Survivor Millennials vs Gen X Episode 9 Liveblog: “Still Throwing Punches”

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"Still Throwin' Punches" - Justin Starrett, Adam Klein, Ezekiel/Zeke Smith, Jessica Lewis and Hannah Shapiro on the ninth episode of SURVIVOR: Millennials vs. Gen. X, airing Wednesday, Nov. 16 (8:00-9:00 PM, ET/PT) on the CBS Television Network. Photo: Monty Brinton/CBS Entertainment ©2016 CBS Broadcasting, Inc. All Rights Reserved.

 

Matt
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Matt

Matt has an irrational dislike for all contestants named Michel(l)e. Also if he ever takes a strong stance about why everyone else is wrong, it is he that is inevitably wrong.

Favorite seasons: Micronesia, Heroes vs. Villains, Palau, Philippines, Pearl Islands, Cagayan
Matt
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  • patti renshaw

    I’m hoping will jay or Taylor leave especially Taylor

  • jersey_luck

    You know what after that scene of Taylor bragging about stealing food I can honestly say that he is a fun character.

    • the sky is falling

      You misspelled “doofus idiot”

      • jersey_luck

        He can and is both

        • Hornacek

          It can be blah blah blah.

    • Kingoftonga

      He basically made food stealing a core aspect of his personal identity this episode, and he was way more likable for it.

  • the sky is falling

    Taylor:
    “I have inside info about worst advantage ever, he knows I have been stealing food.
    I have the upper ground , bro!”
    Smh

  • Alycia Swift

    Taylor – everyone notices you stole food. Didn’t they talk about it at tribal counsel?

    I joined a few minutes late so I’m a little behind.

    • Kemper Boyd

      Just skip the reward challenge andyou’ll catch up

      • Alycia Swift

        I love this conversation between Hannah and Jay. Jay looks so pissed during the conversation.

        • Kemper Boyd

          whilst also forgetting he just left Hannah out of a vote that blindsided HER ally.

  • the sky is falling

    Please let Taylor be medevaced for complications from overeating. cmon 2016, you owe us one.

  • Alycia Swift

    OMG – I eat more so I can eat more. Taylor is an idiot.

  • the sky is falling

    I would like to take this moment to give props to Matt, live blogging seems like a massive chore. my sluggish gen-X mind is blown.

    • Purplerockmatt

      hey thanks. the key is that I have to finish dinner before the episode begins because all of my attention is on the episode and my computer (also I admittedly miss tons of small stuff, because I am listening more than watching a lot of the time)

      • the sky is falling

        I feel for you, my main thought when reading live blog is, dam must be hard to enjoy the show while doing this shit

        • Purplerockmatt

          well my enjoyment comes as much from seeing what you guys are tweeting and my enjoyment at doing the live blog itself as from the show. Like watching while live blogging is this weird kind of communal experience instead of straight watching.

          • the sky is falling

            Yeah, kinda agree, but I used to go on lockdown when survivor came on, just sayin your sacrifice is appreciated here, thumbs up!

  • Kemper Boyd

    If it’s Jessica tonight I am going to be very very unhappy.

    • Alycia Swift

      Me 2.

    • Alkanarra

      But on the other hand, it will bring Hannah one step closer to her Chris Daugherty-style victory.

  • Mike Hirsch

    I love that every time Jeff says “…and soft drinks,” Will is like “…goddammit.”

    • the sky is falling

      Should will be subject to local drinking laws, chug, man

      • Hornacek

        Someone said that they have to abide by U.S. rules, not sure if this is the case.

        Will should have just grabbed the beer and drank it down.

        • indescribable hat

          I don’t think they have to, but they do. They always follow U.S. law in addition to the law where they’re shooting.

          • Hornacek

            Probably want to avoid another international incident like with the Australian barrier reef.

    • sharculese

      He’s just wondering where the milk is.

    • Something Quirky

      I was wondering if Will’s ever tried alcohol before. He is super religious and all.

      • Hornacek

        Now I want to see Will take one sip of alcohol and have him immediately pass out.

      • Hornacek

        But Jesus turned water into wine!

        Also, one of my favorite Family Guy quotes:

        Peter (drinking communion wine in church): This is the blood of Christ?!? Man, that guy must have been wasted 24-7!

        • Alycia Swift

          Did Dave write that line?

          • Hornacek

            If he did then he’s already won in my book.

  • Kemper Boyd

    Quick point. I’m pretty sure the drinking age in Fiji is 18.

    • corndogshuffle

      Confirmed.

      • Kemper Boyd

        It was a British colony and basically only America has a drinking age of 21.

        • Purplerockmatt

          I think there is some rule that because this is an American tv show it cannot show or have someone drinking that isn’t legally allowed to drink in America

          • Kingoftonga

            CBS doesn’t want to isolate all those The Great Outdoors viewers by promoting underage drinking.

          • Correct. According to the super-long contract, the contestants have to abide by both US and the host country’s laws, but the US’s comes first. That is why if there is an underage contestant, they also have alternative drinks aka pop, tea, and milk.

          • Kemper Boyd

            ouch, sucks to be Will.

          • This started in China, I believe, with Frosti.

          • sharculese

            Didn’t stop them from showing that secret scene in SJDS where Baylor got fucking trashed.

          • andythesaint

            But it MAY have made it an secret scene, rather than a “aired on CBS” scene.

          • sharculese

            Oh no, I totally think the plan with Baylor was that they were gonna let her drink in moderation and just not show it, but then she got drunk too fast because she didn’t know her tolerance and they couldn’t put it on the show.

            I also wouldn’t be shocked if there were moments in this challenge where Probst was like “hey Will, you can grab a beer if you like, we’ll just burn the footage.”

          • andythesaint

            I’m guessing it’s more that if he had won the challenge, they would’ve let him sneak a drink. But at the challenge, there was too much danger of him being in a key shot.

          • Wait, what?

          • sharculese

            The reward that Natalie and Jeremy give up to Jon and Jaclyn where they go on the boat and eat sandwiches. Baylor got stupid drunk and there’s a secret scene where she’s just sprawled across Alec’s lap.

          • I just looked up her age on Survivor Wiki and she was 20 at the time. Yikes. Did they clearly say that she was drunk?

          • sharculese

            No, she’s just obviously drunk.

          • That’s kinda awful that a) they let her drink even though they often discuss how the young ones can’t drink, b) they would shoot the footage of her drunk, and c) that they would even include it as a secret scene without a confessional (no matter how fake or tacked on it was) about it being due to sugar or something else besides alcohol.

          • Figaro

            I wonder if with Baylor it had something to do with her mum being there at the time. I don’t know what the laws are in the States re. underage drinking, but here it’s legal for you to drink if you’re below the drinking age IF your parent/guardian is with you and takes responsibility for you. So potentially Missy’s presence may have changed the rules slightly?

          • Hornacek

            Now that was a sticky situation.

          • Streets_Ahead

            Plus they don’t want letters from those angry Facebook moms complaining that let an 18 year old drink.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            But he saw titties! Give him one beer before you restrict him to milk. Let Will live the dream!

          • indescribable hat

            The U.S.’s can’t come first. If the country they’re actually in required by law that you do something illegal in the U.S., you would have to do it. In the absence of any such conflict, you obey both laws, which in this case means neither drinking when you’re under 18 nor drinking when you’re under 21.

          • That is what I meant in my head but I didn’t type it. I guess hearing about them letting Baylor drink blew my mind a little bit.

    • Poor Sheltered Homeschooler

      Jeff casually tossing Actual Child Will under the bus (repeatedly) was my favorite part of this episode. That is the only acceptable way for Jeff to discuss the players’ ages.

      • Purplerockmatt

        It was amazing and was consistently hilarious. I want Will to stick around for a long time just for this reason

        • I am hope that he is around for his loved one visit and his loved one is his mom. That way, he can tattletale on Probst to his mom (who may actually be younger than Probst).

          • Purplerockmatt

            God now I want that too

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            I hope his loved one is the milkman.

          • Hornacek

            “Will, I’m not just here as your milkman. I’m here … as your father.”

        • Poor Sheltered Homeschooler

          *Will wins a car*
          *goes for the key*
          *Jeff snatches it away*
          JEFF: “Oh, I’m sorry, Will, but you only have a learner’s permit, you can’t drive this by yourself.”
          WILL: “I have a license–”
          JEFF: “Pick someone else to come with you and drive.”
          WILL: “But I can–”
          JEFF: “Oh, nevermind, I’ll just drive. I’m feeling spontaneous today. Isn’t that how all you millennials are??”

          • I would have to have someone in the car if I won a car on Survivor.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            JEFF: “Hey, fella. Can I get you to climb in the back seat?”

          • Other Scott

            We have a car-seat ready just for you!

          • Hornacek

            “Get in the back seat and let me drive.”

          • Alycia Swift

            Funny, but in NJ, where Will lives, he can drive.

        • Hornacek

          As long as Will is still in the game, I want alcohol to be included in every reward.

      • Other Scott

        I wonder if the Will not being able to drink the beer was for the benefit of the show, and it just cut all the scenes where he was completely drinking as much beer as he could

        • corndogshuffle

          Who would be drunkest – Drunk Will, Drunk Big Tom, or Drunk Ted?

          • Drunk Bruce and Bob Dogg.

          • Other Scott

            Based on completely unscientific and untrue generalization of people with deep voices being able to hold their liquor better, Drunk Normal-Sized Tom.

    • DrVanNostrand

      Will was just disappointed there was no milk.

      • Other Scott

        I loved Will’s >:C expressions when they were like “you don’t get the cocktails!”

  • the sky is falling

    Ken challenge run begins!

  • Alycia Swift

    Yay, Ken won! I am so glad Taylor lost.

  • the sky is falling

    Hmm, David is getting a narrator edit, that’s bad, right?

    • Ms. Sweaterfan

      Unless you’re Cochran 2.0 or Tyson 3.0, I guess (so maybe in your first game)

  • the sky is falling

    Taylor does not understand Adams advantage

  • Kemper Boyd

    But Taylor… Adam hasn’t stolen the visit yet and yes it will make people hate him. I don’t get your leverage.

    • Alycia Swift

      I was not trying to be sneaky – but I did hide food. Um, that’s the defination of sneaky.

      • the sky is falling

        Adam should have told everyone about that reward immediately

        • Kemper Boyd

          Adam should have offered to just throw it in the fire right then and there.

          • the sky is falling

            yeah really, it’s clearly a disadvantage, I woulda dropped it the second I found it

          • Ms. Sweaterfan

            YES! That’s what I was shouting at my TV the whole time!

          • turgid_legume

            Here is the speech I would have given if I were Adam at that moment:

            Okay, look, first of all I wasn’t doing anything shady like idol hunting. The thing was literally a rolled up piece of paper sitting at the well. And as soon as I read it I knew Survivor had trolled me, because this reward is garbage, and I have no intention of ever using it. If there was a volcano nearby I would have tossed it in like Boston Rob. You’d have to be a complete moron to take somebody’s loved one from them, and only someone like Taylor would think of that. Here, Jeff, I’m tossing this parchment in the fire to signal that I don’t want this. *mic drop*

    • Alycia Swift

      Ken – interesting looks.

  • Alycia Swift

    Jay – no. You were not pissed.

    • DrVanNostrand

      He did a good job for the most part this week, but that was dumb.

    • Hornacek

      PISSED!

  • the sky is falling

    Ugh, STFU Jeff! It’s not a millenial thing! Goddammit!

    • Hornacek

      We needed another reaction shot of Zeke rolling his eyes.

  • Kemper Boyd

    Taylor actually gives me actual flashbacks to being a teenager and having stoner boys who are dumb as shit just talk over me and tell me I’m wrong consistently. It actually makes me feel really uncomfortable.

    • corndogshuffle

      Listening to Taylor talk was mind numbing. I wish Adam was a good player, because he didn’t do a good job at all of selling his side of the story.

