Survivor Heroes vs Healers vs Hustlers Episode 6 Liveblog: “This is Why You Play Survivor”

Follow us on Twitter and Storify below for the sixth episode of Survivor: Heroes vs Healers vs Hustlers!

Matt
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Matt

Matt has an irrational dislike for all contestants named Michel(l)e. Also if he ever takes a strong stance about why everyone else is wrong, it is he that is inevitably wrong.

Favorite seasons: Micronesia, Heroes vs. Villains, Palau, Philippines, Pearl Islands, Cagayan
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927 thoughts on “Survivor Heroes vs Healers vs Hustlers Episode 6 Liveblog: “This is Why You Play Survivor”

  1. Y’all, apropos of nothing, I think there’s a strong argument to be made that Satan personally created durian, mosquitoes, and networking.

    And GO ASTROS!!! except Gurriel. Fuck him.

    1. If I wasn’t so lazy I’d find the gif of Russell going “it’s the Houston Astros baby”

  2. Big night with Survivor, World Series Game 7, and Porzingis about to score one million points against the Houston Rockets.

    1. You can’t mention Houston immediately after referencing the World Series and still mean the Rockets.

  3. Cole’s an ass. Like Ben doesn’t pull his weight in challenges? And Mike and Jessica don’t pull it through in the end with puzzles?

  4. Jessica needs to run away from this Cole alliance as fast as possible. Don’t get dragged down, girl.

      1. I actually laughed out loud at her this week. Not because she was being funny, but that her first move this week was to bitch.

      1. I think the edit was a bit weird to shame Cole for eating more than everyone and then note that he passed out from not eating enough

    1. You spelled awesome wrong. Edit: I dunno, just tryna manufacture caring for a couple of these players

  5. I would want Survivor pizza less than a jug of iced coffee, and I don’t even drink coffee.

  6. Sitting puzzle master Dr. Mike out makes sense since there’s no puzzles in this challenge and there may be one in the immunity challenge.

  7. These dudes are really feeling themselves when it comes to challenge prowess. I am not here for it.

    1. Come on now, BD. We all know only a big, burly bro could pull a piece of rubber backwards and then release it in a set direction.

  8. So do we think Joe found this idol “today” or did this actually happen immediately after the Alan tribal and the editors worked their magic?

    1. Didn’t he make some comment along the lines of finally finding the clue after 4 days? Could be mixing up my confessionals though.

        1. That would then basically confirm he found it the day after Alan’s boot since I doubt he waited several days to go dig up the idol.

  9. We hardly know Cole, and yet I feel like arguing with a nurse practitioner and a doctor about his health moments after passing out is Very Cole.

    1. Someone asked this previously, and our consensus was that he’s not clever enough to pull something like that.

    2. Having fainted before, I’d say that his reaction to wtf was happening was pretty spot on.

      1. My fainting has always been less dramatic than that. The tunnel vision and the ringing in the ears come first, so you sort of have time to tell people that you’re going to faint in advance

        1. I have had that happen to me, but I’ve also fainted a few times from coughing and running out of air. Once I hit the concrete with the back of my head and got a concussion. After seeing Cole faint on last week’s NTOS, I didn’t watch him fall this week. I was afraid he hit his head on the bamboo.

          1. The coughing and running out of air is why I fainted for the first time, and it scared the hell out of me. It was also a lot like Cole’s fall.

          1. Stuff that causes my blood pressure to drop – primarily phobia-inducing stuff like needles, but they’ve also been brought on my the lights being shone in my eyes at the opticians. It’s a similar sensation to what happens when you stand up too quickly and all the blood rushes out of your head though.

    1. That’s the same look Lauren gave when the pizza came out. And when they won immunity. And when Jeff introduced the season. And…

    1. What I like about it is that it’s primed to make people come back to came frustrated with each other.

  10. Do people realize that they can cut slack? They don’t need everyone making it white-knuckle taut.

  11. This is like a team version of the individual immunity challenge with the rope and spelling backwards with blocks.

  12. Feeling like we are maybe too hard on this season. So used to disgusting bullying or awful behavior that well behaved people seems boring. Shaping up nicely, imo

  13. Who will get voted out – Ali who has gotten a great edit so far, or JP who got his first confessional tonight in like forever?

  14. I’m LONGING for Ali to go to Chrissy, remind Chrissy that she could be next in line for what Ryan did to Ali last tribal, and take Ryan out. Not necessarily for strategic reasons, just because I’m beyond ready for Ryan to go.

    1. Eh. I don’t especially like Ryan but JP is just not interesting at all from what we’re seeing cut the dead weight. Have Ryan get blindsided in a funny way later.

        1. It could be but the way this episode was edited it would have been disappointing as the edit didn’t crap on Ryan enough to be funny. It would more just be confusing.

          1. I thought they might have been setting it up when he was being a z-grade choad before the first challenge, but nope.

      1. I don’t disagree, but I prefer boring JP to Ryan, who frequently hits my “actively interested in making life worse for people like me” buttons. It’s less fun for me to watch the show with him on it.

        (Edit: AND NOW I REGRET SAYING THIS before votes were read; sigh. Take JP!)

      1. This is interesting bc my Chrome extension changes all instances of the word “bellhop” to “butthole.” But I think I got this one by the context clues.

  15. Jesus, JP, make an augment that the concept of challenge beasts doesn’t hold. Talk about how you’re shit at puzzles or something, c’mon man.

      1. The only TV show that JP watches is Two Broke Girls. But he’s been meaning to catch up on Kevin Can Wait.

        1. As someone who watched that show until the bitter (and unexpected) end, I have to correct you and say it’s 2 Broke Girl$

          1. It’s a sad but true story. Once I start a show it takes a lot to get me to quit watching and not stick around until it’s finished.

        1. Oh! How dare Palsy besmirch the reputation of a stray dog!

          Pretty rich coming from a guy that hates inner city children is all I have to say.

          1. How dare you say I hate inner city children!

            I hate all children. Don’t paint me with the wrong brush.

      1. Didn’t you list four other names for returnee seasons? That’s already a quarter of the cast.

    1. This would never have happened if Ali hadn’t voted out Patrick.

      I mean, it might still have happened. But we would still have Patrick, and I can’t help feeling this season could really have done with more Patrick.

    2. I mean, she played a really shit game if we’re being honest. Yeah I definitely got attached to her, but she made a slew of questionable decisions for a pre-merge boot, and I can’t even think of one thing she did that I’d say was a good game decision. She’s charismatic though so that’s sometimes all you need, but otherwise let’s not pretend like she was some kind of savant.

      1. I agree that she wasn’t a great player. Nonetheless, she’s a personality you can root for, and she had a lot more characterization than a normal right-before-the-merge boot.

        1. Yeah, they definitely made it seem like they wanted her back, which fine. She’s prime fodder for a Second Chance 2 vote ’cause the show isn’t necessarily putting a pre-merge on for free, but she’d definitely clinch a spot and could pimp the hell out of that narrative.

        2. Ali’s characterization falls right in line with my observation that the modern seasons have been giving the post-swap pre-merge boots a lot of screentime (except for Monica, Terry, and Roark).

          1. Excluding GC for obvious reasons, the only person who I think matched or exceeded Ali’s level of character development was Michaela. So Ali fits right in with your list, but she might also stand out?

      2. I don’t think she played that badly. She connected to everyone on her initial tribe as well as to Roark on the swap tribe. She mainly went out because a) Ryan decided not to let her in the loop on the Roark vote and then needed to kill the witness, and b) She let her emotions get the better of her and really took it to Ryan instead of sucking up to him considering she really needed him to side with her at that point.

        I think Survivor is a lot less about the actual decisions and much more about how well you can connect with people, especially early on, and that’s why Ali still has potential to be a good player.

  16. JP at tribal sounds like a hockey player that’s interviewed after the first period – “Well we just have to work as a team, give 110%, keep our sticks on the ice, and go back out there and play our best.”

    1. “We sportsed our best and scored points, but the other team was sportsing pretty hard too, and they scored even more points.”

          1. A stone-cold classic. I kind of want to share it on social media again but my friends are probably all tired of seeing it.

          2. I also think the Allen Iverson presser makes up for the interview shortcomings of all other sports players in perpetuity.

          3. This reference is just for educators from 30-some-odd states: Everybody in my cohort in getting licensure is sitting for their Praxises (Praxi?), and there are frequent utterances of “Praxis? I mean, we here talking’ ’bout Praxis.”

    2. “we gotta work hard in the corners, get pucks on net, and home something breaks our way” (hockey player interviews are my favourite because they’re all hilariously identical – from like major midget to NHL level)

      1. Yeah, all athletes have dull, cliched style to their interviews, but JP’s had the distinct hockey-player air of being dull, intensely anti-intellectual, but yet a hint of polite.

        Football players, OTOH, are as dull and anti-intellectual, but less polite. Baseball players are just fucking dumb. And basketball player interviews are loaded with thinly veiled cheap shots at their opponents, teammates, coach, and team owner.

        1. It’s a skill to be able to say so many words while saying absolutely nothing at all, but be nice about it

    1. But also, let’s be honest, JP’s real victory will be when he and Ashley get kicked out of Ponderosa for having sex in the common area. In the middle of the day. While people are there.

    1. I just got eliminated from the Pick four!

      I’m actually kind of excited. If you are going to lose in a humiliating fashion, lose in a HUMILIATING fashion.

