1

        This episode had someone overhear something, get suspicious and react, and then resulting scheming with some static thrown in by the interests and schemes of the desired swing votes, secrets both solid and blown, overconfidence, plan b’s, improvisation, a never seen before (by me anyhow) caso of one player blindsiding the entirety of their tribemates who were unanimously voting to evict. A dumb challenge, yes, but otherwise there was a lot going on.

        Naturally a Survivor discussion board is going to respond generally with a focussed critique of gameplay, but for me while watching I am fine with this sort of episode, a big fan in fact of all the different motives, mistakes and schemes and secrets and surprises.

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          It’s more exciting that it was before, that’s for sure. But that’s a low bar considering that it was unanimous votes in the tribe phase and a Pagonging right after the merge. And last night was exciting in the sense that at error-filled 14-12 little league game is exciting. Give me a 1-0 major league game every time.

      • Prom King

        YES! Minus the Nicaragua part.

        • Harvey Dent

          Nicaragua is such a colossal mess and everyone is so terrible in a fun way that I like it. It’s not like One World where people are just unpleasant and awful to watch besides a few, there’s something fun about NaOnka that isn’t there with Coulton. Though I understand the hate.

          • Prom King

            There are parts that I enjoyed, mainly having to do with Chase, Brenda, Holly, and I suppose Jane (pre-merge). But there’s so much that was excruciating to watch. The low blows were constant and they were all over the season. It was tiring to me. I do agree that NaOnka is slightly more fun than Colton. Although also slightly less impressive than Colton (as a player).

    • Max_Jets

      If Mike wins, I will take Game Changers.

      • Lira2012

        Let it be so.

      • Blurry Denzel

        Mike seems nice but Mike winning would be a horrific ending for me. I can’t sell myself on Mike as a winner. He’s done so many bad game moves and is delusional about his ability to play.

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          I may be guilty of the kind of “If not Lauren than it must be X” thinking happening on Reddit that is discussed downthread, but I see path to victory for Mike that is both highly plausible and fits with what Probst has said about how this season ends. I don’t have time to lay it all out now but I will in the podcast comments unless someone else does it first. tl;dr it’s a pretty horrific ending.

          • Blurry Denzel

            I also see the path for Mike to win and I don’t want it at all.

          • Maritimer

            I don’t even think that line of thinking is wrong. She was definitely a viable winner candidate, so is she was your frontrunner, you need a new one. Its mostly the fact that it turned into a clusterfuck over there that I’m mocking. You can draw the path for any of them at this point (though I really hope its not Mike)

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            No the mistake I’m referring to is immediately latching onto one candidate and stanning for their scenario without considering the others.

          • Maritimer

            Oh, yeah, that’s only acceptable when you pick the candidate by randomizer

        • UseYourCommonSense

          He would be a horrible winner absolutely.

    • Diego Armando

      I don’t know. I think Game Changers is better than this. It had some really good gameplay and a lot of Sandra, Cirie and Michaela.

      • Those would be the bright spots.

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          Officer Sarah played a fantastic game and clearly earned her win. That’s not on the menu this season.

          • indescribable hat

            Ah, I feel fonder of her just hearing that nickname in Cirie’s voice in my head.

    • Crappy

      I will take this season over Game changers. The latter was a bigger disappointment given the anticipation and expectation I had for my favs doing well. There is no redeeming GC after that F3. I don’t care about Sarah’s ‘great’ plays either.

    • Hornacek
  • giorgos

    I hate Nicaragua as much as the next person but really not getting the hate for this season at this point. Last episode was very exciting, the 2 just before were even better. The show has been very fun and exciting for 3 straight hours and we’re in the endgame. Nicaragua was soul-crushing. Not because it didn’t have good strategy, but because of everything. I think people kinda forgot how bad it was.

    • Blurry Denzel

      I think the last three hours of this season has been very exciting but I can’t help but be annoyed by the majority of players completely botching how Survivor is played. No one is hateable here so it’s already way ahead of Nicaragua. I felt shitty watching that season at times.