      • Kemper Boyd

        If you really listen to Adam it’s obvious he’s telling the truth because Taylor and Jay both just talk over him and gaslight him by slightly changing their story or upping the lie. So Adam helped Taylor bury them, then Adam says no I just watched you, Taylor says he ate from it, Adam says no, later Taylor says “he said he ate it” again Adam says no. This is classic. It’s a way to get the other person so emotional no one believes them.

        • corndogshuffle

          It was definitely obvious he was telling the truth, I meant with the advantage. I thought he came across as overly defensive and missed an easy chance to simply say “this is the worst advantage ever, if I use it I instantly become a goat:.

          Maybe I’m just soured on Adam after his recent performances, I don’t know.

          • Kemper Boyd

            yeah the move is to either use it on Jay who you just had a blow up with immediately or throw it in the fire in front of everyone.

          • corndogshuffle

            I think he will be able to minimize the damage in that way. But I think either way damage has been done to his game. I think it’s always bad to have any secret drug out into public view the way his advantage was.

          • Kemper Boyd

            The damage was done already. Hannah and Zeke don’t like him much in the game and if they don’t where is he finding easy allies?

          • Hornacek

            Apparently, Adam still thinks that this advantage is the best thing ever.

        • Baulderstone

          Sure, but even the best case scenario is that everyone believes Adam didn’t eat the food, but he was spending an awful lot of time palling around in secret meetings with Taylor and Jay, telling them secrets that he didn’t share with his supposed real allies.

          Nobody needs to believe the full truth of the lie to come away feeling Adam is a snake.

          • andythesaint

            A feeling that was already out there before ANY of this came to light, stretching all the way back to pre-merge with Jessica and Ken.

          • Baulderstone

            That is true. I still think this makes him look a lot worse though, It is one that to know your ally is a little squirelly and needs to be managed carefully. It’s worse to know that he was having midnight meeting with your enemies, telling them all his deepest in-game secrets.

            It’s the step between “We really need to be careful working with this guy” and “We really shouldn’t work with this guy.”

      • Baulderstone

        If Adam was a good player, there would be no story, Taylor only had this play because Adam thought it was a good idea to buddy up to his worst enemy, the players whose girlfriend her had voted out.

        A good player might have caught him on the beach, but a good player never would have said, “Hey, now that I have something I can use as leverage on you, let me give you some big leverage on me, and I have no plan to actually use you in any way, just to keep voting loyally with the alliance that is voting you out so you have nothing to lose by blowing this up in my face.”

        Good player and Adam are incompatible concepts. Taylor just lit a bonfire that Adam carefully built, poured gasoline on, then handcuffed himself to.

        • corndogshuffle

          That last paragraph might be my favorite summation of Adam as a player in this game. I love it.

    • Poor Sheltered Homeschooler

      That was so painful, because I knew that I would be reacting exactly the way Adam was at that moment (even as I could see it was hurting him). Adam’s in a tailspin the last two episodes, but I’m really pulling for him and hoping he can right the ship.

      • The Adam thing makes me uncomfortable to watch because, a bit like the Shirin thing, Adam really doesn’t seem like a bad guy and I think he’s really being piled on by the cool dudes in quite an unpleasant way. But it’s going to keep happening, because it’s not really in anyone else’s interests to make it stop, since as long as Adam is around to be the punching bag he’s pulling focus in a way that’s quite convenient.

        • Something Quirky

          And also, somewhat like things Shirin did, he’s not helping himself, and is in fact doing things that are making it much worse for his game.

    • It’s so infuriating that gaslighting Adam like that was actually quite a good technique, but it didn’t even come from strategy on Taylor’s part, or anything like that. It was just pure instinctive asshole. From the soul.

      • Kemper Boyd

        The problem is there are loads of things that are deplorable that are good moves in Survivor. Survivor is all about controlling narratives and discrediting people and gaslighting can work well. It just sucks to watch. Also Taylor is an arsehole.

  • Alycia Swift

    Bret – crossing himself?

    • Oh yeah, he was.

    • Diego Armando

      You can take the cop out of Boston, but you can’t take Boston out of the cop.

    • Hornacek

      That’s right out of the funeral director’s handbook.

  • Alycia Swift

    Jeff – that was both consequences and strategy. Adam is now the best goat.

  • the sky is falling

    fairly boring episode, they did their best to make it interesting, to no avail

    • K.P. Watershed

      Needed about 10 more minutes of Probst making fun of Will’s age

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        “Are you ready to hear what the reward is? The winners will fly via helicopter to the finest Fijian casino… or… Fiji Chuck E. Cheese!”

        • sharculese

          I held off here on making a Gary Glitter joke. But I wanted to.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Next time… please make that joke.

  • Alycia Swift

    Jay voted for Taylor – that’s why he did not use his idol.

  • Black Dynamite

    Hannah Moment of the Week: Her confessional with the sentimental music & all her Tribal Council facial expressions. The rise of Hannah continues. We are all witnesses.

    • Alkanarra

      Yeah, this week finally sold me. I’m with you, BD. Team Hannah all the way.

      • the sky is falling

        My spoiler info makes me think Hannah and Dave have no chance. or perhaps Dave wins and was too skittish to come back

        • Kemper Boyd

          Aubry came back, you don’t need Hannah

          • the sky is falling

            Yeah, agreed

          • K.P. Watershed

            Damn you guys, it is very tempting seeing these spoiler-y comments here but I WILL NOT LOOK AT THEM!

          • How do you do spoiler text because I got more I want to say.

          • Kemper Boyd

            no space between < and s. If you want to close do /spoiler in . If you don’t want to type anything non spoilery you don’t need to close it.

          • Okay, let me try this.
            Aubry is why Sophie got knocked out and was sorta subtweeeting about it at the time. You also don’t need David if you have Varner on the show and Penner as an also-ran.

          • Kemper Boyd

            OHHHH I actually don’t need more of Sophie, I thought she won basically the perfect game for her and maybe she has more ways to win now she isn’t 22 and maybe her and Sandra would be a hoot but yeah I’m cool with no more Sophie

          • I would agree with this.

          • Max_Jets

            I can see that as a game player, but not as a character. Every Sophie confessional is gold.

          • Especially if she was on a tribe with Brad Culpepper and Caleb

          • the sky is falling

            Uh one of those guys is no longer with us 🙁

          • Purplerockmatt

            the one from last season…

          • Kemper Boyd

            you are correct. She is a favourite of mine. I’m looking forward to KIA tomorrow on my way to work. Now I think about it Sophie v Sandra v Cirie would be magic.

          • the sky is falling

            before after text…. No spaces

          • the sky is falling

            after

        • Max_Jets

          I don’t know. I bet a lot of people wouldn’t want to play back to back. Don’t they get like two weeks as a break? More than 2 would be a lot of returnees for a season that hadn’t aired yet.

        • andythesaint

          I genuinely believe that knowing who returns from this season tells us NOTHING about how well they did or did not do this time. That cast has everything from undateable pre-mergers to winners on it.

    • She’s not a Captain of Sports.

  • Black Dynamite

    I loved how Jay played this. He needed to get rid of Taylor. He’s free to maneuver among the quickly malfunctioning Gen X Tribe.

    • Kemper Boyd

      Adam was right about Taylor being the reason Jay was at the bottom.

    • DrVanNostrand

      He also got Will to vote with him so he could save the idol.

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        I thought Will wrote down Jay’s name.

        • He did like a young Caucasian Woo.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Now that needs a hashtag!

        • DrVanNostrand

          That’s what I get for posting here when I should be paying attention to the end of the show.

          • Purplerockmatt

            I missed it too, until I saw the names at the end

          • Purplerockmatt

            this is the weird thing, i looked up the votes again, and it seems that jay had 3 + Will, while taylor had 6 + Jay, so the original split was 6-3 which is smart when protecting who you really want out

    • Poor Sheltered Homeschooler

      Jay is a stone-cold killer. A killer with bad taste in friends and a questionable grasp of numbers, but a killer nevertheless.

      Also, the fact that Jay voted for Taylor, but Taylor left talking about his “new best friend” Jay? That bodes very well for Jay’s ability to manage a jury if he reaches the Final Three.

      • Kemper Boyd

        or that Taylor is just straight up dumb as fuck.

        • Kingoftonga

          Yeah, any other player would immediately realize that there was only one vote for Adam counted…

          • Mike Hirsch

            Taylor probably came to the conclusion that Jay selflessly voted for himself even though that’s not a thing.

          • sharculese

            My favorite walkthrough of Natalie’s RHAP walkthrough of SJDS was when they got to the Alec vote off, and she said she briefly considered letting Jaclyn keep thinking he voted for himself before deciding that was a bit much.

          • Hornacek

            No word of a lie, that episode is the one I am currently listening to. Natalie’s exasperation with Jon, Jaclyn, and everyone else is hilarious

          • I want to see Natalie play again so badly. Or Nadiya. I want one of the twinnies to just show up on the beach and be all ‘ah, but which one am I?’ and start cackling.

          • Hornacek

            Natalie is now talking about voting Keith out and getting to the final three. She says “I knew I had it in the bag” (was going to win at the FTC) “when after Keith got voted out both Missy and Jaclyn asked ‘I wonder who Keith is going to vote for?'” Natalie says she wanted to respond “Maybe the one of us that talked to Keith every day instead of not at all? The one of us that actually worked with him and saved him at tribal?”

            As bad as that season is, Natalie in the second half brings it up in the rankings a lot.

          • Which podcast is this exactly? I should listen

          • Hornacek

            It’s between season 29 and 30 … (checks phone) … it’s dated 2015-01-14, almost 3 hours with Natalie going through the entire season and then answering questions. It’s great – she doesn’t hold any punches talking about how ridiculous Jon is or how badly Jaclyn got tore apart at the final tribal.

          • Hornacek

            I liked the recent RHAP episode where Rob and 3 guests drafted tribes totally made up of first boots (one-times only) for a fantasy season, and I think the first (?) pick was Nadiya because “She’s genetically identical to someone who has won the game!”

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            Oh man, casting must have been salivating over the possibility of them getting swapped onto the same tribe, or both making the merge.

        • corndogshuffle

          It can be two things.

          • Kemper Boyd

            he’s a straight up fuck boy.

          • Other Scott

            You seem more savage than usual today Kemp.

            Next you’re going to be going on about how he’s a wimpy little non-leader.

          • Kemper Boyd

            HOW DARE YOU? I am no Savage. I think it’s that he gives me actual flashbacks to being made to feel really shitty and small as a kid and teenager by boys who weren’t as smart as me and weren’t as nice as me and it just made me angry and sad at the same time.
            I stand by it, he’s a fuck boy.

        • Two things.

      • K.P. Watershed

        Jay wins if he makes it to the end.

        • Prom King

          I just don’t see him ever making it to the end, if for that reason alone. Too many numbers on the jury.

      • Preseason, I said that Jay and Taylor both seemed terrible, but Taylor was definitely the smarter of the two. I may have been wrong.

    • Purplerockmatt

      Jay is a very good player.

      • Black Dynamite

        Agreed. I’m impressed with Jay’s game.

        • Kemper Boyd

          and his jawline, very good jaw.

      • DrVanNostrand

        I’m not as bullish as the rest of you on Jay, but I’d say he’s decent, and a lot better than expected (low bar). He set himself up in a shitty alliance from day 1, but he’s at least clever enough to ride it out and try to work his way back into a majority.

        • sharculese

          Yeah, I don’t hink he was really planning this out or thinking what happens if he clipped Taylor. But he showed creativity and an ability to work in the moment, and that counts for something. It’s like Marquesas B. Rob. Awkward and sometimes cringeworthy, but you see the seeds of something in it.

          • Poor Sheltered Homeschooler

            I could buy Jay as a decent-to-good player who has a very memorable run on a returning players season, causing us to all look much more fondly on his game here in MvGX. (See also: Parvati, Penner, Wentworth)

          • Kemper Boyd

            No one remembers Parvati’s Cook Islands game fondly. It was like training camp for her, it doesn’t matter. Also Cook Islands Penner is my favourite Penner.