      1. That’s how I felt last season when I lost Caleb, Malcolm, and JT in short order. I really wanted to be booted in the fourth episode after the premiere. Instead, Sarah won the season.

    1. Except she didn’t! Haha. He just assumed she would and then blamed her for doing so, which is even more That Guy

    2. I don’t think Ryan is even that guy, he doesn’t seem like a guy who has nice guy syndrome, which I think you are calling him. I think he has just accepted his loser fate

  17. Well that fucking sucked. I don’t hate the move from a game standpoint. JP is nothing and easy to control. From a TV show standpoint, this was awful. Ali had potential while JP makes paint drying as exciting as the NBA.

  18. Ryan didn’t even learn how to spell Ali’s name correctly. Which might make his seem like a dick, but you also can’t ask someone how to spell their name on Survivor. So … Ryan’s dick-ish.

    1. “Hey Ali, how do you spell you’re name? Just in case I’m in a situation in the next couple days where I have to um… spell it…”

    2. He didn’t even use two l’s. So he probably knew what her name was and decided to use Aly instead. (Spellcheck didn’t even recognize Aly as a correct spelling)

  19. Next time on Survivor:

    Ryan – “Barack Obama was almost certainly born in Kenya.”

    Cole – “I don’t watch soccer. What team is that?”

  20. I have been discussing this in DMs with @disqus_3Sm0bOf1sj:disqus for weeks, but I have been calling Ali the swap/merge boot. Why, you may ask? Because she was sacrificing all of her pawns for Ryan and Devon. She had to get rid of Simone, but getting rid of Patrick was just a bit overkill.

    1. Anyone that Ali talked to at the well and told them that she would take care of them – that person was doomed.

  21. King Steve!

    I choose to hang my hat on that Stranger Things 2 gif. Because this episode…godDAMMIT, Yellow tribe.

    1. This was a good episode for Joe and Mike only. Made me hate Ryan more and I’m convinced Ben won’t make FTC now

      1. Honestly, I want to watch Ben calling Mike “Doc” for as long as we can get it. Reminds me of Young Guns. Or, subsequently, Young Guns II.

          1. Actually, much better. I only said Chrissy cause she is a villain and Ben or Mike win that for sure

        1. Hey, I remember that movie from my Christian Slater teenage crush days. And also for teaching me that Arkansas doesn’t rhyme with Kansas.

    2. Had to still use it, fuck this episode for making me not want to use it, which means that now I HAVE to use it

        1. My new relationship test is whether you are on board the King Steve train or not. Which reminds me I need to get someone to watch Stranger Things

          1. We haven’t been dating that long dude. That is more like a 3 month thing, now I just use it to lure her to my place said the spider to the fly

          2. I really need to get back to watching The Shield. We’ve tried numerous times, due to our shared love of Walton Goggins. It’s hard to watch though. Like, literally hard to watch. It does not play well in HD.

          3. I’m glad I watched it, and the final season is great. But I don’t think the show has aged well and could not really recommend that people watch it.

          4. I also dont think the first two seasons are all that good, but damn does it build to something special in the end

          5. We binged that while my wife was going through labour with our first. I was all “so… should we go to the hospital now or…” and she was all “one more episode!”

          6. I’m trying to remember when I got the fiancé’s Netflix password. I know it’s because I was sick though, so it was very sweet. And now I pay for the account, so joke’s on me.

          7. This is a good barometer by which to grade. If they aren’t on the King Steve train by the end of season 1, they’re not for us. I mean, you.

  22. “Ali and JP both seem to work with me. I have no idea why they would, since I am a weasel, apart from how we are on a tribe of only four people so they have no other option if they want to stick around.”

  23. FUCK THIS.

    I’ve had a really awful week at work, and I was at least hoping that Survivor wouldn’t pull this shit, but like, why am I even fucking surprised that we lose Ali and get to keep JP at the hands of Ryan? YAY. FUCK THIS SHIT RIGHT NOW, YES I AM HEATED AND NOT ANALYZING IT RATIONALLY FROM GAME PERSPECTIVE RIGHT NOW

          1. She has said words pretty much every week. She has the one confessional to remind us she is on the show, though I don’t know how anyone can forget.

          2. She did have one in the premiere. The second episode was the one where she didn’t have any, which was what I meant by pretty much.

          1. Maybe it’s just my memory, but I still feel like even after considering those two, Cirie’s pre-merge screen time wasn’t head and shoulders above Desi’s.

    1. It is especially frustrating from a tv perspective because JP is so nothing on tv, and Ali is a decent to good character

          1. Oh man, that would’ve been great. It would throw a curveball at the tribe, thinking they got rid of a threat and said threat no longer influencing the game in any capacity. Plus I feel like Ali could give some good jury faces.

          2. They did it in Cook Islands. I’m listening to its TEOS chapter and Rob and Josh discuss the problems of having someone on a jury who has never played with a bunch of the players left in the game. I’d allow it this time though.

          3. I know. They did it in Fiji and Heroes vs Villains, too, to various degrees of success (removing Rocky and Lisi from that jury could make it a little less awful). I can understand why they don’t usually do it, though.

          4. It means that there is a chance that some jury members have to make their decision without ever having had an actual conversation with the final three/two.

    2. It’s very, very on-brand for this week/2017 in general, ALAS. I feel your rage and I’m sorry things are awful.

    3. I’m right with you, Em. It’s very frustrating and it feels like shit like this happens too often. I’m ready for Ryan’s downfall immediately.

      1. Here the problem with that, the show is trying to get us to care about Ryan. (Almost put in the words root for, but remembered in the nick of time that the show is trying to get us to root for Ben and Dr Mike).

        1. I agree that he will be around for awhile. He is definitely main villain for me and I want him to fail. Chrissy too.

          1. I don’t think they are setting up Lauren as a main villain. I think she is side character with her shtick being the complainer.

          2. Is Randy the only person to turn that schtick into a villainous persona? All the other complainers/whiner were generally odious or horribly grating.

          3. Oh, I figured “villain” = you’re meant to dislike them, not the HvV way. But in that way, yes. I just see Sandra as more of an anti-hero.

          4. Maybe I should clarify that I’m talking about people whose only characteristic is that they complain and are thus villains.

            But Abi still works there. I originally thought there was more to her, but on second thought, maybe not.

          5. There have been several male characters like her. I think she’s the first female curmudgeon that I can recall. The closest one I can think of is Randy.

          6. Ugh, take it back! Those are damning words! She’s not even close to that awful and repugnant.

        1. See, I thought his confessionals tonight bordered on Cagayan Spencer cocky and actually knocked his winner chances for me

          1. That’s true. I noticed that tonight – both Ryan and Ali have been to more than half the tribals this season

          2. Ryan was less “set up to be on the worst tribes” and more “a key reason why his tribes are the worst”.

          3. I think it’s less that he’s noticeably bad at anything, and more that he is not standout at anything. You can be physically weak and yet good at puzzles, or have decent aim, or balance, etc. Ryan is just borderline competent at everything I think. So it’s less that he’s harming his team, and more that the burden to perform is that little bit greater on everyone else. There is never going to be a situation where a tribe goes ‘oh, X is struggling – let’s see if Ryan has any luck!’. It’s exacerbated by the small tribes though.

          4. His social game is actually really strong for him to be a major challenge negative and still never get a vote through all of the premerge.

          5. Just him? No. But he’s clearly the weakest player out there. And we haven’t even seen him make up for it in a separate skill like puzzle solving. They were usually just trying to hide him on the easiest tasks.

        2. I am starting to think it might be Dr. Mike. A joe v mike v some no one would vote for like cole or jp

          1. Dr Mike is really in a fantastic spot right now. Definitely the one who benefitted most from Red Tribe (Yeller) never having to go to tribal

      1. Chrissy is really starting to strike me as the type of player that gets righteously indignant when she learns that other people are playing with their own best interests at heart rather than hers.

        1. I’d sign up to watch a “Chrissy vs. John Carroll” season. Survivor: Holier Than Thou Island

      2. I thought prior to this episode that she would want to vote out Ali because Ali might have threatened her ego. And that she could easily manipulate JP.

        1. I don’t think there was ever any question regarding which way Chrissy would go. Does she want to be in an alliance built around Ryan’s connections, or an alliance built around her connections?

      1. What? No! Ryan’s just a lovable nerd playing Survivor! How can anyone hate him?

        Yeah, I stole SNP’s sarcastic Ryan appreciation post, but honestly, sarcastic appreciation is the only way to deal with Ryan.

    4. Yeahhhh. I have a bad feeling Ali’s final words and resigned negativity during the credits might be a prescient warning for how this season is going to shake out. Also-when are they getting their swimsuits? I’m really, really getting sick of looking at Ryan in those grimmy boxer briefs.

    5. It does suck when the world is a vampire, and you need your sweet relief. But noooooo, they have to take away one of the most beautiful charming female players we’ve seen in a very long time. I feel you, I truly do. 💜

  24. Guys, can we cut through the negativity for a second and talk about how the Ben and Mike duo is kind of fun? Cause it’s kind of fun.

    1. I dig most of that tribe! Ben adn Mike is a good duo, Jessica and her anchor is the best story on the show. I think there is a cranky fifth person, but who cares

      1. I kinda adore how different Lauren is from most Survivor players tbh. I didn’t like the red-head hate, but since then, I’ve been mostly on her side of discussions.