      • giorgos

        I don’t think they are so horrible at Survivor, they ‘re not great either, but it’s been fun watching them for the last few episodes. After the similar late-merge spike in quality I think this season is like SJDS with a much better final8 cast but no Natalie.

        • Blurry Denzel

          I think I would much rather have the Natalie slaying fools option.

          • giorgos

            HHH also doesn’t have the most bland power couple in survivor history to dominate the screentime. Even Ashley from HHH is riveting television next to Jon-Jaclyn.

            Also Baylor-Crissy. My god that 4 person alliance was the all time boring alliance ever.

          • Max_Jets

            Oof, I don’t think I can agree with that. I think Jon and Jaclyn are remembered as more bland than they were. Neither are super compelling, but I might give both of them the edge over Ashley.

          • They are the very definition of the parts being greater than the sum

          • Max_Jets

            Though weirdly the reverse is true for them as players.

          • I think Jaclyn had some chops that were drastically muted by Jon.

          • Max_Jets

            Jaclyn was the (too often disregarded) brains and Jon was the social player.

          • Other Scott

            HOW DARE YOU?!?

          • There you are!

          • Hornacek

            WHO’S BIG JON NOW???

          • Blurry Denzel

            I agree with you on that and that overall the Triple H final 8 is better than SJDS. But having someone playing the perfect “resumé building” game while be such a dynamic personality like Natalie had me on a high after episodes and anticipating Wednesdays in a way this season can’t.

        • Harvey Dent

          no Natalie OR Keith (though Lauren is probably better than anyone else by a large margin)

          • Kemper Boyd

            or Missy who was frankly bossing the game.

          • Hornacek

            Until that make-a-wish kid hobbled her.

          • 👏 Lauren 👏 left 👏 her 👏 advantage 👏 back 👏 at 👏 camp 👏

          • Harvey Dent

            well yeah but she still has my heart

          • Update: Apparently that was bullshit, if you believe her exit interviews today.

          • Is she claiming she brought it with her but then didn’t use it, despite the clusterfuck that that vote was? I’m not sure that’s much better honestly.

          • Oh, it’s not better. It’s decidedly worse. And yes, that’s exactly what she’s claiming.

          • [insert world-weary expletive of choice here]

          • Prom King

            Well she’s certainly honest at least!

          • i and 1

            If she would have used it on someone besides Ben, but she could’ve used her regular one against someone else in that case I guess. I dunno, I’m not sure if there’s a lot of scenarios where it wouldn’t have been a waste, but maybe better safe than sorry if the TC discussions seemeduncertain to her.

          • Hornacek

            I think if she had used her extra vote, she would have just voted for Ben. For all the vote-splits done earlier post-merge, no one at this tribal seemed to have any idea that Ben *might* have an idol.

          • DrVanNostrand

            Then she’s even dumber.

    • Prom King

      Co-signed. Although people definitely have not forgotten how bad Nicaragua was!

  • I’m starting to really feel for Devon, who does seem to at least have a reasonable head for strategy, and has now been stuck spending multiple episodes trying to talk people out of their Effing Stupid Plans without fully letting his surfer bro persona drop too far.

  • Ms. Sweaterfan

    Since I’ve already dabbled a bit in winner speculation, I’ve decided to just dive in and share my assessments of all the remaining players:

    Ryan – has been very present in the edit this season, though authentic personal content has been minimal. Talks up his own strategic and social game skills a ton but hasn’t shown us anything good for a while. Unclear how much people actually like him, though he’s really only gotten negative content from Devon, if I recall correctly. Unlikely winner, but I can see a path, especially if he plays up the underdog thing.

    Mike – also very present in the edit, and with a fair amount of personal content. We know about his job, his wife, his kids, the fact that he’s a longtime fan. Has had some spectacularly bad strategic whiffs. People don’t seem to respect his game at all, but they seem mostly neutral on him as a person. Has lots of former allies on the jury and really didn’t screw anyone over, so if he makes it to FTC he may have a shot but his path there will be very difficult. Also, it’s entirely possible that he could make it to FTC and be seen as too much of a buffoon to receive any votes.