          • sharculese

            Philippines Penner is best Penner, but Cook Islands is a close second.

          • Purplerockmatt

            accurate

          • Prom King

            I do! I thought she was pretty charming and was one of the few genuinely entertaining characters that season, second to Cao Boi.

          • Kemper Boyd

            She was the prototypical fun hot girl but her game was almost non-existent. The thing I love about Parvati in the whole Survivor world is the fact her game play was whatever in her first season but she developed and became one of the best ever. It’s cool to see that development.

          • Prom King

            I agree. My affection towards Cook Islands Parvati is solely based on Parvati as a character rather than as a player. It wasn’t until her next two seasons that I began to enjoy her as both.

          • andythesaint

            I WAS JUST GOING TO MAKE THE MARQUESAS ROB COMPARISON.

          • sharculese

            Hey man, great minds and all that.

          • andythesaint

            Yeah, he’s not all the way there yet, but the potential is there for him to do some serious damage with some experience and maturity on his side. And the fact that he comes off as a bit of an idiot here could also help him (no one was scared of Rob Mariano heading into All-Stars).

          • Guest rite

            Jay made me want a Heroes v Villains II.

      • Diego Armando

        He still is in this game (by which I mean he can win). He just needs to get rid of Zeke and David, who are onto him and can convince people to go against him.

  • Alycia Swift

    I thought tonight was a double episode. Was that next week?

    • Kemper Boyd

      I’m deffo not staying up for a double episode.

    • the sky is falling

      If they do a pre thanksgiving recap episode imma be pissed, double ep next week would be sweet

      • Violina23

        They haven’t done clip shows in YEARS, right? Those are the WORST.

    • According to my DVR, it is.

    • Purplerockmatt

      double ep next week

      • Diego Armando

        So Will is a goner.

  • Poor Sheltered Homeschooler

    Taylor was never going to win, but boy was his takedown immensely satisfying.

  • Kemper Boyd

    So we all agree Adam is not great at the game but I do feel like Jay and Taylor twisted everything he said this episode. I didn’t think he was being a jerk to Jay in the water, just being honest, and he was right that Taylor is why Jay was at the bottom. Jay then goes and tells everyone Adam was gloating that Jay is at the bottom.
    Then the whole tribal scene you can see my feelings to below, they just spoke over him, put words in his mouth and generally gaslighted him as he stuck to a single story.
    *He should have just offered the throw the advantage in the fire though.

    • Black Dynamite

      I agree about throwing the advantage in the fire but I doubt he had it on him.

      • Kemper Boyd

        so do it at the camp in the morning in front of everyone. In the morning so it can be read and seen going onto the fire.

        • Black Dynamite

          Co-sign this idea

          • Kemper Boyd

            or just use it on Jay at the very next reward challenge. As Jay is a bridge burned anyway.

        • Violina23

          That’s what I was saying. Loudly. On twitter. In all caps, so Adam might hear/understand me

          • ADAM SORRY! ADAM BURN ADVANTAGE!

            (Sorry, Diego. Had to steal your bit.)

    • Purplerockmatt

      they were definitely twisting what he was saying, but even what they weren’t twisting is damning to Adam as well, which is that he knew that Taylor buried the food and where and didn’t tell everyone else. To everyone else that means that food that Taylor stole, he stole with Adam’s knowledge and Adam didnt stop him. Taylor is the most culpable, but Adam’s sins will still sit poorly with people even if they believed he didn’t eat any of the food or help Taylor bury them

      • sharculese

        Yeah… what I really don’t get about Adam’s play is that he seemed to be wanting to work both sides of the d-bag fence: using the fact that Taylor is a total d-bag to keep him down while always trying to be all “*wink wink* you may be a d-bag but you’re my d-bag.”

        • Purplerockmatt

          Adam is not good at this game!

          • Diego Armando

            He isn’t, but he has given me so much joy this season.

          • Adam is not good at the game.

            BUT I do feel like I want to defend him a bit anyway.

            Adam is playing Survivor while his mother is dying of terminal cancer. He’s literally out there trying to fulfil his mother’s dreams of competing as well as his own, not knowing what’s going on back at home, wanting to make big moves, wanting to get as far as he can – and, I’d guess, feeling to a certain extent that he has to REALLY make this time away from her worth it. Because who wants to leave their dying mother behind and then get sequestered on the pre-jury trip? Or risk being the Purple Brett, on the season but getting no airtime whatsoever? That’s a hell of a lot of pressure to be putting on yourself, in addition to how generally stressful playing Survivor must be.

            When I try to put myself in Adam’s shoes, I can kind of understand why he’s playing the way he is. Yes, he’s playing too hard, and yes, he’s really socially awkward. But he also must be terrified that something is going to happen to his mum and he’s not going to be there with her, and feeling that at least if he goes far it will have been worth it in some small way.

            Sorry, this is not an amusing post :-/

          • Guest rite

            This is a very good post.

          • Reya, this is a beautiful justification.Mad props!

          • Thirty-five Sandcastles

            This might expose me for the heartless monster that i am, but I can’t see where his mom’s illness is the reason he’s terrible at Survivor. If he seemed to be awkwardly reaching to make big, interesting moves (a la Tony) I could see it. But he’s making terrible moves. TERRIBLE. He just seems to be tone deaf and awkward.

            Perhaps the stress of his family situation is making him more so, I guess, but bad player is bad.

        • Evidently it’s really hard to say “I’m not stupid, I will not use this advantage, especially not to take away your loved ones’ visit.”

          I’m starting to get a sense I may have been wrong about Adam winning.

      • andythesaint

        Beyond the food, Adam shared the knowledge of his advantage with Taylor instead of ANY of them.

        Frankly, I don’t think Jay and Taylor gaslit him ENOUGH. There were lines of attack that (from what we saw), they didn’t hit hard enough.

    • Baulderstone

      Yeah, Jay did twist Adam’s words, but I don’t know if it was intentional.

      It’s still all on Adam, as what the fuck was he even doing with that conversation. He gave up so much information to the enemy without even making any play to go along with it. If Adam had at least been telling him all this with an angle to use him, it would have been one thing. Instead, he was just telling Jay he was fucked with no thought to how it Jay would feel about it. I can see Jay taking it as a fuck you.

      He doesn’t see the whole game like we do, so it would be hard for Jay to really believe Adam is clueless as he really is.

      Just the opening of that conversation. Jay approached him, impressed that Adam had the numbers.Jay clearly thought Adam was an actual player in his alliance, and not an extra vote that they tolerated. Adam, rather than working from this position of social advantage, immediately explains that he had to vote out Michelle. He was up against the wall and had to do what they said.

      Then Adam having put himself back in the position of wheedling worm. He lays out his alliance’s plan without any purpose. That was just some really sad gameplay.

      • Kemper Boyd

        No Adam is terrible at the game, that’s what he was doing there. Being bad.

      • andythesaint

        Also key: Adam’s two best friends, with no prompting, IMMEDIATELY agreed with Jay’s assessment of him.

        • Baulderstone

          In all the pathetic Adam-related moments, that one slipped my mind. Thanks for the reminder.

        • Mike Hirsch

          One of my favorite moments of the episode. Like, “Oh hi, Hannah!”

    • hardcöre umlaut

      While I was watching (last night, which is why I am 5 days late to this liveblog lol) I was screaming THROW IT IN THE FIRE ADAM! The fact that an r/survivor superfan didn’t think of that astounds me.

      I think TC and this season in general have shown the privileges white dudes, especially charismatic ones, have on this show. They can literally say anything and (almost) get away with it.

      • Kemper Boyd

        It’s Survivor: White Guy Island.

  • gouis

    Damn that was one basic ass Survivor episode.

    • the sky is falling

      Agreed, fairly predictable

    • Baulderstone

      I found it fairly entertaining as placeholder episodes went though. Both Adam’s amazing idiocy and Taylor’s chaos play at the Council were entertaining even if they didn’t shape much.

      • gouis

        TC has certainly been fun this season.

      • And Hannah.

        • Something Quirky

          She was delightful during the reward challenge.

    • Max_Jets

      I loved it. Funniest episode since Mari’s boot.

    • DrVanNostrand

      Upside: Taylor went home
      Downside: Boring as fuck

    • These Words

      I’m really not getting into this season at all for some reason. Still waiting for it to pick up. Which is strange, because a lot has happened, and I really like a lot of the cast.

      • I think my problem is that I generally like the cast, but I don’t love any specific players. Several of them have shown flashes, but none of them have done enough to totally win me over.

      • gouis

        There’s still lots of time for it to get interesting. A lot of the early players voted out were filler, and we haven’t really had strategic groups go up against each other yet.

        We kind of need Jay to pull something off here to revitalize the season.

    • Hornacek

      The outcome was fairly predictable, but the tribal council made up for it.

  • Hornacek

    Random thoughts:

    Taylor wants to pull Adam aside and make sure they’re still on good terms. I guess he hopes Adam forgot that he just tried to vote him out.

    This week on “Taylor Identifies Food By Taste” …

    “And soft drinks for Will.” “Ah, man!”

    Jessica hates Sunday? When did this happen?

    Jeff describes the food options at the immunity challenge. At this point he’s just trolling Will.

    “Salty” potato chips are a temptation?

    At least Will sits out for the right reason. If you know you’re not gonna win, then go for the food.

    “Why didn’t I opt out?” Bret is desperate for more alcohol.

    Does the immunity necklace look like the blue pieces are part of a pair of sunglasses?

    “People already know I steal food. I mean, who cares?” Um, pretty much everyone in the opposing alliance!

    It’s so funny that we keep hearing Taylor talk about avenging his girlfriend Figgy.

    Taylor – not a dumb surfer.

    “Sorry for stealing food!” Well, as long as you’re sorry it’s ok.

    Next week: Will tells one person about Jay’s idol. He’s too young to have seen the “And they told two friends, and they told two friends, and so on …” commercial.

    And David continues his streak of being the only player to have voted for the right person every time.

    In his final words, which girlfriend is Taylor talking about?

    • Baulderstone

      “Jessica hates Sunday? When did this happen?”

      Remember back before the first shuffle. Sunday was part of the alliance that shunned Ken, David and Jessica. I don’t know, maybe Sunday didn’t hate her at that point, but as a good Christian woman, she could only justify her betrayal if Jessica was evil, therefore, Jessica is evil.

      • Hornacek

        I thought that was Ken, David and CeCe?

        But now I remember David saving Jessica with his idol, but it was Lucy that spear-headed that vote, everyone else just went along with it. Why hate Sunday more than Chris and Bret? But I guess Sunday did ask that question on the episode.

        • Purplerockmatt

          because before that vote Sunday was Jessica’s ally, Chris and Bret weren’t

          • Hornacek

            It seems so long ago.

          • Kemper Boyd

            like 10-15 days or so.

        • Baulderstone

          My point was about why Sunday hates Jessica, not the other way around. Sunday stone cold stabbed Jessica in the back. Jessica is still walking around as a reminder of that. Sunday needs to bury her once and for all so she can have wipe her from her memory and have a clear conscience.

          • Hornacek

            Just like her millennial kids would do!

          • Baulderstone

            It’s only natural that Millennials would seek to be just like Gen X, the greatest and most clearly defined of all generational stereotypes.

          • DrVanNostrand

            It seemed to me like she just doesn’t trust Jessica any more since Jessica clearly hates her now. Makes sense to me.

          • Baulderstone

            Yeah, it is likely that simple. I just enjoy coming up with overly elaborate psychological explanations. Given that Sunday has been mostly invisible this season, I have a lot of blank paper to create on.

          • Hornacek

            It just seemed to come out of nowhere. Sunday told us that Jessica hates her but have we seen any evidence of this on the show? Maybe it’s true, but from what we’ve seen it feels more like a one-sided feud.