    2. I came in during this conversation and immediately fell in love. It’s the duo that I didn’t know that I wanted that I desperately need now. Also, is this the closest that we have gotten to Fishbach/JT since Fishbach/JT?

      1. did you go back and see the part where Ben is charmingly bemused at how bad Mike is at cooking a fish?

        1. That was such a great scene. I’m actually liking this season a lot, and moments like that are why.

    3. That scene was the first time I felt like this season could have a legitimately good post-merge cast, as opposed to perfectly average. Considering Lauren was there, that speaks volumes about Ben and Mike.

    4. I’ve been a naysayer on Ben, but I liked him in this episode. He was playing Mike smartly, and was entertaining while doing so. Good job Ben.

      (although I don’t like what it portends for Jessica, the player I actually like)

      1. It helps that they have the shared background of being married and having children, which the other three just don’t have (I know Lauren has at least 1 child, but I don’t think she is married).

          1. She talked about how her only reason for coming onto the show was for the money to send her daughter to college (the first in her family to go, I think she said) and make a better life for her. There were some tears shed.

  25. How about Ryan tonight, gang? Man he is getting more and more impressive every week! He knows what needs to be done, and he knows how to do it! This is the game we all expected from David Wright in MvGX, only Ryan is actually likeable. Move over Cochran, there’s a new fan favorite on Survivor!

    1. Man, I’m assuming you are being sarcastic. I respect the bell hops, but he is tanking himself

  26. Nice to have confirmation at TC that JP is as much of an empty wardrobe of a man in person as he comes across as on TV anyway.

          1. In my high school yearbook my picture is mislabled because my friend and I switched cards on picture day, and when the yearbook staff realized the mix-up and tried to fix it their sponsor was like “no, those two idiots did that on purpose, we’re not spending effort to correct their stupid joke.”

    1. In a shocking twist, given my love of Jon Misch and Woo Hwang, I have no issues with JP. He’s not exciting TV and is almost certainly a casting misfire.

      But like there’s no reason to hate the guy or have any particular distaste towards him, he seems fine enough. He just doesn’t really pop off this or any screen. Empty wardrobe of a man is probably a little harsh for someone we’ve seen like a grand total of 8 minutes of.

  27. Desi appreciation hour: She got one confessional where she was fine with cutting Joe. Hopefully, she gets more screentime after the merge. I really need to start following people who actually get TV time. Survivor hates my crushes.

      1. I know. I can’t help it though. Most of my Survivor crushes being women already puts me at a disadvantage when it comes to screentime.

        1. I’ve given up on hoping for Desi long-term, and just enjoying what we have. And her quick willingness to cut Joe? That was enjoyable.

          On top of that, I’m appreciating how preternaturally in control Desi looks in every challenge. Woman is POISED. And in as non-gross a way as possible, appreciating looking at Desi in general.

    1. Unlike the Hannah thing, I really wanted to be on board with you for this one. I just can’t. There was a very brief glimmer of hope during the episode where Joe played his idol, but nothing has come of it.

    1. Don’t leave, drunk discussions are always better.

      Also, my phone tried to turn “discussions” into “decisions”. That’s not nearly as true in my experience…

  28. What are other people’s feelings on Ashley? There hasn’t been much conversation about her lately, mostly because there is nothing really to talk about game wise. I do feel like a lot of time with the tribes she’s been on had been from her perspective. With the merge coming I think Ash can be a big character.

    1. Another Survivor podcast brought that point up last week and it really got me thinking. Could she secretly be our winner? Of course a lot of her content is because it was her and JP for now clearly obvious reasons, but I just don’t like her. There’s something there that I don’t get.

      1. I don’t really have an opinion on her. I am confused by the people you like her because I don’t see much there but the show seems to be going out of it’s way sometimes to include her and I find that interesting.

          1. Well, that is extremely vague but if that other person was Sarah Lacina then the thought has crossed my mind several times this season.

    2. I think she’s coming across very well so far. Hiding behind the drama, but still being depicted as strategic.

    3. I like her. I feel like the blue tribe got a lot of content for not going to TC for a couple episodes, which makes me think that there are some long stories there

    4. I don’t get why people don’t like her. She was fun in her confessional. I liked how she talked to Desi. She and Devon seem like two ocean loving kids who aren’t lazy, mean, or too dim.

  29. Of course the Republican bellhop shitposter votes out the woman on color.

    On a serious note, I’m hoping there’s a storyline of the older players taking out all the idiot millennials post merge. I’m here for the Ben/Mike/Lauren power hour.

    1. Yeah, I was getting excited about the older people uniting until I realized, with the merge, that Chrissy will want nothing to do with Lauren…

    2. @purplerockemma:disqus mentioned this on the pod, but do either of you have the link to where he talks about politics? I just assumed based on his behavior.

      1. His bio lists political correctness as a pet peeve, and he mentions being republican in his pregame interview with Josh Wigler.

  30. Getting rid of Ali was probably the right decision because Ryan and Chrissy can pretty much make JP do whatever they want.

    1. This was my reaction. I’d much rather see Ali stick around but in this situation she was the correct vote.

      1. I can’t feel too bad. Chrissy kept her malleable dullard. Ali got rid of what could have been hers.

  31. In retrospect, it was pretty clear that Ali was going home. For JP to be voted out, he’d have to be playing the game, and not a time traveller from the future desperately trying not to have any impact on the present

    1. I mean, it sort of feels a bit like we are already living in the alternate reality where a time traveller really, really screwed up, and now a semi-senile fascist is President and Britain is exiting the EU and we’re going to war with North Korea and it’s all because someone trod on a butterfly or something.

      1. actually this time it was a caterpillar.

        awww crap, you weren’t supposed to know that. Time to go reset the timeline again

  32. I have absolutely no opinion about this season one way or the other. It is the Neutral Planet of Survivor.

    1. Really? I lean towards “It is good” more than I lean towards “It is bad.” Not firmly in either camp yet, but it’s not a true neutral.

      1. Yeah, at the very least I can say it isn’t bad. Like Caramoan pre merge was pretty bad. Fiji pre merge was horrendous. This is just inoffensive people playing a fairly predictable game so far.

        1. You know what season had a pre-merge where a bunch of crazy shit happened? Game Changers. I’ll take a bland pre-merge where the chalk boots go home, thankyouverymuch.

    2. I agree. Status is very much pending. Not bad or good so far. A lot rests on the post merge. Many seasons have been great or bad based very much on the post merge.

  33. The most interesting thing that I can muster about JP is that, from certain angles, he kind of looks like Liev Schreiber.

        1. God damn right he does. He’s got one of the top voices of people working voice narration right now.

    1. Fingers crossed if he makes it to a loved ones visit, his family member is his dog. Seriously, from pre game stuff he really seems attached to his dog.

      1. That would be so beautiful.

        Especially the part where his close ally (I dunno, Crissy) wins the challenge, and takes him and his dog on the reward, leading to apoplectic rage from those left behind.

    1. I am imagining all of the PRP commenters who are traveling there will neglect to tip their bellhops.

      1. With all due respect do you really think they’re classy enough for a place swanky enough to have bellhops?

        1. When I was in NYC in January, I stayed at a hotel with bellhops and felt wealthier than I have ever felt…especially in NY since I was a starving NYU grad student when I lived there.

          1. If you are an awesome guest the hoppers will give you a bronze coin. If you show that coin to other bellhops they will take extra special care of you. Those coins mean a lot!

        1. I understand that. Hopefully some people can make it in for the spring KIA. And if that’s not possible, anytime any PRP person wants to take a trip to NY, I’ll be more than happy to meet and will make time. PRP community is amazing and I would love to meet everyone at some point.

          1. I’ll see if I can pull off a KIA trip for Survivor: Millennials vs. Millennials next season. I just couldn’t swing it this time.

    2. Oh shit, are none of y’all going to be around in the comments for the merge craziness next week? That’ll suck.

  34. I called Ali before this episode. Near the end I was thinking they would take out JP. I was right last week.

    I suspect that Chrissy was deadset on the more strategic Ali. It made no sense for her to vote out her loyal dullard. Devon and Cole are also still around so JP is not a lock for physical immunities.

    1. Yeah, on Know-it-Alls they seemed to be talking about it as if this was Ryan’s decision, whereas I thought it was pretty clear that the moment Ryan gave up the option of a majority, Chrissy held all the power there.

  35. Gotta give r/Survivor props when it’s right; I just saw the take “The worst part about tonight’s episode is the fact that we’ll have to sit through JP’s boot episode for a second time.”

    1. Wasn’t expecting that but nailed it. JP is soooooooo bland (as is tradition with Survivor JPs) I was just ready to get rid of him. Not only is his boring self still there but presumably he will be all to featured in at least one more episode.

          1. Penner is Penner. He is eternal, and when the worldheart grows dim he will perch on the moon and sing Earth’s death song while Paul swings his broadsword to bring down the killing blow.

          2. I watched that this weekend, and, while not good, not good at all, it wasn’t horrible. It had ideas for something, but script problems and bad bad BAD acting didn’t help.

        1. He was voted out by the women and Adam. I remember nothing else about him. If I can’t remember anything about them that it top tear boring.

          1. It’s possible he was the most arrogant person on a tribe that included Ozzy so that’s something

    2. I like to think his actual boot will be either a) a double boot or b) a Kelly Wigglesworth memorial boot episode edit

      1. The best case scenario, given a probable Heroes/Hustlers vs Healers breakdown, with all the idols on the side of the Healers, is JP being idoled out in the first half of a double episode.