    Devon – went pretty quiet for a while there in the middle. Has had almost no personal content. Seems super chill and under the radar; nobody dislikes him as far as I can tell. Has had some content recently talking up his game skills almost to the point of bragging. I genuinely don’t see winner potential in Devon so far, but I’m frequently very wrong about these things. If he makes it to FTC and nails his performance, he could have a shot.

    Chrissy – Very prominent in the edit and has had tons of personal content, however she began taking a turn toward villainhood early on and doesn’t seem to have recovered at all. Also apparently people have lots of bad stuff to say about her in exit interviews (which I don’t generally listen to). Talks up her own strategic and social games a lot but the actual results have been shown to be less successful than she thinks. Has a tough path to FTC and lots of haters on the jury. Her odds seem very low, but her edit gives me hope. Also she is the sole remaining player on both of my fantasy teams so I need her to win.

    Ben – Very prominent in the edit and has had probably the most personal content of anyone, and most compelling back story by far. Has a mean and vindictive streak that has not been hidden, but his recent targets have been Joe and Chrissy, who are both less well liked than him. In game it seems like he is the biggest winner threat, but I don’t see how the group lets him through to FTC. I also really feel like his edit would be more purely heroic if he were the winner, but during my brief and unpleasant perusal of r/survivor I saw someone speculate that the show might have presented his PTSD as an excuse for his bad behavior. Not sure that I buy this, but it’s a thought.

    Ashley – Spent most of the early game very under the radar (except for a blip at the beginning) until the big Lauren-led flip a couple eps ago. Has had little personal content and was shown to be easily provoked by Joe (though that’s easy to write off as being Joe’s problem). Has been killing it in post-merge challenges and has had a lot more strategic content lately, especially with regard to her tight alliance with Devon. Nobody’s gunning for her yet, though I’m sure they’ll realize that she’s a challenge threat and generally well-liked soon enough. She’ll have a tough path to the FTC, and if she’s up against some combination of Ben and/or Devon she’ll probably have a tough time getting the jury on her side, but I think she probably beats everyone else if she gets there.

    Conclusions: I have no idea what will happen or who will win. After going through this whole exercise, I think that an Ashley win would make me the happiest. She’s got a chance, but I’m not super optimistic. The only person that would genuinely shock me as the winner is Mike, but even that isn’t totally out of the question at this point.
    Given the remaining players and the edit so far, I’m willing to call the shot that the winner is going to be unpleasant to people in some way – whether that means they’re considered unlikable, dumb or invisible. That doesn’t necessarily narrow the field at all, but it does make me less likely to put anyone remaining in the 0% club quite yet.

    • Crappy

      Ryan: Game position wise he can win, edit wise while he has not been portrayed negatively so far, I don’t think we are seeing the game from his perspective at all. I think he can be F4 finisher at best

      Mike – If not for his pre merge edit, I think Mike would be fav to win this right now. His edit since his idol play episode has been super strong. I also think he wins if he makes FTC, healers would have vote for him 100% IMO and there is enough animosity between other herslers now that either they split the votes between 2 or he gets some of the votes. Still can’t see him winning though. I can see him going out next week.

      Devon – I think he has got to be the front runner now. His pre merge was’t great but he also was not as absent as Mike. I also had the feeling since the beginning that a hustler would win. Game position wise he can make the FTC easy. 3 tribals to go, him and Ashely are the tightest pair in the game alongside Chrissy and Ryan, Ben is a big target and so will be Mike. At best he has to win a fire challenge against Chrissy/Ryan.

      Chrissy- 100% FTC loser. Game position wise also she is good now given the core 4 imploded so badly but there has been too many negative comments about her. Even this episode we saw people diss her play as emotional and not logical. Moreover, other players don’t seem to like her. Even Ben at the start openly dissed her and rightly so IMO. I have defended her in the past but I don’t think she can handle things not going her way given her type A personality. As a “game bot” she is awfully bitter about anything that goes against her.