          • andythesaint

            P. shocking that a story involving Gen X women has been underdeveloped this season.

          • Figaro

            …and potentially also that Sunday’s worried that Jessica will want to ‘get revenge’ on her, so wants her out for that reason.

        • Alycia Swift

          Ken tried to save Jessica but she would not listen and blew up his spot, so he voted for her. David and CeCe did not vote for Jessica. Then Ken and Jessica reconciled.

          • Hornacek

            Ok, so Ken and Jessica are friends. But why is Jessica supposed to be mad at Sunday? Bret and Chris also voted for her, so she should be equally mad at them. Why are we being told that she is only mad at Sunday? Was their bond that strong before that vote? If she should be mad at anyone for that vote, she should be mad at Lucy, but I guess since she’s no longer in the game she has to be mad at Sunday by default?

      • DrVanNostrand

        Jessica was right there with all the rest until they randomly decided, for no real reason, that she alone was responsible for Paul’s blindside. (Was Paul his name? I’ve already forgotten). Anyway, Sunday explained in the episode that Jessica is more bitter towards her because they were really close before she got thrown under the bus.

        • I’m not sure if Jessica is ACTUALLY more bitter towards Sunday though…no evidence shown so far. It seemed more to me like Sunday is projecting. I mean, sure it’s awkward to have to keep playing the game with someone who you tried to vote out, but it seemed quite a one-sided issue.

          • Hornacek

            Exactly. We see Sunday talk about how Jessica hates her, but we haven’t seen anything from Jessica’s perspective saying that she does hate Sunday.

            I would love it if next week we get a confessional from Jessica where she says “Sunday is acting weird around me, I don’t know why. I thought we were friends.”

      • sharculese

        I’m more shocked because I didn’t realize she had so many tattoos.

        • Baulderstone

          That caught me off guard too. It was a pretty big reveal after nine episodes of watching her live on a beach.

        • DrVanNostrand

          I can’t believe you just noticed that. I was shocked the first time I saw her in her swimsuit, like 4 or 5 episodes ago. Isn’t she a lawyer or something?

          • sharculese

            Why can’t a lawyer have a bunch of tattoos?

          • DrVanNostrand

            Because lawyers are supposed to be boring, like doctors and engineers.

          • sharculese

            That’s prejudice bro. 99% of the people I went to law school with were boring, but there was Paul (no, I’m not talking about Paul Wachter, that’s a coincidence.) Paul was cool.

          • K.P. Watershed

            Forgot about Chaos Kass?

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Or dog food company owners.

          • sharculese

            In this scenario I’m not the owner, I’m the one designing the food blends. You… really don’t want to know the degree to which I’ve mapped this out,

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Part of me wants to see the madness, part of me is afraid.

          • sharculese

            You know those vacuum-sealed pouches tuna comes in now? We’ve partnered we a company that makes biodegradable versions that allow us to sell single servings in small, medium, and large dog sizes. You don’t even have to worry about throwing them in the trash, they’ll be mulch in six months.

            Unfortunately, there’s a division within the company about which way we should go. One side favors staying in Atlanta and focusing on expanding our range of products, like offering special blends for puppies and older dogs. As one of the food designers, obviously this is the side I favor. The other side wants to start setting up satellites in other cities with high populations of young rich people so that we can offer the same locally-sourced, high-quality food to them.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            I want to see the corkboard that has the string from puppy food packets to Andre Barksdale. That’s all I want to see.

          • sharculese

            I’m going to assume you mean Avon Barksdale, because all Google can tell me about any Andre Barksdale is a Detroit cop who died in 1987 answering a domestic disturbance call. But yes, our pet food company does deal in arcane magics and we do have a portal into the past. Specifically 1987. No, we can’t explain why that’s the only year we can connect to, but we don’t make the rules, we only make the dog food.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Well played, sir. Well played.

          • Lira2012

            *Avon* Barksdale? Still, nice use of Barksdale.

          • Something Quirky

            Um, so this is awesome.

          • sharculese

            In case you missed it, go back to the podcast comments from last week for part 1 of the great dog food lie.

          • Something Quirky

            I’m a bit behind on the podcast, so I did, but I kind of want to believe the lie =p I mean, dog food designer by day and tutor by night is kind of close to becoming some kind of superhero…

          • Hornacek

            Brad Culpepper would like to present his case before you.

          • DrVanNostrand

            He’s a lawyer?

          • sharculese

            He wen’t to law school after he left the NFL. Which basically tells you everything you need to know about law school.

          • Hornacek

            I remember making comments during his season about how he should present cases in court wearing no shirt so the jury could see his HONOR and JUDGE tattoos.

          • Streets_Ahead

            Yup check out his site: http://www.ckfirm.com/

            Not only that but he’s a personal injury lawyer which is fancy speak for ambulance chaser.

          • And accountants!

          • Hornacek

            Monty Python taught me years ago that chartered accountancy is a debilitating disease.

          • Guest rite

            Monty Python taught me years ago that chartered accountancy is a nautical adventure!*

            *They lied.

          • Alycia Swift

            We aren’t boring though. Mostly just annoyed. (Not annoying, annoyed).

        • Purple Rock Emma

          Dude, old news.

      • I think Sunday is secretly British. ‘I tried to vote Jessica out and now it is socially awkward, and the only way to rectify this is to fracture my entire alliance so I don’t have to interact with her any more.’

        • Baulderstone

          As someone with British family, I am officially retracting all my theories on her behavior and adopting this one.

    • the sky is falling

      To Probsts’ dismay the nerd wins this one, that’s why I want it

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      I hope the opening moments of next week’s episode are of Adam “talking to Taylor” on the beach at night.

      “I know I voted you out last week. I DID that. But we can still work together…”

      • the sky is falling

        Excellent

      • corndogshuffle

        I want this to be his response to Taylor’s question at FTC. That would make me way too happy.

    • DrVanNostrand

      What is it with desperately trying to smooth things over with people you just fucked in the game? It must be some weird Millennial thing.

      • Hornacek

        Hopefully Jeff will ask about it at next week’s tribal.

    • Something Quirky

      It also looks like either an elephant or a penis with really round blue balls.

  • the sky is falling

    Tony and Jeremy and Cochrane were the only winners who I was rooting for to win that won survivor. I need David to win this one so I can have 4 right out of 33 seasons, he is still lookin good

    • Max_Jets

      I can’t imagine what you were hoping for in San Juan Del Sur, let alone One World.

      • I was hoping for Keith TBH.

        • Max_Jets

          Bold admission.

        • the sky is falling

          Keith’s Tuk Tuk services warmed my black heart

          • Not in Cambodia….in SJDS. I was rooting for Wentworth in Cambodia with Keith and Jeremy as a tied second.

          • the sky is falling

            Ah, ok

          • I’m not THAT crazy.

          • Hornacek

            But Wentworth had seen every season! She had to go!

      • Kemper Boyd

        I don’t think I can build an online friendship with someone who wasn’t rooting for Kim, Denise, Sandra or Natalie.

        • Black Dynamite

          All of them are badass people

          • Kemper Boyd

            Like maybe I can accept that someone was rooting for Malcolm but if you got to the final 6 in One World and you weren’t aboard the Kim train then who are you? and what was your childhood trauma?

          • the sky is falling

            I saw One world as Rob 2.0 so obvio S she was winning

          • Kemper Boyd

            Yeah but better than Rob 4.0 because you know this was her first go not her 4th.

          • the sky is falling

            No I agree she was an impressive winner, but that season was so terrible, hard to get excited

          • Kemper Boyd

            Oh 100% but I was still actively rooting for her because her victory was the only silver lining in that season.

          • the sky is falling

            If Spradlin won on a better season it woulda been more impressive, unfortunately….

          • Kemper Boyd

            I don’t think a win like hers or Boston Rob’s can make a good season. it’s too impressive. The control is too complete. The only intrigue was whether she would go with her swap alliance of the women’s alliance and then she picked the obvious and better option. She neutralised the season completely and that is why she is the greatest.

          • the sky is falling

            Yes, superior to Sandra. I’m know mad bummed sandra is coming back to ruin her legacy. It’s like Michael,Jordan coming back to play for the follow cling Washington Wizards. oh wait, you are from the UK, no idea what I’m talking about…

          • Kemper Boyd

            NNNOOOOOOOOOOO. No. I did not say that. Her win was the greatest. She is the best winner of a season. But Sandra won twice and is a true goddess as a character too. Sorry to go all Eliza and measure whether something is good by if it succeeds but Changa won twice, ain’t nobody else won twice. Sandra is the best.

          • the sky is falling

            She is, but ruining legacy by playing a third time, impossible to go 3 for 3

          • Kemper Boyd

            SPOILER TAG THAT. SOme people don’t know nothing about nothing. Also I agree but also she don’t care about that, she’s just there to earn money for her family. One last also, you are going to be so embarrassed when she goes 3 for 3 because she got left alone because no one can go 3 for 3.

          • the sky is falling

            Ah shit, sry

          • Kemper Boyd

            s’ok, everyone makes oversights.

          • Something Quirky

            Who were the recruits? I never know that information.

          • Sylvisual

            Kim is a good winner, but not worthy of being great. I don’t get the hype.

          • It’s probably a good thing that you are not posting that under your other screen name. I still need to finish One World before I can accurately judge.

          • Kemper Boyd
          • Max_Jets

            What

          • Kemper Boyd

            I am as baffled as you.

          • corndogshuffle

            I’m still convinced Kim Spradlin is the best Survivor player ever.

          • K.P. Watershed

            Kim pitched a perfect game but I can’t rank her over players like Sandra, Parvati, Jeremy, B.Rob who dominated in multiple seasons against top-notch competition

          • Kemper Boyd

            She was the perfect player, playing at the exact right time in her life. I truly think one of the reasons that season was so so boring was that Kim had it on lock, there was no intrigue, no one else to root for and overall no story to tell that was meaningful beyond “Kim is a beast”. I think had there been no Kim that season would probably have been more of a Gabon than a SJDS (two bad casting seasons but one had a good post-merge) instead it was Redemption Island.

          • He said, “Kim is a good winner, but not worthy of being great. I don’t get the hype.”

          • the sky is falling

            I don’t see her as a great winner either, chumps on her season,

          • Alycia Swift

            There were chumps on BR’s 4th season as well.

          • Hornacek

            17 of them to be precise.

          • Alycia Swift

            Yep.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            You haven’t even seen all of One World, right? Why die on a hill you know nothing about?

          • andythesaint

            This is some grounds for dismissal shit right here.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Holy shit! They’re gonna fire Matt!

          • Alycia Swift

            Both seasons were terrible. Both seasons had bad casts. But I agree, it was Kim’s first time … and she did not get any help from production (do women ever?) and Boston Rob’s fourth time … and it seemed like he got help.

          • Kent McK

            Whoa, easy there. Kim is great, but come on, that’s Boston Rob you’re talking about.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Nope. Took him 4 goes and a cast of newbies vs a 4 time vet for him to win. It was a great win but Kim went out, figured it out immediately and locked it down.
            Marquesas Rob was too young and cocky.
            All Stars Rob made a fatal error in jury management.
            HvV Rob was outsmarted by Russell (although Tyson can take some of the blame).
            Redemption Idol Rob finally got it down with players like Nat Ten, Philip and Grant.

            Is he a better character? yes. Is he more important in the scheme of the whole show? yes. Was his win better than Kim’s? No.

          • Max_Jets

            On top of that, Kim would have won just about any final tribal council configuration while Rob likely had to be next to Phillip and Natalie AND she was in an alliance with everyone who made the merge except 2 people. Kim Kim Kim Kim Kim

          • Diego Armando

            I will admit to looking elsewhere because it was more fun to try and think up situations where someone else won. Also, that season sucked and I had no real investment in anyone.