        The worser case scenario is JP getting swapped out for Devon or Ben, the two remaining members of my pick-4.

    3. JP is just so bad that it has flipped into a good casting choice .. I LOL’ed at some of his answers at the tribal council. Seriously just go back and listen to them again.. he can’t give a proper answer to anything.. everything is generic bullshit based on the question itself.

    4. With all the abuse reddit gets on here, it is funny that opinions on there somewhat mirror PRP for this season -they hate Ryan, luke warm on Chrissy, loved Ali- only major exception being the contingent who love Lauren.

      1. Does Reddit actually hate Ryan? I would not have seen that one coming at all. I guess they’re more of a self-hating crowd than I thought.

        1. I don’t post on there (maybe made 5 posts in total over last year) but do browse through given I watch survivor in a time zone separated by US by almost 12 hours. Opinion on him was mostly trending negative before this episode and this episode sealed the fate. A nugget from one of many threads hating on him –
          “I know I’m not the first to say this, but holy fuck is Ryan quickly becoming one of my least favorites of all-time. It’s like someone took the smug arrogance of Spencer, self-deprecating nature of Cochran (sans the humor), and tryhardness of Zeke and rolled it into one unbearable, unnecessarily-turtleneck-wearing package.”
          https://www.reddit.com/r/survivor/comments/7a99tc/is_awful/

          1. Oh, I forgot they decided to turn on Spencer because he didn’t pander to them enough. They’ve always hated Cochran and Zeke, though.

  36. Jeff trying to get them to vote out JP reminded me so much of which Jeff wanted JT/Taj/Erin to get out Stephen from F4 on in Tocantins, especially after Stephen starts talking up the Day 39 Breakfast. I was immediately like “Jeff wants Taj to get to the end”.

    1. The worst of Jeff doing that was with Courtney in HvV because he was upset his best friend was gone.

          1. How which part happened? How Jeff actually tried to fault Courtney for Rob getting voted out or how Rob got voted out?

    2. That’s so weird too. Like, Taj is great and I know she’s stunt casting, but Stephen and JT in the finals is so iconic.

  37. My pre-merge power ranking tiers:

    Tier 1 – Front Runners:

    1. Ryan: this was not a great episode for him, but I think there is a very high chance he wins.

    2. Ben: The show really wants us to care about him. He is charming and could clean up at Final Tribal if he gets there.

    3. Chrissy: I don’t particularly like her, but she is in a good spot. She will need pick her partners carefully if she wants to get votes though.

    4. Jessica: Looking good, but Cole could drag her out of the game.

    Tier 2 – Dark Horses:

    5. Joe: Joe should not be underestimated. He found Idols and is considered strategic. He also finally got some heartstrings pulling family quotes.

    6. Dr. Mike: He has quietly been gaining screentime. I also like him.

    Tier 3 – Not Completely Out of It, But I Would Not Put Any Money on Them

    7. Devon: He gets the highest spot due to likely Immunity Strength and connection to Ryan. He is also the smartest of the JP-Cole-Devon triad by a large margin.

    8. Lauren: She is the most prominent person on this tier. I suspect she lasts a while. I would be very surprised if she won.

    9. Ashley: She seems like she has potential, but I don’t think she is going to do much.

    Tier 4 – Yeah… No

    10. JP: Can win challenges, but not much else. Is around and not as much of a joke as Cole is.

    11. Cole: Beautiful doofus. Good at showmance, bad at thinking and getting people to like him.

    12. Desi: Who?

      1. If it involves carrying something heavy for a short distance he’s a lock. Anything else: not so much.

          1. I genuinely can’t think of a recent individual immunity where brute force would have been a benefit.

          2. There was that one that Adam won in MvGenX, if that counts? Although the fact that Adam won it suggests that maybe it doesn’t.

        1. He’s also shown himself to be good at both balance and hitting things with other things.

          The real question though: Is he good at balancing things on other things?

    1. I’m not even mad that you don’t think Desi can win, I don’t either at the moment. I’m mad you have her below JP and Cole. That is just disrespectful.

      1. I considered putting her above them, but could not pass up the “Who?” Joke. I would like to hang out with her though.

    2. Devon could get slotted into that “let him linger around by himself because he’s obviously harmless” Eddie Fox role, because people might not notice he’s playing kind of stealthily smart.

      1. If Devon was getting even a little bit more edit, I think he’d be way up the contender list. He seems to actually get the game without showing people that he does

        1. I don’t think his edit is that bad. It was a quiet week for him, but before we always heard from him just enough to stay relevant. I think he still might have Michele-upside, so the Merge episode will be interesting in that regard.

          1. I mean, I’m holding out hope, but given Survivor edits past, I think a guy like Devon would be much more prominent if he were the winner

      1. Miss you in Outcasts. Sadly, this is the season where I win again, so you had to go. Good luck in pick four and have the best wedding ever!

  38. For all their talk about JP being a post-merge threat and a “great player” (lol) I think Chrissy and Ryan ultimately kept him because he’s strategically inert (aka loyal) and they’re hoping the other players will be dumb enough to think he’s a bigger threat than the two of them because he’s strong. Even though I was rooting pretty hard for Ali to stay, I sort of knew it wasn’t going to happen because they’ve already shown they’re going after strategic threats.
    I’m amused by the thought of Chrissy dragging two younger men to the finals and beating them, but at this point I’m not sure how likely that is. I still think she’s on the shortlist of likely winners but she’s not a shoo in yet by any means. She had an okay episode – sure her side prevailed, but we didn’t learn anything new about her as a person and I felt like the decision was portrayed more from Ryan’s POV again. Ryan was also only so-so, but I guess the worst thing he did was have a lame defense of the Roark vote to Ali, and she’s gone now so meh. He did recover from some of the criticism of his choice last week, since he got rid of the only person who was mad at him about it.

    1. Honestly, my biggest knock on Ali is that it really seemed from her exit comments like she thought JP is a serious threat. Oh honey, NO. You are the serious threat. He’s a lump.

      1. I think Ali made the wrong play here based on that perceived notion. I think she needed to try and pull JP then Chrissy to a Ryan vote based on him being a threat. She should have guaranteed them the Hustlers at the merge and pushed to oust Ryan

    2. I also found it significant that this decision was portrayed as Ryan’s rather than Chrissy’s. But in her defence, it may have been a more difficult task for the editors to drum up suspense if they brought us too far into Chrissy’s head “yeah, I think I’ll vote out the person who voted for me rather than the easily manipulated whatever I’ve been playing this whole time with”.

    1. How can there be so many replies and yet no one has told you that it says Trivia and not Tribal at the end?

  39. Well now I need to go to bed, but before I do, here’s one more GO ASTROS!!! except for Gurriel. Fuck him for the road.

    Here’s hoping that they pull out the win tonight and that my proclamation of that hope doesn’t portend some unforeseen outcomes.

      1. Half of the baseball tweets in my feed are about Correa’s proposal, which is … a choice.

  40. I know this has been said below, but I’m fucking done with Ryan. The boot combined with his stupid cocky confessionals totally did him in for me. Unfortunately, I don’t think he’s going anywhere any time soon.

    1. It’s funny, because from a purely gameplay perspective, his moves made sense for his game. But on the other hand, ehhhh, fuck him.

      1. I’m not even sure about that. Was coming out of this tribe with JP and Chrissy (and maybe Ben and maybe still Devon and Ashley) a better deal for him than coming out with Ali and Roark (and Lauren, Devon, and the Healers?). Or is the potential of burning his Hustler allies too big a risk? In this scenario, he’s the wrong side of a 4-2 Hero/Hustler split (assuming they even win the merge vote) versus a 6-4 Healer:Hustler split, where they almost certainly with the merge vote. But there would be way more fractures in the bigger Healer group than that Hero group, I think.

        But yes, analysis aside, fuck him.

        1. I think Ryan is banking on Devon forming bonds with Ashley while Chrissy and Ben are seemingly tight on JP. The problem is Chrissy has talked about getting rid of JP in the past, so it on her radar. It just didn’t make sense for her tonight, especially when the merge is lurking. Also, I don’t think Ashley and Chrissy are that close because both of them hate working with other women.

          1. I think that’s the hope, but that’s a lot to bank on. I think JP is off Chrissy’s radar for now, as a meat shield, but Ashley/JP have no need to be loyal to Chrissy/Ben and frankly, now Devon has reasons to question Ryan

          2. Knowing about the idol connection between Chrissy and Ryan, Devon should have a good idea of what happened at the yellow tribe from just looking at the boot order. If he likes the development is another question, but I would assume that he won’t make a big deal of it, even if he would have preferred to keep Ali over JP.

            Heck, everyone should have a pretty good idea about the relationships at that tribe from just looking at who’s left. They really should have sucked a little bit less at the challenges, because that Chrissy-Ryan connection is certainly not at all secret anymore, now that Ali is gone, too.

          3. I don’t think he will make a big deal of it in the short term but the seeds of distrust will be sown for down the road I think

        2. It really depends on his relationship with Chrissy in the end I think, and also Chrissy’s relationships with everybody else. if Chrissy is going to make him her number 1 then he’s probably fine. But if Chrissy has stronger ties to either JP or Ben then he’s sacrificed Ali, who was one of HIS numbers, in exchange for a position where he’s towards the bottom and has very little in terms of leverage.