      Ben – I think he is getting the FF fallen angel edit. But I won’t be completely shocked now if he wins. A week back I was saying he won’t win 100% but now I can’t say that at all. Game position it is tough see him in F3. I also think casual viewers would expect him to win the final vote no matter what but I think there are enough people there who don’t like him. If it is indeed a tie at the end this season, then I can see him as being the person who loses that

      Ashely – FTC loser. Pretty sure about. Can’t win, she was way too absent at the early part of the merge. She and Devon should make FTC together IMO.

      My prediction right now is – Devon, Ashely and Chrissy in F3 with Devon winning out.

    • DrVanNostrand

      You’ve done a great job of subjectively evaluating everyone’s edit, but you haven’t made up any nonsense statistics OR made any outrageously confident predictions.

      Edgic score: 2/10

  • So Mike is somehow going to win this whole thing now, right? And he’ll sit there at the reunion and say “I was in control the whole time, I had this whole thing figured out from the beginning, every move I made was calculated and effective.”

    • Blurry Denzel

      He would say something like that too. That is darkest timeline.

      • “I’m crazy like a fox Jeff!”

        • Max_Jets

          Flames, on the side of my face

        • Purple Rock Emma

          I heard this in his voice.

    • Hornacek

      With Joe falling over in the jury from laughter.

      • That will really be the only good part about it.

    • DrVanNostrand

      He’s been playing 10-dimensional chess the whole time!

  • Marlin M.

    I dont see how Mike could possibly win. IMO Ben is definitely winning, Devon’s personal content is lacking and wouldn’t be surprised if they target next him week to separate him and Ashley.

    • Roswulf

      I don’t think anyone is definitely winning.

      I mean, one of these “definitely winning” groups is going to be right- someone is winning the season, and it almost certainly ain’t Ashley (sorry Ashley! I’m still pulling for you!).

      But this isn’t a season where the strategy or the storytelling provides us certainty. And that’s OK! Live in the uncertainty!

      On Ben specifically, his edit is very reminiscent of Brad Culpeppers from last season. Very present throughout, lots of personal stuff, lots of potential hero moments….and also lots of being a jerk. That can be a winning story…but it doesn’t have to be.

    • Assistant Dragon Slayer

      Ben goes next week. Either Devon or Ashley goes at 5 (whoever doesn’t win immunity), with Mike the coveted swing vote. Whoever wins the F4 challenge takes Mike as a goat. Mike sweeps the Healers vote and picks up bitter Herslers.

      • Marlin M.

        Jeff said next episode is even more crazy, I have a hard time seeing how Ben goes when that would just be a regular boot</spoiler

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          It could be a crazy route to a predictable outcome, like the Joe vote.

      • UseYourCommonSense

        No way, Ben is guaranteed Final 3.

      • Kemper Boyd

        I do not like this. Looking at Mike as a goat when there are 3 of his orig tribe on the jury and Lauren might vote for him over a Chrissy and Ryan F3 is straight up dumb. But this season is straight up dumb.

    • purplerockandy

      Michele had no personal content.

      • She’s a bartender and she doesn’t need carried, bro. What else do you need?

        • purplerockandy

          The best part was that she wasn’t even a bartender.

          • Yeah. It’s very “YouTube sensation” of Survivor to do that.

          • Something Quirky

            Wait, what?

          • Kemper Boyd

            When she put in her application she was a bartender but by the time she played she was a travel agent (didn’t know they still existed). She was once a girl who traveled with Ben Harper on tour and spoke to people about climate change.

          • Something Quirky

            Ah, okay. I was like what an odd thing to lie about.

          • Maritimer

            There are still lots of travel agents where I’m from. Every mall has at least one outlet. Also, Ben Harper is a very different person to me, a former PM’s son who I’m not sure believes in climate change so I was really confused why Michele would be travelling with him until Google informed me there’s another one

          • Hornacek

            What is it with Primer Ministers naming their sons “Ben” and them going on to be very annoying people?