        • the sky is falling

          If it’s Samoa, Natalie, you are out of luck, if it’s other Natalie, she was annoying as fuck on Amazing Race, couldn’t root for her

          • Kemper Boyd

            Yes, she was annoying as fuck but bitch that wasn’t the amazing race and she killed it! (apologies for the usof bitch, I’m rolling at the moment)

          • the sky is falling

            I dunno, their amazing race performance scarred me, and her season on survivor sucked

          • Kemper Boyd

            Maybe they are easier on their own? I really enjoy Natalie on RHAP but when I see stuff filmed with both of them I can’t deal with it. Twins are weird.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Really? I liked her far less when she was on RHAP and victim blaming Shirin and pulling a lot of “I’m not like other girls,” BS.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I like her gameplay stuff, you are right she is a bit of a “cool girl”.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Totally fair. I still would like to see her play again for sure.

          • Alycia Swift

            I never saw the amazing race but I thought she was hilarious on Survivor. Maybe getting away from her twin was the answer (and might have been vice versa for Nadiya as well if the shoe was reversed.

          • Something Quirky

            On TAR they were just horrible.

          • Hornacek

            As much as the pairs on BvW seasons talk about how much more power you have as a couple, it seems that the people that get their loved ones voted out do much better. I know it’s a very small sample size, but still.

        • Other Scott

          BUT JON MISCH THO

          • sharculese

            Stop trying to make Jon Misch happen

          • Kent McK

            Thankfully he didn’t answer his phone or check his voice mail when they called him about Second Chances. We dodged one there.

          • Other Scott

            If only downvoting were a thing here…

          • DrVanNostrand

            You can always just post “BOOOOOO!!!!!” People will get the message. Which reminds me, I have another post to make…

          • Alycia Swift

            Would he even have been voted in?

          • Hornacek

            I’ve heard that voter turnout for sommeliers is very high.

          • Other Scott

            You guys are about to make me cry okay.

          • Hornacek

            “But Millhouse is my name!”

          • Other Scott

            Hey my introduction to the AV club Survivor comments was me being obnoxious about Jon Misch, so I have to stick to my roots. I even made Matt yell at me once.

          • I don’t think Matt was the only one.

            But it’s your gimmick, and I admire your ability to stick to it.

          • sharculese

            It’s certainly better than sticking with the Obvious Winner Woo thing.

            But hey, at least Woo knows how phones work.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Or obvious winner Ken #CaucasianWoo

          • Hornacek

            One of my favorite RHAP Cagayan episodes was Cochran doing the recap for the episode before the finale, where he almost convinced Rob that Woo was going to win. “Get on board the Woo train!”

          • Other Scott

            Matt was the only one who yelled at me is what I meant. I imagine everyone was very annoyed.

            In my defense, everyone was convinced he was very dumb and I wanted to find out if it was anything that drove them to that other than his goofy demeanor.

          • HBO CEO of Tits

            My favorite thing on San Juan del Sur was when Jon and Jaclyn were having a lovers quarrel and it left the ENTIRE rest of the tribe in lurch of these two squabbling babies. For some reason that reality was just the funniest thing to me.

          • Hornacek

            “WHO’S BIG JON NOW???”

          • DrVanNostrand

            BOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

          • sharculese

            urns.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Scottyboy, this is a bad take.

          • Other Scott

            He’s so likable I don’t know why this site hates him so much. It’s sad for me.

          • Hornacek

            We just hate sommeliers.

          • Other Scott

            Apparently!

          • Kemper Boyd

            He’s a clueless puppy.

          • [secretly supports you]

          • Other Scott

            [secretly upvotes every post of yours I see from now on]

    • gouis

      FYI Cochran doesn’t have an ‘e’ at the end of his name.

    • K.P. Watershed

      Not enough love for Todd Herzog and Yul Kwon in the responses to this comment!

      • sharculese

        Oh hi, did you nee someone to show some love for Todd? On a scale of 1 to 10, how much do you need someone to talk about how great Todd was? Because I go up to 15.

      • Max_Jets

        Todd is great, but Peih Gee has my heart in China.

        • sharculese

          If you like players how over-strategize, get too much into their own heads, and have zero social game, there’s a ton to love about Peih-Gee.

          I prefer people who are good at Survivor.

          • Max_Jets

            Sure, but if she had been able to win we would consider her good at Survivor and that’s what I wanted to happen. I also think that while she definitely has her flaws, she likely sets up a good path to the end if her plan at the James vote works where Todd left himself unprotected. I think Todd is the better player, but Peih Gee is a great underdog and a bad ass bitch (as Michele would say).

          • sharculese

            Oh sure, Peih-Gee can plan with the best of them, she just can’t execute because she has no social game and can’t get anyone to go along with her plans. She’s a little bit too transparent about seeing everyone as gamepieces in a way that’s offputting.*

            I think Peih-Gee is incredibly charming in real life, but for some reason that doesn’t seem to translate to Survivor, and it impedes her ability to do anything at all in the game.

            *All of this is kind of ironic given my love of Penner, but I’m aware Penner isn’t good at Survivor. I just think he’s really funny.

          • Max_Jets

            Weirdly, I feel like she might have had better social game in Cambodia, but Abi Maria. I guess Peih Gee is my Penner. Her and Jaime throwing the challenge is China’s high point for me. (Yeah, yeah, she should have worked with James whatever)

          • sharculese

            I’ve made my feelings on the China challenge throw clear so I won’t relitigate that.

      • Streets_Ahead

        Yeah but did you see about Todd. 🙁 Not great. Hope he gets back on track and soon.

        https://www.facebook.com/rockthezog

      • Guest rite

        Yul was my immediate thought. Then I guess, Mike by default and maybe Tom. I was young and my memory might be trying to make me seem smarter than I was, but I don’t think so. He killed a shark so I can totally see younger me being into that. I also liked Earl. Oh, and Boston Rob.

        • Guest rite

          Oh, forgot about Aras. I love Aras. Now this is obviously incorrect, because Cirie, but what can I say, the heart wants what it wants.

        • Hornacek

          It’s crazy that in Survivor we have had 2 players that have killed a shark – one with a machete, one by biting it.

    • andythesaint

      The beauty of being a frontrunner is that your fav wins every season.

      Except Koah Rong.

  • Violina23

    Hey guys, Jay DOES have an idol

    • Kemper Boyd

      Cos I heard from Chris who heard from Jess who heard from David who was told by Hannah who was told by Zeke who heard from Will?

      • They know that we know that Jay has an idol.

        • Violina23

          But do they KNOW that we know that they know that Jay has an idol?

          • Not yet.

          • Side Character

            Do Jay know that we know that Jay know that we know that Jay know that we know that Jay has an idol?

          • Yes?

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        Didn’t Will see Ferris pass out at 31 flavors last night?

      • Streets_Ahead

        Did you hear this while you were at 31 flavors?

    • the sky is falling

      Not related, but your “throw it in the fire” tweet was on point

      • Violina23

        Since they didn’t have the volcano from Redemption Island, it was the closest thing!

        • the sky is falling

          Seriously tho, best move when called out was Jeff, I’m gonna destroy this, he never watched first Blood Water apparently

          • Violina23

            It would have been extra awesome just to see Taylor’s smug reaction

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        That would be the time to throw a fake idol in the fire.

  • Kingoftonga

    So I don’t think that Ken got a single confessional this episode, even though he won the reward. I don’t think this bodes well for his chances to win, although he’s probably my favorite player still in the game.

    Was the Sunday/Jessica conflict to set up the next episode, or did so little happen this week that they had to pad it with something?

    • gouis

      Yeah but he killed an octopus so he’s winning duh #edgic

      • Hornacek

        Didn’t Deb Eaton tell Varner not to kill any octopuses if he ever went back? (this was before Second Chances) She probably isn’t a fan of Ken’s.

        • gouis

          Well if Deb doesn’t like him I AM OUT!

    • Alycia Swift

      Maybe they are setting up the story of why Sunday gets voted out (or Jessica).

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        Hopefully they are setting up a story of Sunday doing something .

    • In regards to Ken, I don’t think he spoke this episode but he got a lot of positive discussion through David. However, I think Ken and David are on the backburner a bit because they are not the central figures in the drama right now. But, if Jessica goes home soon, we may know that Ken will pop back into prominence. (Please note: I do not buy into Obvious Winner Ken, although he is my winner pick. I still have no effing clue who is going to win).

      In regards to Sunday/Jessica, I have this weird feeling that we may lose both of them next week.

      • the sky is falling

        The obvious winner is David

        • Baulderstone

          I wouldn’t go as far as “obvious” but I would not be surprised.

          • the sky is falling

            I know, that’s just my underdog prejudice showing. I will be satisfied if he loses in final,tribal

        • I am getting an Aubry vibe from him. Also, I would assume this is how Tocantins Fishbach felt at times.

          • K.P. Watershed

            While David and Fishbach have some obvious similarities I don’t think this is a great comparison. Fishbach played a much stronger social game and it was such a different cast dynamic in Tocantins.

          • Since I haven’t watched Tocantins but have only heard about his terrible FTC, that is why I said assume.

          • Alycia Swift

            And also, J.T. played a much stronger game than Ken. Everyone loved J.T. While the nerds (like Hannah and David) seem to like him a lot and CC called him humble and not what you would expect, others have said he is weird.

        • DrVanNostrand

          I think a couple other people are also in the mix, but he has a good one.

        • Alkanarra

          Now that he was predicted as the winner in yesterday’s Purple Rock poll, I can safely say David doesn’t have a chance.

      • Mike Hirsch

        Am I misremembering, or did David get a confessional that was him saying, “Ken won immunity” and then the confessional was over? I just found that oddly brief and not important.

        • It was one that was broken up because he was talking about how good it was that Taylor lost.

      • Diego Armando

        At this point, I think the winner options are

        Frontrunners: David, Ken, Zeke

        Dark Horses: Chris, Jay, Jessica

        If the stars align: Adam, Hannah

        • K.P. Watershed

          Ken and Jay are the ones getting winners’ edits for my money. They seem like the 2 heavy favorites.

          David, Zeke, maybe Jess/Chris have an outside shot if they can drag Hannah/Adam/Sunday to the end with them.

          Adam has zero chance of winning. Think about who is going to be on the jury – even already.

          • andythesaint

            Agreed on Adam. Of the remaining 11 players, I rank him as the 12th most likely winner.

            Just imagine that poor fucker answering somebody’s jury question about why he voted them out.

          • Hornacek

            And the juror would say “Stop yelling at me!”

      • andythesaint

        “In regards to Sunday/Jessica, I have this weird feeling that we may lose both of them next week.”

        Oh snap. I can totally see that happening in 2016.

    • Baulderstone

      You may be right. I also believe it is entirely possible that Ken simply said nothing they could find a use for. He isn’t exactly a narrator.

      Also, this was really boiled down to an episode where the vote went exactly as expected, so they needed to concentrate on making it feel twisty. There was no way to use Ken in that.

      • andythesaint

        I really like Ken. But let’s just say that his talents don’t exactly lie in his talking abilities.

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          “We vote out Taylor.”

          *dives off waterfall, passes through rainbow, lands on Pegasus*

          “Taylor.”

        • Guest rite

          Super serious, moralistic, boring Ken is the best Ken. I find him absolutely hilarious. The only thing funnier than Boring Ken is how much David likes Boring Ken.

        • Baulderstone

          Ken can be a bit of a mope, but on the whole, I like him too. He reminds me of a late friend of mine who was just the most reliable person I knew.

    • DrVanNostrand

      My guess would probably be both. There’s not much drama when 3 people are on the bottom and all that’s going on is figuring out the split, so they spiced it up by showing some cracks in the Gen X alliance. And that could easily pay off in episodes to come. Sunday probably isn’t giving up on this, she just couldn’t get the numbers to pull it off this week.

    • Kent McK

      I think Ken is just kind of weird guy and the editors are basically giving him everything that they can. We’re just not going to get a Ken rant of the week every episode. I still think he has a great chance to win.

      • Maybe they just don’t want to sully Ken by allowing him to be drawn into the Jay-Taylor-Adam vortex of suck.