          1. Exactly. I think it may work out for him because Chrissy will make him her number 1 but it was a totally unnecessary risk

      2. Abandoning Ali last week was not great. Voting out Ali was the right move for Chrissy, but Ryan hurt himself.

        1. How does voting out JP help Ryan? Ali is still looking for other options- Ryan has backstabbed her. And now Crissy views him as an unreliable ally as well. Plus, JP is a useful lump for Ryan.

          I think choosing Ali over Crissy last week was bad game play. But following through on the choice tonight? That’s the right play.

          I mean, obviously I hate it though.

          1. I tend to agree with this. This was the right move to try and eliminate the ramifications of a bad one

          2. It’s more he doesn’t initially acknowledge that he screwed up and blames Ali for getting mad at him that makes him seem a nasty type of cocky.

            In his defense he did admit he screwed up later in the episode but first reactions are often more honest.

  41. Well, I really liked that immunity challenge. Visually interesting, tests unusual skills, offers easily understandable strategy, retains tension even if the battle isn’t close…

    Pity about everything else tonight.

    1. Yeah, Mike being the professional was great, but I think you’re under appreciating Jessica’s role as the sassy night nurse belittling her patient. “Oh sure yeah buddy nothing’s wrong you just collapsed you dum dum”.

      1. Also under-appreciated is how Lauren didn’t lift a finger to help, and didn’t even stop giving Cole the side eye.

    2. I liked seeing Mike and Jessica do medical stuff too. I wish that scene could have been longer, in fact. Mike was downright commanding there for a second.

      1. It would have been funnier if Mike invoked his specialty. So Cole faints and Mike is all “Everybody stand back, I got this, I’m a doctor. Now Cole tell me… was it your penis? No? Well I’m useless”

        1. Cole *faints*
          Dr. Mike: Cole, CAN YOU FEEL YOUR PENIS? …. Jessica, I’m going to need your help.
          Jessica: !!!

  42. Remember when we all hated Ashley for teaming up with the guys on her tribe to take out one of the other women? Chrissy might be worse.

    1. If we believe the exit interviews, Crissy was interested in allying with the guys to take out the other women from day one.

      That said…I don’t think Crissy has been picking the wrong targets for her game the last couple weeks. JP and Ryan are useful to her, Roark and Ali weren’t.

          1. If I had to rank the seven non championship winning teams by who I want to win the most:

            1. Seattle Mariners
            2. Colorado Rockies
            3. Milwaukee Brewers
            4. San Diego Padres
            5. Texas Rangers
            6. Washington Nationals
            7 Tampa Bay Rays

          2. I think at this point the Mariners are better served as an object lesson in the capricious nature of the universe.

          3. Eh. Nationals should be 3. Otherwise you got it right. Mariners are loveable, Rockies are fricking fun to watch

      1. I’m a tigers fan myself. JV got robbed of the cy young last year so seeing get a ring means a lot to me

    1. That was a very hard game to watch, but I watched every miserable moment. At least it wasn’t the fucking Yankees.

      1. I know! Terrrible ending to an great, exciting series, no matter the outcome. Where was the comeback we kept waiting and waiting and waiting for? The Dodgers didn’t choke so much as just lay down.

        And , for the record, I’m from St. Louis originally, so Next Year Cardinals!!!

    1. Same. I also had Patrick. Been a lucky season for me. I hope this isn’t bad luck for my last remaining pick, Ben.

  43. Let me say just a bit about Ryan. No jokes, no BS, no sarcasm. He’s played a good game, but he made a mistake. He should have included Ali in the last vote. How did he correct that mistake? He got rid of the person who he screwed. That is a good play! This is a hard game! He messed up and corrected course! Can you really hate him for playing hard? He is doing some underhanded shit but this is a game for a million bucks. Is Ryan a weasel? Yes! That’s why I picked him for my fantasy team. I love villains and Ryan is giving me what I want from Survivor. A villain that I can root for.

    Another way to look at it: How boring would this season be without Ryan?

    1. “Another way to look at it: How boring would this season be without Ryan?”
      About the same? I was thinking before the vote that it’s awesome that Ali is sticking around, but that it is bad for Ryan and Chrissy. I’m not as pissed as I was at Jay for voting out Michaela, but I’m also not impressed even if I think it was the right move.

      1. Jay voting out Michaela was fantastic TV. Ryan coldly erased a mistake before the merge. Nobody really needs to know about his mistake. Loose ends. I don’t think this hurts his game.

        1. Yeah, it was, but I didn’t really appreciate it until after. In the moment, I felt like I was Michaela. I almost shut my laptop without finishing the episode.

          I agree that it was the right move for Ryan, I just don’t find him entertaining.

          1. I am a huge fan of the villain. Tyson, Coach, Fairplay… these are the players I like. I’m glad to see Ryan slide into the villain role. That I can root for.

          2. I would agree with you with an important exception: Tyson, Coach and Fairplay all had way more personality than I think Ryan does, and all were pretty damn funny, which I don’t find Ryan. I too like a good villain, but I think I tend to prefer my villains as those who are making me laugh while also rooting against them

          3. I mean Tyson was the ultimate shit talker, or well maybe second to Courtney, shit talkers are the best villains

          4. Ryan’s sick burn on JP was that he has no social game, which was intercut with JP’s story of his ideal first date, maybe the most entertaining we’ve seen JP be all season. JP’s game has problems, but social connection doesn’t look like one of them.

            So it’s possible that not only is Ryan’s analysis not funny, it’s also not even necessarily good.

          5. You are right, and I think he’s one of the best characters this season. I’m really not as interested in “best players” but I think he’s probably one of those this season too.

            Still, villains are gonna catch some heat in the comment section. And, even amongst villains, I think his entertainment value isn’t quite yet solidified. He almost stuck with Ali!

            But it was great seeing him dragged around during his massive challenge failure, and still ruthless afterwards—that’s some top shelf villain shit, imo! Still hate to see Ali go, but… at least Ryan is doing stuff.

          6. Kind of like how Voldemort was on the back of Quirrell’s head for a whole book before he got strong enough to be on his own. Still hella villainous though 😉

        2. Ryan getting rid of Ali was the right move but what I didn’t understand was the overly elaborate dumbshow he engineered to make Ali believe that JP was the target. That could have been achieved with far fewer moves.

          1. Ryan seems to be the type of player that will tell everyone he is working with them and they will vote out someone else, and once he has made every possible plan only then will he decide what to do.

            While it’s good to have more than one plan and to keep your options open, you should have a first choice and then a backup plan. It feels like for Ryan, every plan is equally a backup plan.

    2. The issue is only that he burned the person there who could be loyal to him to save the one loyal to Chrissy. But he has Devon

    3. You know, if he had just gone to Ali and said “nah, let’s do Roark, I think I’ve tricked Christy into siding with us” then yeah, I’d give him major credit. While voting Ali and course correcting was the right decision, he put himself into that hole and handled it badly; if they had won immunity (which, frankly, I think they threw that challenge), if there had been a shuffle, if Ali had found an idol, if she had made the merge, things get unnecessarily worse for him. At that point even if he gets rid of her, she’s not the voice you want on the jury, and nothing he’s shown me so far convinces me he’s going to treat anyone else any differently. He could still win if he’s sitting next to people who are making the same mistakes (Christy), but I’m predicting he’s gonna pull a Russel.

      1. Yeah Ryan did not handle the aftermath with Ali well at all, but I’m guessing from the time they decided to vote out Roark they knew Ali was next, so it probably wasn’t that important to him to get her back on his side. And I think your hunch that they threw the challenge to get rid of her before the merge makes a lot of sense. Why risk bringing a strategic player who is mad at you and has already told you that she’s planning to try teaming up with the remaining Healers to gain numbers when you can just cut her and guarantee that your potential allies Ben, Devon (and I guess Lauren?) stick around? If we look at it that way and stop assuming that Ryan ever planned on keeping an alliance with Ali, I think both votes seem a little smarter (though he still could have at least tried to minimize the fallout with Ali from the first vote).

        1. Which sure: *if* the plan was Roark and then Ali, it worked out. But it’s such a dumb gamble to blindside her like that when you can’t guarantee you’ll be able to get her out next. Many things could have happened to put a wrinkle in this plan then suddenly he’s at the merge with either Ali gunning for him or Ali a merge boot who spends all of Ponderosa shit talking him to the other jurors. Just ’cause it worked doesn’t mean it wasn’t an unnecessary gamble to ostracize her for no reason. It just shows me that he has no idea how to manage a jury if he thinks he can do that again.

          1. Very true – either he had no idea she would be that angry about it (which is possible, as he has told us repeatedly how little experience he has with women) or he knew she would be angry but was cocky enough to just let it happen and assume that everything would be fine. Either way, it seems like he could have potentially solved the problem with one conversation with Ali. Then again, that presumes that he has the social skills to pull off the kind of conversation that was needed in the first place. He may have been screwed no matter what he did.

    4. It was unquestionably the correct move. I would have considered throwing that challenge just to make sure you could get rid of Ali.

      The problem I have with Ryan is that he’s just not that interesting. I think Joe is a far better villain.

      1. But now everyone sees that Chrissy-Ryan pairing coming from a mile away. IMO, never losing Ali’s trust would have been his best outcome and doing damage control after the vote to get her back on side and win the next challenge would have been his second best outcome. Keeping her over JP, after the second challenge is lost too, is probably a wash, the way it played out. A really good player would make Ali a reliable ally again, but he doesn’t seem to have the skills to do that and any chance for achieving that was blown when he got into a shouting match with her after tribal anyway.