          • Maritimer

            Its a part of our heritage

          • sharculese

            Travel agents are useful if you want to do a multi-destination trip. A couple years ago my family did a tour of Alaska where we spent two nights in Juneau, then drove up to Denali and stayed in the park for four days, then did a couple nights in Seward. At that point my brother and I flew back and the rest of them took a series of ferries to Seattle, where they flew back from.

            We could not have planned that on our own.

          • purplerockandy

            Not anymore. At the time of filming, she was a travel agent.

        • sharculese

          I would mention the time she ate a hamburger, but John ruined that.

      • DrVanNostrand

        I know this will upset @sharculese:disqus , but I can’t pass this one up: “Who?”

        • sharculese

          Nah, I’ve accepted that my bit has taken on a life of its own, like a baby bird whose learned to fly away.

    • UseYourCommonSense

      Ben is so obviously winning at this point.

      • SurvivorWerewolf(JTHelland)

        Wanna bet?

    • the sky is falling

      anyone facing Ryan and Chrissy in the FTC has a good chance to win.

  • Marlin M.

    Lauren said in one of her interviews that she had the extra vote in her pocket at tribal council.

  • purplerockandy

    So, true story: after last night’s episode I was so beaten down by the baffling stupidity on display that I didn’t think I’d be able to muster any enthusiasm for the podcast. No fire, no rage, just acceptance.

    I’m pleased to say that you’ve managed to draw it out of me. I’M HEATED. I’m gonna call John at work and get this podcast started now.

    • Marlin M.

      What did we do? Lol

      • Roswulf

        We committed the greatest of sins.

        We picked the wrong colored pebble from a bag.

    • Prom King

      I will believe it when I hear it!

    • sharculese

      Can we have an early holiday gift in the form of leaving in the cusses?

      • You want me to expend less effort as a gift? It’s a bold ask, but I’ll see what I can do.

      • purplerockandy

        I have… regrets.

  • DrVanNostrand

    Setting aside how dumb this episode was. This is actually an interesting point in the season right now. What are the major alliances? Devon+Ashley and Chrissy+Ryan. Ben was betrayed by literally everyone, but he seems to have a particular dislike for Chrissy. Ben and Mike doesn’t seem like a strong pair, but they may decide the next vote, and I’d bet on them going against Chrissy and Ryan.

    • Kemper Boyd

      I’m now assuming they can’t get together and it’s a 3-3 tie, then they both swap at the revote leaving a 3-3 tie. It goes to rocks and that’s the end of Mike.

      • Blurry Denzel

        Having Mike go home on a rock draw is entertaining but no way he doesn’t flip on the revote.

        • Kemper Boyd

          THEY BOTH FLIP. That’s how it happens. Ben and Mike both flip and it’s still a tie.

          • Blurry Denzel

            My reading comprehension was very subpar. You clearly mention them both flipping in the previous comment. My bad.

          • Kemper Boyd

            maybe the level of moron in this season, all four revoting flip.

  • Other Scott

    It’s way too late so I’ll put this on the podcast post as well, but I actually like Ben’s move to turn on the 4 – it’s the “move before people to expect you to” move and if the status quo stayed the same they were going to get him before they even voted out Ryan and Chrissy.

    The real question is – if he was going to do that WHAT THE HECK was he doing burning bridges with Chrissy? Like he had the vote on lock and the flip on lock, and then they go to Chrissy with it and she’s like “can we not?” Boom, turned around on you and you’re screwed.

    • The podcast and post for it will be up in about 30 minutes. Post this there, because I am very excited to have this conversation.

  • Hornacek

    Today in Survivor gossip, Richard Hatch announced that he and his husband Emiliano (?) are getting divorced. The reason this was announced on my local radio station this morning is because Hatch owns some property here in Nova Scotia, and this is where they got (legally) married.

  • Salz

    I just fucking love Devon. I love how he calmly stands up at tribal and speaks to Mike about why they should vote out Ben. He never bullies him or pressures him. Ben, Chrissy, and Ryan’s problem is that they don’t know how to talk to people like, I don’t know, normal decent humans?