      • Alycia Swift

        He does have one of the higher amounts of secret scenes. There are people who get only a few or none.

    • Diego Armando

      Yeah, I think so. The previews show the GenX team imploding.

      if the previews mention the Legacy Advantage, Jessica is gone.

    • Streets_Ahead

      Ken hasn’t had a confessional in the past 3 episodes. I find it alarming.

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        Woo was also a surprisingly quiet player. #CaucasianWoo

  • sharculese

    OUR SHORT NATIONAL NIGHTMARE IS OVER!

    • DrVanNostrand

      One of them anyway…

      • sharculese

        OUR LONG NATIONAL NIGHTMARE IS JUST BEGINNING! I WAS TRYING NOT TO TALK ABOUT THAT ONE!

        • the sky is falling

          What’s the worst that can happen? nuclear war? Fuck all y’all, I live in DC I will be instantly vaporized. THIS IS FINE!

          • sharculese

            I live in Atlanta. They’ll smash open CDC headquarters and we’ll all die of plague.

          • the sky is falling

            Sweet, instant death is better than having to deal with fucking Rick and Korl in an apocalypse

          • Sylvisual

            I know some people over there. They can give us the heads up to run for the hills. (Where we die of smoke inhalation.)

          • sharculese

            But I already live in the hills!

          • I live in FL. Nuclear winter will probably just be like every other FL winter.

          • Ike1

            I’m actually really worried about this. I think about it every second. SOMEBODY HOLD ME.

          • corndogshuffle

            Hey, if there’s any hint of incoming nukes we should meet up at Bourbon Steak Lounge and celebrate our impending doom.

  • Quick fantasy league question: In regards of tribal council voting, does everybody get a point besides Taylor?

    • Purplerockmatt

      Will voted for Jay too I think

      • So, because he wasn’t in on the split vote, he doesn’t get a point?

        • Purplerockmatt

          correct

          • Cool. I just trying to see how I did tonight.

          • Good to know.

          • Purplerockmatt

            actually he may, i have been mis-reading that he voted for Jay. We’ll discuss in staff chat

          • No, he did vote for Jay.

          • Purplerockmatt

            Yeah i was reading that wrong. My fault

          • No worries. It is just confusing that Jay’s pocket vote voted against Jay.

          • DrVanNostrand

            I just assumed he voted with Jay when I was counting up votes in my head during tribal. I wasn’t even paying attention during Taylor’s final words.

          • Purplerockmatt

            no i assumed the same at first

        • Other Scott

          How do we know he wasn’t in on the split vote?

          This is why we need our tribunal.

          • Purplerockmatt

            we have a tribunal, it’s the staff chat, we’ll discuss it there once everyone has seen the episode

          • sharculese

            *sigh*

            Tribunal means three, Matt. I know you know this.

          • Purplerockmatt

            what makes you think emma and mark are included in this discussion?

          • Purple Rock Emma

            okay, words hurt.

          • We start with the tribunal. If there’s any dissent, we go to an en banc review.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            Related questions: On the beach the non-DoucheForce agreed to split the vote between Jay and Taylor. Presumably 5 on Jay and 4 on Taylor. But they actually voted 6 Taylor (Adam, Chris, David, Ken, Sunday, Zeke) and 3 Jay (Bret, Hannah, Jessica). What happened? Who switched and why? And how did the strong twos of Bret/Chris, Hannah/Zeke, and Jessica/Ken get split up?

          • andythesaint

            I wouldn’t be surprised if some of the Jay voters flipped to Taylor out of disgust at TC.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            Yeah, I thought about it more and my theory now is that Will flipped on DoucheForce during the pre-TC scramble (which the show would have hidden from the audience). With an extra vote in Will and only two votes coming back in the event of a idol play, the Jay voters may have felt they had the luxury of switching to Taylor on the fly. This would also explain why Will blabs about Jay’s idol.

          • Hornacek

            But Taylor says in his exit interview that the GenXers thought him stealing the food was hilarious!

          • Purplerockmatt

            I think what happened was that Sunday was originally on Jay and flipped to Taylor to protect Jay who she thought she could work with, and maybe Adam did too because Taylor was crushing him so bad at tribal?

          • I would say that since we did not see him in their big huddle on the beach, he was not in on it.

          • Other Scott

            That doesn’t mean that Sunday and Bret just didn’t tell him what the plan was, I really can’t fathom a reason for him voting for Jay except knowing what was going on.

          • But, here’s the thing about that: His pre-merge tribal councils were reliant on people (Jay/Michelle) to tell him what to do. Why flip on Jay?

          • andythesaint

            To show he’s a potential team player.

          • I guess…I just like the idea of Will the Tagalong Kid and Casual Survivor Historian so much though.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            My hypothesis is that Will saw the writing on the wall in the pre-TC and flipped of his own accord. There’s no evidence to support that (although of course if true the show would conceal it), but it would explain a) Will’s vote, b) why people seemed to feel free to switch their votes from Jay to Taylor, and c) why blabbing about Jay’s idol isn’t a suicidal move.

            ETA: D’oh! I said this to you yesterday.

      • I’m really curious about that. I’d think that, given Jay’s apparent ability to completely control Will, he’d be able to get him to vote for Taylor. Then again, I guess Taylor’s inability to realize that he needed to vote for Jay to have any chance of saving himself would be enough for Jay.

  • Mike Hirsch

    This episode went a long way toward alleviating my fears that Taylor was winning this season.
    Adam can be mad at Taylor for blowing up his game all he wants, but this is absolutely all down to Adam and his complete misread of Taylor as someone to work with.
    And his people skills, in general, are lacking.
    I like how David is actually fairly decent at the individual immunity challenges thus far. Granted, they’ve mostly involved standing still, but you know, it’s David, so…way to plant, Ann!

    • Kemper Boyd

      who?

      • Mike Hirsch

        Ann. My girlfriend. You’ve met her several times.

        • Purplerockmatt

          Oh Egg!

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            This place is going to melt down if and when they actually cast an Ann. Especially if, unlike Anna Khait, she’s as egg as the nose on Plain’s face.

        • Side Character

          Her?

          • She’s really funny.

    • I started getting scared, as you may have seen in last week’s liveblog, that we were getting a hint of Taylor winning. But we are all good now.

      • Kent McK

        I really thought Adam was going home for pretty much the entire episode. Definitely a pleasant surprise to see Taylor voted out.

      • Diego Armando

        The second he dig up his food during the opening, I knew he was done.

      • Kemper Boyd

        I think we had a collective post-election fear of more bad things. That was the worst possible outcome for the season and now it can’t happen I feel a bit better.

      • Mike Hirsch

        One potential added bonus to Taylor going home is that it should also be the end of all Jeff’s “Millennials vs GenX” malarkey, since Taylor seemed to literally be Jeff’s only reference point for how a Millennial should behave.

        • Hornacek

          Jeff will find a way.

          • Mike Hirsch

            I suppose we can have a little bit of faith in that. At least the players, outside of tribal, have shut up about it.

        • Unless he switches to Will, who is barely a millennial at best.

          • Hornacek

            I would love Jeff to ask Will one of his millennial question and Will respond with “Jeff, I don’t know what a millennial is.”, and when Jeff explains it, Will says “Well that’s not me.”

      • hardcöre umlaut

        I did as well. Until the final Taylor vote was read and his torch was snuffed, I was CONVINCED that this season was a complete metaphor for USA, 2016. A season won by a woman, full of interesting female characters, featuring an LGBTQ POC in the final tribal, with a black woman nearly missing out on final tribal is followed by a season where white men vote out all the WOC and a white man can break all of the social norms- not only break social norms but BRAG ABOUT IT and get away with it- and succeed. Thank GOD they had the good mind to send him packing.

    • DrVanNostrand

      Outcast twist? Taylor comes back like Burton 2.0!

      • Mike Hirsch

        Ack! I’m worried if you say that too often, it will happen, like saying Beetlejuice or Candyman or Bloody Mary.

        • Streets_Ahead

          Outcast Twist

      • Hornacek

        Rock on!

    • Sadie

      David is skilled at standing still and being about the weight of a piñata

    • andythesaint

      You know what Mike? I think you make me laugh pretty much every week.

      If you knew me and how much it kills me to admit someone other than myself can be funny, you’d understand what high praise this is.

      • Mike Hirsch

        I’ve listened to enough podcasts to get a feel for that, and definitely consider it high praise. Also now I feel intense pressure to keep it up. So, thank you and/or dammit.

  • Scarlett3639
    • That looks cool.

      • Scarlett3639

        I haven’t read it yet but it is on my reading list. It’s about two sisters with a large age gap so one is Gen X and one Gen Y. That would have been great casting for this season.

        • Baulderstone

          Shhh. I don’t want Blood vs. Water 3: Gen X vs. Millennial Edition

          The Probsting would be unbearable. .

          • Here’s the thing: It’s already happened at least once. Laura Morett was a Gen Xer while Baylor was a millennial.

    • jersey_luck

      You know as Millennial it annoys me that Back to The Future isn’t in the middle. It is an amazing classic that belongs to everyone.

      • Kemper Boyd

        THIS

      • Scarlett3639

        Marty and Jennifer’s kids would be Millenials, so it really should.

      • Diego Armando

        I watched that movie so many times as a kid.

      • HBO CEO of Tits

        It’s weird that Bjork and Hard Candy are on the cover at all.

      • Streets_Ahead

        I know! I grew up with it. It’s probably my all time second most watched movie. I’ve probably seen it close to 100 times no joke.

    • Other Scott

      I thought this was about men vs women for a second and was like “low blow, it was Sunday who targeted Jessica today!”

    • Streets_Ahead

      But I love an know things on both sides of this, and dislike some things in the middle. Am I Generational fluid or something?

    • Purple Rock Emma

      Pretty sure there are more millennials who listen to Nirvana than Bjork, but okay.

      Also that’s the best they could do for millennial movies? No one cares about Romeo + Juliet, should have been 10 Things I Hate About You or Bring It On or something.

      • Scarlett3639

        Bring It On is everything! I would love Kirsten Dunst for that & Drop Dead Gorgeous alone.

    • andythesaint

      We thought this season’s battle between X and Y was generational. It turns out, it was chromosomes.

    • Hornacek

      Dorkograms!

  • Kent McK

    That tribal was the funniest thing on Survivor in a long time. As painful as it was watching Taylor at points this season, it was all worth it for that. Also, Jay is awesome. Calling Taylor a dumb surfer bro and then voting him out. Amazing.

    • jersey_luck

      The only thing that held the tribal council back for me was that Probst just had to bring the dumb Millennials stereotypes into it

      • Kemper Boyd

        I wish Jess would have added Zeke, Hannah and even Will into the “wasn’t raised to be like that” side because I’m a millennial and I was raised to behave better than that douche.

        • Baulderstone

          Take it from a Gen Xer, you’re one of the good ones, Kempy!

          Yeah, that bugged me too. Jessica got handed a great moment to bring her Millennial allies just a little closer, and she pushed them away.

          Or viewed from another angle, she got handed a great moment to shut down Probst’s Millennial BS, and she didn’t take it.

          Either way, it annoyed me.

          • Diego Armando

            Jessica seems to believe whatever the last person to speak to her said.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Or as others have pointed out maybe she’s smart enough to know what Probst wants with the stupid theme shit.

          • Baulderstone

            Deliberately playing along with his theme crap would only make it worse, in my opinion. That would mean she saw the in-game advantage of saying something less stupid, but decided to say something stupid and potentially game-wounding to get one more soundbite in the final aired edit of the TC.

        • DrVanNostrand

          I’ve heard Probst berates players during TC if they don’t give him good TV. Maybe he just shuts down and edits out any talk about the fact that the season’s theme is nonsense.

      • andythesaint

        Never let the participation trophy meme die.

        Never.

    • That was a really enjoyable tribal. Between that and Hannah being Hannah, this was a fairly decent episode for what was ultimately a really predictable boot.