        Now he’s lost an Ally, an Ali, a number AND the element of surprise.

    5. Can’t believe I’m saying this but I’m with SNP. i feel like Ryan isn’t being given a chance simply because of his probable political views. I think he’s playing a good game and just covered up his mistake beautifully.

      1. No, there’s a bigger problem with Ryan and it’s that he’s the wrong kind of arrogant.

        Arrogance can be fun when it draws the audience in to this private joke with the speaker: a kind of “can you believe these clowns? what a bunch of clowns,” thing. It comes from a position of superiority but it’s tempered by a levity that makes it seems all in good fun. See for example: Sophie Clarke, Boston Rob, Andy Purplerock.

        There’s another kind of arrogance, though, where you’re just talking about how other people are stupid to make yourself look smart. It’s very needy and mean-spirited, and it’s off-putting.

        It’s a fine line between the two. Spencer kind of straddled it, which is probably why opinion on him is so mixed. I think he mostly stayed on the right side of the line, which is why I like Spencer, but ymmv. Ryan is definitely on the wrong side of the line though.

        This sounds like a long-winded way of saying Ryan would be better if he was funny. Except I don’t think the problem is that Ryan can’t be funny. I think it’s that he’s not joking.

        1. I think this is also why Chrissy so turned me off last week, because I saw her arrogance as a reflection of that same type of spirit. Her remarks that Roark thought herself the smartest person on the island, but she was gonna really show her who was smartest just had me scratching my head because it wasn’t supported by anything the show had shown. So maybe it was intended to be like a Sophie or Boston Rob style “get a load of this person thinking they are so smart” thing, but we didn’t see the supporting evidence so it just came off as cruel and a little delusional

          1. I agree on Chrissy, but I also do think she was right about Roark. I had no rooting interest in their dust-up at tribal council because it just seemed like a slap-fight to prove which one of them was really the smartest in the room.

          2. Right so the thing about how it was portrayed (which may differ from how it actually was) was that when Chrissy started saying that stuff about Roark my only reaction was “wait what? her?” because we didn’t know anything about Roark to know whether that was accurate. I still felt that way by the end of the episode. Which just made it seem like she was picking a fight for no reason. I am sure there was a reason, but without seeing it, it just comes off as super mean spirited. I have no problem with the game move, just the way she talked about it

          3. I have just the opposite take. I think Roark and Chrissy recognizing each other as strategists and butting heads as a result was a real thing, but the show couldn’t or couldn’t be bothered to find a way to shoehorn it into a 42-minute episode (same for Roark’s entire game, now that I think about it). But I think it was a terrible game move, because she knew Roark was about to be voted out, so why bother counter-attacking?

          4. Completely baseless speculation: I wonder if Roark sat back after the swap and waited to be courted as the swing vote, and if that rankled Chrissy to the point where couldn’t not go a different way.

          5. Based on secret scenes that isn’t what happened. Chrissy wanted Roark gone from the get go and made it known. Roark tried to engage all the new people to her beach…at least that’s how I read the secret scene I watched. Additionally, Chrissy was a bit unnerved by all the personal questions after the swap, and I have to believe many of those may have been coming from Roark.

          6. Wait… Chrissy tried to claim that she’s 39?! Did I miss that? As a former 39-year old, I unequivocally call foul on that one. She’s in her mid-40’s AT LEAST.

          7. In the First One Out pre-season podcasts, Chrissy told Josh that she was 46 but that she was going to tell everyone that she was only 39

          8. Agree with the first sentence, but…

            You mean at tribal? You can’t just sit her and let sb take a dumb on you, Ryan could have still changed his vote. And at some point she declined to tell Roark again why her logic (“Oh, you talked to them but not to MEE??”) is faulty and gave “no comment” instead of engaging in pointless arguments, which I thought was a good look on her, but most/all of the podcasts I listen to didn’t seem to agree with that assessment. I still feel like that was a moment that the edit included in her favor, because she already answered that question and Roark’s smugness level was off the charts in her direct reaction shots.
            The problem (that I, because she’s my 1a winner pick, and also) the edit seems to face, is that Chrissy is just not very likable.

        2. Right. So I think its that and also partially this: Sophie and Rob don’t think they’re smarter than ALL people, just these specific people they are on an island with. Ryan thinks he’s smarter than everybody.

          1. They also WERE smarter than those specific people because the the show took the time to show us that those people were dummies. Look if Ryan and Chrissy want to make fun of Cole that is supported by text! Go for it!

          2. Exactly. And it wasn’t that they needed to be smarter than them (okay, maybe a bit in Boston Rob’s case) but that they actually were and didn’t mind saying so. If Ryan could cleverly mock Cole, great, have at it. But Ali, Roark, even JP’s social game? Just a bad look

          3. I think that is part of my negative reaction to Chrissy last week, similar to @purplerockmatt:disqus below. Because the one-sided edit in Roark vs. Chrissy, it came across as Chrissy is convinced she’s smarter than everyone, and in this moment, Roark was the proxy for ‘anyone who challenges my intelligence.’ I really didn’t feel like Roark did (or at least, we weren’t show) anything to provoke that. Rather, Chrissy ranks and evaluates her targets based on how she perceives their intelligence in relation to hers, and voting out Roark, as Chrissy states “The next smartest person on this island beside me,” provided her a level of satisfaction in proving she is far more intelligent.

            In short, Chrissy played the right move, but the dynamics and justification seemed oddly personal without a stronger edit from Roark.

          4. But I don’t think we’ve seen him say anything like that at all. As far as Ryan and “everybody” goes, we’ve seen him mulling over people like Simone and Patrick but has he actually said that he thinks he’s smarter than them? I don’t think so.

            I also think Ryan being critical of JP’s commentary is completely understandable and shows a lot more emotional intelligence that I would have expected from him. Talking about bars and first dates on the beach with tri-tip salad is easy conversation, but only for a particular demographic. Not even a particular age range, because Ryan himself sounded alienated by JP’s topics and I assume they are around the same age. This demographic is people in their 20s who like to party and are socially active and date a lot. I’m not hating on this demographic because this kind of conversation is very easy and familiar for me. But – channeling Zeke season one here – this kind of conversation is also not an easy (or fun) one for all demographics, in particular those whose days of partying and dating are behind them, or who are as socially awkward as Ryan. It’s not universal and I can see those topics getting a lot of eye-rolling with a more diverse crowd. For example, one that includes Ryan and Chrissy.

            This sequence was a callback for me to that scene in Guatemala when Brian exposes how shallow that one bro’s conversations were to Danni and others by leading him on to tell more and more of these sorts of stories. The bro (I’m really forgetting his name, but “the bro” sounds about right) was soon voted out because not everyone found what he brought to the table socially to be that enjoyable. They thought he was inane and shallow, much as Ryan appears to think of JP. And when that’s all that JP is apparently talking about, why should he think otherwise?

          5. I just get the vibe from his confessionals that he thinks he’s smart and everybody else is an idiot. If it was just Patrick and Simone he was talking about it would bother me less, because I would tend to believe he IS smarter than them (particularly Patrick). I would agree that it wasn’t the best way for JP to try and relate to this particular crowd but its also how JP knows to relate. I don’t think it warranted such a negative reaction so much as it should have warranted a whatever reaction. (I may have a blindspot here because JP-types (more accurately, hockey bros) are the type of people I tend to hang out with).

            I saw the Guatemala call back too there, but I don’t really think JP was annoying the others the way he was annoying Ryan (or the way Ryan was putting on being annoyed). I think they just weren’t interested and it garnered a neutral reaction.

        3. My distaste for Ryan stems from his need to take great pains to never let us forget that he is a self-described loser, and that that somehow is supposed to make him a better person than the cooler kids.

          1. It was funny watching him talk about JP’s lack of social game, and rushedly pepper in self-digs as if it was almost second nature at this point. In talking about the lack of dimension to JP’s social game, he again highlights the singular feature of his, that he’s nerdy and single.

          2. If Mike is Kyle’s cousin Kyle on South Park, Ryan is the Member Berries, if all they ever did was say, “Hey! ‘member that time I was a sad loser? Oh yeah! I ‘member!”

          3. It puzzles Ryan to know end that you can make social connections with people just by having pleasant conversations with people about mutual interests.

          4. He doesn’t know what social connections or conversations are because HE’S NEVER HAD A GIRLFRIEND AND DOESN’T GO ON DATES in case you hadn’t heard…

          5. I went on a date recently with a guy who proceeded to tell me about his various disagreements with his workplace, and how he spent all his time restoring classic cars and lived in a shed, and how he was estranged from his sister, and how he couldn’t go in one of the local stores any more because he has anger issues and lost his temper and threw something at a staff member, and I seriously considered actually explaining to him that the reason he would not be getting another date was…all these things.

            And then I remembered the bit about the anger issues, and decided that explaining to this guy why he was going to be single forever was not my problem.

          6. Smart decision, i’m glad you stayed safe and are now still alive. It isn’t, nor should it be, your job to explain to that guy why he isn’t datable. Particularly if his first date small talk is about assaulting shop workers. That’s the epitome of a deal breaker.

          7. Plus this dude probably didn’t even make the merge. In all seriousness, I’m glad you got out of that situation. All the red flags there.

          8. Ugh. Exactly. This is why I was on Ryan’s side of annoyance with JP’s so-called stories. Every word JP utters is so f-ing boring.

          9. To be fair, hearing JP talk about “chicks” and 1st dates with tri-tip salad on the beach would make me roll my eyes straight out of my head. I was completely on Ryan’s side with that dig. I also am not a fan of guys telling stories about their drunken escapades…at least not JP type guys.

          10. Exactly. He seemed to think that JP’s stories wouldn’t win him any friends. While those stories may not appeal to the specific people on that tribe, telling stories is exactly how you bond with people and if those are your stories, they’re your stories. And they will work with other people in this game. It was odd. (Incidentally, adventures in drinking are often the stories I use to make friends too, since the bar is a common social interaction I have with people first)

          11. The thing is – I think JP’s social game in general is pretty good it’s just filled with stuff that Ryan cares nothing about and therefore proclaims as worthless

        4. Yeah, when Ryan was talking about JP this episode, it was the closest I’ve come all season in liking JP.

          1. His story sounded cute. I would much rather have heard the whole thing than using it a background for Ryan’s monologue.

            I also was just generally into JP this episode. His performance at tribal made him seem less like the blank slate he’s been so far and more like a lovable idiot. The fact that none of that has made the show makes me suspect these people are going to do exactly what they said they are vote him out at the merge, because nobody can beat a big, strong doofus at balancing and solving puzzles.

      2. I mean it was still a mistake that cost him an ally. I still believe if he had played it right and included Ali in the conversation in the first place he could have had Chrissy and Ali going into the merge rather than just Chrissy.

  44. – Even though Ali was my fav so far this season, I have to admit that edit was probably too kind on her. Not sure she played that well in the pre-merge. She seemingly had all these allies at different points – Simone, Patrick and Roark and lost all of them by choice or blindside. I think her mistake was at the initial hustler tribe itself. She seemed to be make the most connections right off the bat and should have kept her crew together, instead of going along with Ryan/Devon.
    – Looking forward, I am kinda with Andy now, not sure who I am rooting for, closest may be Ben or Mike. I do want to see a downfall for Ryan and Chrissy though. And I am reasonably confident that neither of those 2 are winning the season. They will control the post merge- all the numbers are on their side. Ryan will bring Devon and possibly Lauren while Chrissy will have the other 3 heroes with her.
    – That leaves the Healers, they have been under-edited from the start and I really don’t see a healer winning this. Joe and Mike will probably play the role of disrupter and underdog respectively while I expect either of Cole or Jessica will be the merge boot. (Won’t be surprised if it is Jessica given how hard Cole has been set to be one).
    – I am still getting a funny vibe from Lauren’s edit this season. I maintain that her archetype would normally get zero visibility like Sunday in MvGx unless they either make the end game or are pivotal in one way or another. Contrary to the prevailing opinion on here, she does not just get confessionals of complaining about someone. Even after the Patrick boot episode, she has gotten strategic confessionals; she was the one narrated and used Cole’s babbling as a way to sow discord among healers and even this episode she got a confessional abut trying to turn mike to her’s and Ben’s side.

    1. The thing about Lauren’s strategic confessionals is that the strategy always seems to be “I’m going to harp on how bad this other person is in order to save myself”. Which isn’t bad strategy, but also reinforces her sour temperament.

      1. I just don’t find her very sour. That really isn’t how she reads to me at all. I think she’s someone who has a strong work ethic and opinions, but I don’t see those as a negative. Tbh it feels like some of the blowback on her is very much based on her not being a young *hottie*. Not yours, perhaps, but from comments I’ve read in this section.

        1. My issue is that I can’t think of a single Lauren moment that didn’t involve her complaining about someone. Which one am I missing?

          1. Hey, I watch each episode once and don’t do a podcast. I am horrible at remembering exact quotes, but I guess I just don’t hear it as complaining. I almost always agree with her points.

        2. I usually gravitate away from the young hotties because they are usually boring characters. It’s characters like Lauren who are often interesting to me. I’ve enjoyed her a bit when she’s talked about her work ethic and being a fish out of water, but her sour denunciations of two goofballs who I think are pretty fun characters (Patrick, Cole) are the parts of Lauren that are often highlighted – with her narrating her vast irritation over montages of them doing hilarious, inept things. It’s that contrast of seeing something that amuses me while hearing sour comments about those same (funny) things that give me the impression that she’s a real drag to have around.

          I contrast that with how Shambo was edited. She also was a fish out of water with a strong work ethic and a sour attitude towards her beachmates – but there was so much more Shambo in there that her attitude towards the young hotties was only one part of the bigger, more idiosyncratic picture of Shambo. Not so much with Lauren, at least not yet.

          1. Ah, well Patrick annoyed the hell out of me, and I find Cole to be overly self-indulgent so that would be why I am, umm, usually in total agreement with Lauren (aside from the red-head thing because I love them, and ugh, weird to hate on genetics).

          2. Ah! Well I think that pretty much sums up why we differ on Lauren. If those two annoyed me, I’d probably also be all-in on her, because her content outside of her perspective on those two is right up my alley. But so far I’ve found Cole and Patrick to be harmless idiots who amuse me. Like Eddie in Caramoan who was one of the few saving graces of that nearly intolerable season.

            What did you think of Shambo? I was a big fan.

          3. PS Ben and Dr. Mike also expressed major annoyance with Cole. Why doesn’t that get the scorn that Lauren does? That’s part of my beef, I guess. Aren’t they also “complaining”? I really think it’s something about her tone or the edit that is making so many of you hate on her when she isn’t saying or doing anything wrong.

            Patrick was voted out because he was driving the tribe crazy. She wasn’t alone.

          4. Ben and Dr. Mike also expressed major annoyance with Cole. Why doesn’t that get the scorn that Lauren does? That’s part of my beef, I guess. Aren’t they also “complaining”?

            I can’t speak for others, but for me at least, it is as straightforward as Ben and Mike expressing such sentiments briefly while having really strong personal content outside of their reactions to Cole. The edit has really emphasized Lauren’s distaste for Cole (and Patrick) in a way that makes that distaste central to her characterization so far.

            Tl;dr: I blame it on the edit!

  45. I don’t really like Chrissy bit she’s now my rooting interest. Old lady strategic threat deserves to win sometime.

    1. Tonight, for me, she transformed from maybe-hot, to hot. Maybe familiarity, maybe the island, I dunno, but it happened.

        1. That may not continue. I seem to recall Chrissy tweeting after last week’s episode that it was Ali who was braiding everybody’s hair.

      1. Yes but as they say “beggars can’t be choosers” also this is why I don’t think she’s going to actually win.

  46. Third off my pick 4 with Ali. All my hopes and dreams rest with Ben! Please make a long run, Ben. Not only are you my favorite, you’re my last hope.

    I sure wish Ryan was more charismatic so I could enjoy him more. I want him to be another Kenny Huang, and there’s hope for that, but I was fascinated by Kenny since his first awkward episode and fascination with Ryan has yet to happen. Funny to think that Ryan is less charismatic than Kenny when the latter wasn’t exactly a shining star of charisma – but at least he was a lot more interesting. Unique even, given his race (on Survivor). I don’t loathe Ryan or anything, I just wish he were more compelling because his moves are compelling and smart.

    I liked Ali at the start of this season but not so much after that first episode. This episode felt like just desserts for her getting rid of Patrick, a loyal ally and a person she actually knows and could presumably control. This is probably an unpopular opinion since Ali is smart and attractive and a far more compelling character than JP. But hey you reap what you sow sometimes. She was nowhere near as good a player as I had hoped.

    – Chrissy and Doc Mike were as enjoyable as ever. Joe as annoying. Desi as easy on the eyes as always.

    – Probst was so, so gratingly over the top during the reward challenge. Can’t believe they gave the episode title to him.

    – The scene with Cole was sorta scary, that babbling he did after falling in particular. Although it was pretty cool seeing Doctor and Nurse handle it so quickly. Reminded me of work!

    So I’ve had a couple whiskeys and I want to get some things off of my chest here that I doubt will increase my popularity.

    It’s dispiriting reading little jabs at Ryan because of his politics. Being a Trump supporter doesn’t mean a person is evil. It may mean that they are somewhat stupid and/or have a certain tunnel vision that ignores all of the many, many horrible things about our messed-up president. But I don’t think that equals a crummy person. I have relatives who support (or supported) him who are not evil, including my dad. Most of those relatives aren’t even white! I check out Breitbart from time to time because I like to check out what the opposition thinks, and many of the people who post there clearly aren’t evil. They are just not that smart and certainly not on the same page as me politically. The thing that I dislike about them the most is the constant pigeonholing of progressives like myself as being a certain kind of person. It bothers me when my fellow progressives here (I assume) do the same sort of thing. I’m not that into Ryan, but that’s all about how so-so he is as a character on my screen.

    And the hate on Chrissy also bugs. She aggressive, has a good-sized ego, has shown who she is, and she’s a smart, strategic OLDER WOMAN who is making moves, making allies, while still showing a lot of realness in both her confessionals and at tribal… on a show that rarely has any interest in this demographic. People don’t like her because she’s targeted other women so far and has shown some not-so-resting bitch face and attitude? I just don’t get it. She’s been fucking rad from jump and has continued to be so each episode.