    • gouis

      Man I just did not find it funny or entertaining. I hate arguments that are just squabbles about he said/she said. And it really affected nothing so what was the point? Just so Taylor and Adam can annoyingly bitch at each other?

  • sharculese

    My DVR cut off. How dumb were Taylor’s final “thoughts?”

    • Kemper Boyd

      OMG SO DUMB.
      He’s leaving with a new best friend in Jay and a girlfriend, maybe they can get a sailboat and sail around the world.

      • sharculese

        AAAAAAHHHHHHHH

      • Other Scott

        Did he actually say he was getting a girlfriend out of this?

        I’m cringing so very hard

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          Man the editors clowned him so hard. Just as Taylor said something like “I made an epic friend in Jay” they showed Jay holding up his vote for Tails.

        • Kemper Boyd

          Yes, it was amazing. I loved it a lot.

      • DrVanNostrand

        That better be a big sailboat! The tri-force, plus baby mama and toddler is a lot of people.

  • sharculese

    O/T: My friend who got me into Survivor just bought his first buff. It’s Casaya purple, because he has taste.

    • Last week, I saw my first Survivor buff “in the wild”. It was an Angkor, which got me really confused because why go Angkor when you can go Bayon?

      • Kemper Boyd

        a 3 pack and yellow just went better?

        • But she was wearing a gray and PURPLE jacket.

          • Kemper Boyd

            oh, then, ignore me.

          • I mean the Angkor buff is pretty but it is my fourth favorite of that season…I am also happy that I have not gotten to the buff buying phase of my fandom, but I fear that it is coming soon.

          • Kemper Boyd

            postage is way too expensive for me.

          • That sucks. Maybe one day, when we meet, I will buy you one and you can sneak it back home with you.

          • sharculese

            STOP TRYING TO CIRCUMVENT OUR TARIFF LAWS!

          • I’m sorry…

          • sharculese

            IT’S OKAY. TARIFFS PROBABLY AREN’T EVEN AN ISSUE. I DON’T KNOW WHY WE WOULD HAVE A TARIFF ON THAT. IT’S PROBABLY JUST A SHIPPING THING.

            I DON’T KNOW WHY I’M TALKING LIKE ADAM.

          • I was starting to get concerned. Do I have to Hannah you?

          • sharculese

            I don’t know how covering your mouth with your hands until the situation changes will make this better, but you can try.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I doubt I’d have to sneak it. It’s probably under the VAT limit.

      • Other Scott

        Why go Bayon when you can go Ta Keo?

      • Streets_Ahead

        I’ve never seen a Buff in the wild. A few weeks ago I saw a hat produced by the company Buff. It was weird. I felt disappointed that it wasn’t a Buff Buff even though I had no expectations going in.

        • Purple Rock Emma

          I’ve seen buffs at Survivor events, but never in the true wild.

          • andythesaint

            Yeah, at Survivor events it’s basically cosplay.

    • Sylvisual

      Not ashamed to say I bought the 30th anniversary buff.

    • the sky is falling

      Was “buff” a thing before survivor? Isn’t that just a handkerchief?

      • DrVanNostrand

        It’s not just a handkerchief, because those are usually square or rectangular. A buff is like a stretchy tube. I don’t know if they existed before Survivor, but I think Buff is a brand name.

      • sharculese

        It wasn’t a ‘thing.’ It’s a breathable stretchy fabric that was designed to give motorcycle riders something to cover their mouths with. They gave them to the first set of players as an extra set of covering and then realized they were a good branding opportunity.

        Buff still makes non-Survivor prints. The people I know who go to Burning Man use them.

        • Other Scott

          I saw someone wearing a non-Survivor buff last month and was like “Those are a thing??”

          • sharculese

            There was a non-Survivor buff sitting in my living room for like a month after this year’s Burning Man. If you’re gonna live in a tent in the desert for a week it’s a smart thing to have.

          • I think they are a thing people who do sports things use. Climbers, sailors etc. (I climb, and I do own a buff that I have worn while climbing, though I don’t actually count myself in the ‘people who do sports things’ category).

          • the sky is falling

            I always just assumed the term buff was just something survivor made up
            and never cared enough to look it up.
            I try to avoid doing things outside, so
            have no clue about outdoorsy accessories.

  • Kemper Boyd

    ok, it’s 3am. I’ll be back in 7 hours at work to tell you all (or one person) how wrong you are when you say Kim isn’t an amazing winner.

    • Black Dynamite

      Who said that? Kim is the fucking queen

      • DrVanNostrand

        Sylvisual. It’s going to descend into a bloodbath!

        • Sylvisual

          Yeah? Well, you were hoarding food!

        • Purplerockmatt

          also known as Mark, all pile on Mark

          • sharculese

            MARKPILE

          • DrVanNostrand

            I can never remember if he’s you or Mark.

          • sharculese

            The trick is that Mark knows about capital letters.

          • Purplerockmatt

            DUDE

          • andythesaint

            You’ll never know how much this comment bothers him.

            Or pleases us.

    • the sky is falling

      My only debate is that it was a boring season

      • Trust me, that’s not a debate. I love Kim, and that season was still not good. Games that dominant don’t make for great TV.

        • Prom King

          Except Palau!

          • Tom at least had Ian pushing him, though.

          • Prom King

            Agree. And as Hornacek mentioned, he did actually have to deal with a couple strong challenges to his game.

          • Hornacek

            It wasn’t all smooth sailing for Tom. He was close to getting voted out at final 6 (or a member of his alliance, can’t remember if he had immunity or not). He had to convince Ian and Caryn to force a tie and then count on Ian to convince Katie 5 minutes before tribal that joining them would be better than forcing a tie.

          • Prom King

            Great point.

        • Something Quirky

          Plus it had genuinely shitty people, which other boring seasons don’t necessarily have.

      • Kemper Boyd

        Oh yeah, this wasn’t aimed at you. It’s a really boring season. But as I say I believe a truly dominant player can shut down any chance of their season being interesting. It also has some dumpster fires of human beings on it too.

  • These Words

    Just like a damn millenial to steal food and then want a pat on the back for admitting it. Just like gen x people to…I don’t know, I guess I’m not as good at this as Probst.

    • Kingoftonga

      He makes generational stereotyping look so easy!

      • sharculese

        Gen-Xers stereotype generations like this, but baby boomers stereotype generations like THIS.

        • Hornacek

          You’re right! You’re right! We are SO lame!

    • DrVanNostrand

      My personal favorite part of this theme is the revisionist history of the Gen Xers, turning themselves into the greatest, hardest working generation ever. No one ever called them a bunch of shiftless slackers. Nope. Never happened. They’ve always been about pulling themselves up by their bootstraps and working hard!

      • andythesaint

        We never looked for a handout.

        It was a different generation that racked up the most consumer debt in history.

      • Prom King

        Probst clearly never saw the Gen X classic that is literally called Slacker.

        His banal and incorrect stereotyping of Millennials and Gen X gives me hives. I can understand being all in when it comes to selling the theme, but his revisionism is way over the top. Probst: OTTN5

        • Streets_Ahead

          To be fair the movie Slacker came out in ’91. I would say 25 year is a lot of time to grow though I see how a strong stereo type such as the one in Slacker would stick.

          • Prom King

            I guess my point is more that Probst is confusing “younger vs. older” with “Millennials vs. Gen X”, as far as stereotypes go. Many Gen Xers were slackers when they were the age of the Millennials; many Millennials will be more responsible when they get older.

            He needs to work harder when coming up with Millennial & Gen X stereotypes.

      • Kemper Boyd

        The Greatest Generation called Boomers a bunch of lazy bums. It’s the circle of life. Or downward Chain of Life or something.

      • Hornacek

        Has Jeff never seen Reality Bites?

    • It was a valiant attempt. Just like a Gen Xer, willing to put forth the work and give it a go even if you aren’t quite sure if you’ll succeed.

  • the sky is falling

    Wrong place to post maybe, but after yor purple rock post on best tribal council reactions, we could use a post about top 10 jury reactions. black Dynamite? List time

    • Purple Rock Emma

      I’ve done a “best jury members” before, you can find in in the Survivor history archives.

  • the sky is falling

    Survivor 40: All WOC
    that’s the only way to stop ridiculous narrative on AV club that women are being “targeted”

    • the sky is falling

      Less than half of winners are heterosexual white men, this season is an anomaly

      • Other Scott

        This season might not have a heterosexual white male winner either!

        • 6/11 chances right now, right?

          • Kemper Boyd

            Do we know anything about Adam? He gives me vibes.

          • You are not alone. However, he apparently has a girlfriend on Instagram, but that doesn’t mean anything.

          • Kemper Boyd

            We’ll go straight then. He’s not on the wikia.

          • Trust me, there has been many conversations on the website that I cannot name, yet no one there has outed him. So, that’s a good thing.

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            If we’re talking about the same website, there have been outings (who cares wtf they signed in their middle school yearbook, just let them control their own life narrative goddammit). But maybe there’s nothing to out about Adam. Doesn’t mean that site wouldn’t do it if there was.

          • It probably is the same website and if they would have found something, they would share it immediately. They did a similar thing to Neal last season.

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            I wasn’t around on that site last season. I don’t care to find out what they said about Neal, and I’m kinda reconsidering my continued viewing of the site.

          • I go there primarily to see if there was anything major I missed in the Survivor news world, since I don’t primarily use Twitter that often. However, last season was not fun because of OWM

          • Other Scott

            I wouldn’t say it doesn’t mean anything. It’s just not 100% conclusive.

          • Once again, sir, you said what I really meant to say. Thank you for that!

      • Roswulf

        I can’t even tell if this ridiculous statement is sincere or not. I’m totally broken.

      • Kemper Boyd

        But heterosexual white men aren’t 50% of the US population. Ok here we go:
        63.7% of the population is non-hispanic white. Let’s contend that 49% of that 63.7% is male. That leaves 31.2% of the US population being white male.
        If we take the the CNN survey and Pew Research studies that between 4-5% of people are LGBT. That leaves 29.7% of the US population as straight white male.
        39% of Survivor winners are straight white men though.

        We should add that in casting the most under represented group on Survivor is LGBTQ women. There have been 7 out of 498.

        • gouis

          Yeah but white men are under attack didn’t you know

          • Kemper Boyd

            I do. If you add the gay white men into the total 48% of Survivor winners have been white guys.
            (I weirdly thought there were 33 winners not 31 for some reason so my stats were a little under on that last post).

            Survivor winners:
            Men: 54.8%
            Women: 45.2%

            White Men: 45%
            White Women: 32.3%

            Men of Colour: 9.7%
            Women of Colour: 13%

            Straight Men: 48.4%
            Straight Women: 45.2%
            Gay Men: 6.5%
            Gay Women: 0%

          • Hornacek

            Just like Christmas!

      • Guest rite

        I don’t think woman are being targeted, but I do think that the early game is more difficult for woman and more difficult for people of colour for a number of reasons.

        Strength is valued more at the start and men are perceived to be (and most likely are) stronger in challenges. I wonder if the switch to three tribes exacerbated this problem.

        Initial bonds are built on commonalities between individuals. Zeke and Chris are an example of this. In survivor people of colour will often be in the minority and will often struggle to make those early connections. This can often mean that when a decision is finely balanced the choice may be influenced by a subconscious degree of unfamiliarity. No targeting, but something which impacts people’s game.

        Survivor casting seems to love the Archetype of Straightshooting women of colour, which isn’t the best strategy in survivor.

        Now, once you get to the merge, the incentives to keep “strong” men over “women” is split and people will probably have formed social bounds due to being forced to rely on one another, so I don’t think looking at the make-up of winners really addresses the difficulties of the initial game. Its really a great example of privilege*. No one (or at least very few people) is targeting any particular group, but it just ends up this way if everyone makes logical self-serving decisions.

        I don’t know if there is an answer to how to “fix” this, when it is kind of inherent in the game, but I think it would be good to see another season with a more varied demographic, like Fiji and Cook Islands.

        tl;dr It’s like, all about privilege, man.