    But hey I thought the Zeke outing episode last season was one of the strongest episodes ever because the ugliness of the outing was outweighed by a trans man showing the world how strong and awesome he is, while being supported by what amounted to a rainbow coalition (including a hardcore conservative) of sudden allies. So I’m clearly out of step here at times. The main reaction I remember from PRP was that we shouldn’t forgive Jeff Varner and “I wish I didn’t have to see that, it was so uncomfortable, it’s not the kind of Survivor I enjoy”.

    Since watching Survivor as a kid and meeting a “fat fag” who turned out to be a shot-caller and assassin in season one, watching a black man get shamed by two white assholes in Africa, watching a psychopath manipulate everyone in Thailand, seeing multiple emotional breakdowns in Palau, and FINALLY seeing an all-black final three in Fiji and watching two of them get shamed by even more assholes… since I was young, this show has always been equal parts entertainment and social experiment to me. I wouldn’t have kept watching this show if it didn’t push buttons. And more importantly, it has celebrated outsiders whenever possible (or mocked them, which obviously is not so great). Outsiders include people like Ryan and Chrissy.

    I get annoyed by my fellow progressives in real life too. Trying times make people more irritable all over, I guess. Maybe what I’m reacting to is the understandable tiredness that people are feeling all the time because of the times we’re living in. But I’ve just gotta say: I feel like we’ve always been living in the times we’re living in – it’s just been more undercover than it is now. Maybe it’s just my personal experiences and the color of my skin and the sexual orientation of many of my friends and co-workers… but the world and this country have never felt like safe spaces to me. And knee jerk reactions still get under my skin, from the right or the left. I mean I’m sorry that people are more depressed lately than they have been in the past, but hey welcome to my world – it’s heavy but not unbearably so. Certainly not so heavy that I have to OTTN react to characters on Survivor. And, to paraphrase something we say to each other at work from time to time, there’s a real joy and power in being a part of the opposition.

    Okay rant over, just had to get it off of my chest. Please don’t hate me. This is still far and away the best Survivor website and certainly my own favorite. It’s a safe space with people who think like me politically, and PRP is not ridiculous like reddit, not toxic like Sucks (not that I’ve been there for years), not up its own ass like Inside Survivor (that’s another good website though), and not as tunnel-visioned as RHAP.

    Anyway: overall, once I got over my sadness of losing Patrick and realizing that both Roark and Ali weren’t going to be the awesome players I had hoped… I have to say that this has been an enjoyable season so far. I’ve watched each episode twice and they hold up. Nowhere near an amazing season and often dull in comparison to other seasons… but not bad either. Certainly nothing that has gotten under my skin as far as players treating other players badly.

    1. You bring up some great points, Prom King, even if I may disagree with some of what you said. I know that I fall into this trap from time to time (especially with this season). However, this post is a great reminder of what is great about this community. We can respectfully disagree with each other but still remain civil and friends.

      1. Yep that’s a big part of why I love this particular community. It is one of the very few that I’m active on online. I don’t even go near Twitter!

    2. I’m in a rush so I’ll have to go back and read your comment over more closely later, but I just wanted to chime in and say I agree that people might be reacting to Ryan a little too harshly. Do we even know he’s a Trumper for sure? I’ve noticed/felt a knee jerk reaction toward negativity in political discourse these days (that’s a big duh, right? haha) but this past year has shaken me and I’ve been consciously trying not to take the bait as much. Though venting feels good sometimes, I don’t really think catastrophizing and attacking help anything. That’s what got us into this mess. It’s really, really (really) hard but I’ve been trying to be kinder and more generous when dealing with opinions I don’t care for, even if all of it just happens in my head while I’m scrolling through Facebook. I’m very conflicted though, because I also know that something has to be done in order to effect change. But I just have hit a point where I don’t think arguing and being angry is going to fix it – or at the very least, it’s not helping my mental well being at all.

    3. If Ryan were only funny, I think it would make huge inroads to us liking him more. Right now he’s smarmy without being charming or amusing. But yes, I’ll agree that politics may be playing a role in molding the “character” of Ryan on this show; so long as folks continue to remember that character != the person then I’m fine with making jokes over the archetype of a “Ryan”, so long as we’re willing to be flexible should he decide to just tell a fucking knock knock joke or something for a change.

      The Christy stuff is just editing; the show is working hard to make her look like a bitch with all those quick shots of her frowning or rolling her eyes. They want to show us her giving people negative reactions to justify *something* in the future. But other than her people-handling skills (and those people all so far having been voted off), I agree that she might be getting too much hate.

      1. Agreed on Ryan. With the people that we have been comparing him to, they seem to be closer to the character that the show/themselves were putting them in (with the slight exception of pre-game Cagayan Spencer). Ryan seems to want to be the nerdy villain to get the screentime.

        With Chrissy, you may be right. We are supposed to not like Chrissy even if she is making good moves. Just like Ashley, there is just something there that I don’t like about Chrissy.

        1. My guess is maybe she’s the inadvertent FTC goat but the show has no storyline reason to explain it other than “people didn’t like her”. She may have played a perfectly good game but she’s the mom and the mom isn’t allowed to win unless she’s sweet and wholesome. To justify her loss they need us not to like her either, which isn’t hard to do with all the footage they have. That’s my read so far.

          1. She seems to be getting the hubris edit (the Savage edit), rather than the cocky yet endearing rapscallion (the Sandra/Boston Rob) edit.

      2. They are editing her a bit like they edited Caroline. Both played pretty active games (although Caroline was better in challenges). But Caroline did not have people after her from day 1 really. Her initial tribe would have voted for her if Katrina were not there. Ali and Roark did go after her last week.

    4. I struggle sometimes to separate Ryan the player on Survivor from whatever his politics are. I really do try and I would dislike him based on what the show presents. I believe comments I’ve made about him has been based on the show and no him as a person but I can see how I’ve been overly mean or critical sometimes. I’m still angry, hurt and scared and every crushing thing that Trump and his people do has not made it better. I don’t understand how anyone can still support the man. I’m not ready to make nice either. I’m not picking fights but I’m not backing down. Shit needs to change and I’m still trying to find the approach.

      As for Chrissy, I believe the show is presenting her as the villain. Someone they want me ro root against. I like a lot of aspects of Chrissy and i think sometimes I want her to be something she isn’t. That’s not totally fair. I can’t stand that she has targeted women but I do think I’ve been too harsh on a player and how they play. She hasn’t done anything evil. I will think about my comments and what you’ve said in future. Being a mean asshole is not a version of myself I like and I’m always working on being better.

      1. Same here brother, same here. I am a work in progress and probably always will be. And I definitely get the angry, hurt, and scared because I feel that way too and so does pretty much everyone else I know and work with. And shit definitely needs to change. Every day brings new examples of the idiocy of certain idiot policy makers.

    5. Good post, don’t agree with everything.
      – Agree on Chrissy. Don’t understand this narrative of her hating other woman because she voted out the loony person on her tribe and then targeted another from a tribe with most numbers left in the game. She gives off a vibe that she gravitates towards men but not one that she would intentionally target women over men even if logic dictated otherwise.
      – I defended Ali last week but I was wrong, she didn’t really play that well this season.
      – On Ryan, I am afraid I just can’t warm up to him. I don’t like him for some of the same reasons I never liked Cochran.

        1. Heh.. not worth it, to be honest I found his AMA to be pretty good, just can’t stand his survivor persona.

      1. I like Cochran well enough but not as much as Probst likes Cochran. Probst liking Cochran so much makes me like Cochran a little bit less. Cochran winning one of the most ugly and mean-spirited of seasons also makes me like him less. And my feelings about Cochran were shaped by one of my all-time favorites, Sophie, so there’s that too.

        And thanks! I woke up this morning thinking Oh God, what did I write last night. I don’t drink that much so two whiskeys almost equals a bender for me.

        1. Well Sophie had no time for the in-game persona of Cochran in South Pacific. She likes him in real life now but like I said I have no opinion on real-life Cochran, similarly I don’t know why exactly Probst likes Cochran, they are friends in real life as far as I know, so there must be something to it. But I hate how Cochran is held up by Probst as someone who is antithetical to a generic survivor winner, basically a nerdy whimpy beta male somehow winning.

          1. Yeah the reasons Probst likes Cochran are all reasons for me supporting why I don’t actually appreciate Probst’s perspective on Survivor all that much.

    6. My main issue with Ryan is that I think going all in on Chrissy last week and refusing to tell Ali anything was a really bad move and he did not seem to realize it.

        1. Yeah, I’m guessing these 600+ comments contain other people besides me here pointing to how much angrier he obviously was when denying that he was angry to her.

          He’s an admitted weasel, and obviously fucked up and delusional about how his ethics are holding up in this ethics-challenging game. I think we are also seeing a bit of a decent fellow in there, trying to make the best of his situation, but I can’t help but be more disappointed at how he handled that post-tribal period, so blind to reality to even suggest that the whole dust-up was a bad look for her.

      1. Not telling Ali about the Roark vote: bad move.
        Voting out Ali to negate the bad move: Possible good move? I reserve judgment.

        1. I’ll be interested to see how he spins it to Devon and Lauren. Devon knew about the secret idol so he could probably win him back around, but I don’t think Lauren’s going to be cool with him having betrayed one of their own (her only ally!), no matter how much of a good story he comes up with. Which, judging by the excuse he gave to Ali, is not going to be particularly compelling anyway.