        *If you’re playing the sjw drinking game, take a shot now**
        ** Not you, Will.

    • Kemper Boyd

      I wouldn’t call it ridiculous as we are still at 7/9 boots being women.

      • the sky is falling

        Ok, maybe not ridiculous, but there were valid strategy reasons for voting out the women who have gone so far. Have there been racist and sexist dudes on the show before, sure. I don’t see evidence this particular season that thats the case.

        No Dan Foleys on this year. Meh, never should have brought it up. Volunteering myself for Exile Island.

    • gouis

      You’re at the wrong survivor site if you want to gain any traction on this point buddy.

  • gouis

    Weirdly got a lot of Hannah and Sunday this episode, especially given that they weren’t really at the center of anything. Hannah taking all the credit for Michelle’s ousting was strange.

    • I wonder if they gave Hannah credit because A) Jay is going to come after her next(even though he seemed to be completely chill with her decision) B) Hannah did have some control because of the fact that she told the mega alliance that they were going after Adam, so they could pick who they were going after C) It gives them a conclusion to the mini storyarc between Hannah and Michelle

  • Diego Armando

    ADAM JUST GOING TO HIDE FOR A WHILE AND HOPE EVERYTHING BLOWS OVER.

    • Cool, that’s my plan for the next 4 years.

    • DrVanNostrand

      His first confessional today may have been his shoutiest yet.

    • BUT BEFORE ADAM GO, ADAM JUST HAVE TO APOLOGIZE TO TAYLOR ONE MORE TIME. JUST TO SMOOTH THINGS OVER BY TELLING HIM HOW BADLY I SCREWED HIS GAME.

      • Diego Armando

        ADAM STILL HAS YOUR VOTE RIGHT?

      • I love how Adam has clearly been raised to believe that if you just own up to what you did and say sorry, people will forgive you. And every week all the evidence says that that is NOT THE CASE, and Adam is just still here, like, MAYBE THIS TIME…

  • Other Scott

    It’s weird when the main comment you come away with out of the episode is this, but:

    Of course Hannah had a worse reward team! The Captains were her and Chris, so basically the teams were equal except that one team had Chris and one had Hannah on a reward challenge that mostly required brute strength. Stealing a joke from above, not even Captain of sports Danielle could pick her way out of that deficit.

    Why is the episode harping on Hannah’s team picking abilities?

    • sharculese

      Because being self-deprecating during the challenge is both the most human we’ve seen Hannah and also a distraction from a boring blowout.

      • Other Scott

        I’m not sure what you mean by that. Hannah is constantly self-depreciating, so this would be far from the only example of her being human if that was the qualifier

        • sharculese

          Hannah is constantly self-critical. Humorously self-deprecating is a setting we haven’t seen before.

    • Alycia Swift

      But she could have at least grabbed either Bret, or Ken, or Taylor. All three have brute strength even though Chris is likely the strongest.

      Except Jay (who is not a big guy), she had all of the less athletic, less strong guys on her team.

    • DrVanNostrand

      While you are obviously correct, I still think the brawn was way more unevenly distributed than it should’ve been. Hannah obviously did a bad job, even considering her disadvantage.

    • Kent McK

      Yeah, are her drafting failures supposed to be endearing? Are we supposed to be viewing Hannah as the dork that can’t do anything right or the scrappy underdog that overcomes her anxiety? I’m not sure. I think she is going far though.

    • Hey, do you know who was the last one who got harped on for picking a shitty reward challenge team? Aubry. The comparisons continue.

      • The comparisons continuestart.

        • Because I have not heard them compared at all.

          • I just enjoy mocking the Hannah fans. It’s fun. Now I understand why Andy did it to me with my Shirin and Max fandom.

          • I thought you liked Hannah.

          • She’s fine. She’s not great at Survivor, though.

          • She’s better than some people on this season.

          • Streets_Ahead

            low bar

          • Kemper Boyd

            neither is Shirin…

          • I guess he might be jealous that the student has outlasted the master.

          • Get. Out.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Thought you’d like that one.

      • I’m definitely looking for Hannah/Aubry comparisons, but I do think the show is building up to Hannah doing something decently big. We don’t get confessionals about Hannah starting to play, only for to wind up as a goat/boring late boot.

        • I could see her getting sixth place or so. Not endgame, but not terrible.

          • I don’t think she’ll win either. I just really hope she does something big.

          • I am not an edgic believer, but why else include that confessional and half of the screentime that Hannah had tonight when one of your secondary targets (Jessica) got NOTHING?

      • Other Scott

        I know Aubry. I love Aubry.

        This, sir, is no Aubry.

        • I’m not saying that she is a perfect comparison to Aubry, but the resemblance is there.

    • andythesaint

      I think because Chris was a captain, that gave his team two first round choices. But Hannah still fucked up the rest of her draft. Chris’ team didn’t even need to use Taylor in the strength portion.

      There’s no way Taylor or Bret should’ve made it past the second round.

      • Saturday Night Palsy

        Is there a place where one can see how the picks played out? Top three worst schoolyard picks?

        • andythesaint

          I doubt it.

          But two of those top three were in Gabon. And they were picking tribes.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Palau is 3rd right?

          • andythesaint

            Last night might have been third.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Really worse than the pick em that got the worst tribe of all time?

          • andythesaint

            The issue is that Koror wasn’t that bad on paper. They had young, seemingly strong (or athletic) guys like Jeff, Ibrahem, and Bobby Jon. They had the MOST fit woman on the island in Stephenie.

            But, they lacked brain power. And they lacked Tom and Ian. Mostly Tom.

          • Kemper Boyd

            True, very true.

          • Roswulf

            The first couple of episodes of Palau lean really hard on the idea that Koror is doomed, DOOMED!

            And then…Tom and Ian. Mostly Tom.

          • andythesaint

            Seriously, Koror had Willard and Katie and Caryn and Janu. It shouldn’t have been the blowout it was.

          • Alycia Swift

            Ian was a fantastic athlete – especially in the water. Remember at the time he was a dolphin trainer. And he beat everyone to the shore to get the immunity necklace by a mile. Greg and Coby were actually good athletes too. Jenn too.

            Ulong had the better women but then also got rid of the second most fit woman – the person who got the necklace (I honestly don’t remember her name but she was a WOC.) Also Angie was pretty good at challenges and no one expected it as she was a little heaver (when the still actually cast young women who were a little heavy – now its mostly moms) and totally tattooed. But as you said, they did not have the brains on Ulong.

      • Kemper Boyd

        Should go:
        Hannah: Jay, Taylor, Zeke, Jessica, Adam
        Chris: Ken, Bret, David, Will, Sunday

        You can argue swapping Zeke and Bret but that’s about it. I strongly contend that Jessica is a better challenge competitor than Will and Adam in team challenges.

        • Roswulf

          I don’t quite agree for social reasons- I think as Hannah you don’t want to have this turn into that much of a Millenial v. Gen X matchup, and you don’t want to have your first two picks be someone on the outside of the main alliance.

          But ultimately, there’s no excuse for Chris getting three out of Jay, Taylor, Ken and Bret.

          • Kemper Boyd

            This was a pure strength go, perhaps you should swap Ken and Jay.

          • Purplerockmatt

            i think jay may be more athletic than Ken, but Ken is bigger/stronger than Jay

          • Kemper Boyd

            Yes, which is why I had Jay as Pick 1 and Ken 2. The rest fell into place after that based solely on my view of them in challenges.

      • Other Scott

        Yeah, she must have selected Will over Taylor at the very least which is probably a questionable choice, though a defensible one.

        Maybe it was a snake draft that went:
        H: Jay
        C: Bret
        C: Ken
        H: Will
        H: Zeke
        C: Taylor
        C: David
        H: Adam
        H: Jessica
        C: Sunday

        • Alycia Swift

          That sounds about right.

    • Streets_Ahead

      Ken agrees it was a disadvantage the captains were Chris v Hannah but it was good for him so he doesn’t mind to much. Since Ken said it I agree.

    • Kemper Boyd

      The Captain of Sports wouldn’t have been at a deficit as she is a captain of sports.

    • Hornacek

      What I learned about Hannah this weekend at the movie is that her name is a palindrome.

      • Other Scott

        First…great movie.

        Second…you only learned that this weekend?

        • Hornacek

          I knew it, but I didn’t know it.

  • Poor Sheltered Homeschooler

    I need Adam to make it to a Final Tribal Council if only to see how he would respond to a bitter jury. His performance could easily rival Stephen Fishbach’s for greatest FTC meltdown ever.

    • Kemper Boyd

      Hi there, it’s Amanda Kimmel here and I’d like to say you are forgetting my TWO FTC meltdowns.
      Seriously Amanda could have won twice and she came 3rd behind Courtney and then lost to Parvati on the back of terrible FTC performances.
      *how amazing would it be if one of the commenters revealed they were in fact Amanda?

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        I DON’T KNOW WHY THAT WOULD BE AMAZING ARE YOU JUST IMPLYING THAT I CAN’T HANDLE A CRITICAL COMMENT I DON’T EVEN KNOW WHY I COME HERE

      • Other Scott

        I wouldn’t call them meltdowns though. Monica Culpepper melted down. Amanda kind of just … stunk.

      • Assistant Dragon Slayer

        Not as amazing as if you turned out to actually be a rogue FBI agent from the 60s.

        • Kemper Boyd

          A fictional rogue FBI agent at that.

    • Especially since the jury will probably have at least 3 people who can easily ruffle his feathers between Taylor/Will/Jay/Michelle. Hannah can also ruffle his feathers as well.

    • Something Quirky

      I’ve never been much of a FIshbach fan, but the second time I watched that FTC I realised just how much he was being piled onto, and I think he got super unfair treatment, so it wasn’t as much a meltdown as a somewhat surprising attack. I mean, it was clear JT would win, and yet they really went after him (as did JT a bit).

      • Purplerockmatt

        they had to vent and take it out on someone and they all loved JT, so fishbach got the blame for both of their actions

      • andythesaint

        Yeah, he had no way of knowing it would be like that. JT really set him up at the final three TC leading into it.

  • Saturday Night Palsy

    Taylor’s Ponderosa is wonderful. And… two backflips!

    • Diego Armando

      Any dogs; I’m asking for a friend?

  • andythesaint

    Anyone got any Survivor-related (either this episode/season/or other seasons) questions for the podcast? We’re full up on non-Survivor questions.

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      Worst Probst trolling?

      • Alycia Swift

        Of Probst and by Probst.

    • Streets_Ahead

      Let’s play choose your own adventure. It’s final 5 you are the swing vote. One path you’re almost for sure in the F2 but you are almost certain to lose other than banking on an amazing FTC. The other path you’re up against two stronger immunity threats but if you win you can take the one beatable opponent to FTC.

    • Would it have been better strategy (walk with me here, and pretend that Taylor is capable of strategy) for Taylor to out Adam’s advantage before Tribal Council in the hope of shifting the target, rather than waiting until TC when votes are mostly set in stone?

      And, more generally, what are the advantages/disadvantages of trying to make a big play at TC itself, versus during the scrambling stage?

      • andythesaint

        The first question was definitely one I planned on discussing tonight. The second one could be interesting…

    • What is your favorite Survivor location?

      • andythesaint

        Boston Rob?

        • That’s Probst’s favorite location.

          • andythesaint

            Nice

          • Thank you. I will give the assist to you though because you set me up so well.

      • Hornacek

        Tribal council?

    • Ms. Sweaterfan

      What do you think are the most likely vs. the most interesting potential outcomes for this season (in terms of prevailing alliances, remaining twists, final 5, winner, etc.)?

    • Kemper Boyd

      Who is the most underrated non-winner? In gameplay not character.

      • Black Dynamite

        I really like this question. I’m definitely going to think about this one.

        • Kemper Boyd

          Me too because there are obvious answers to who were the best non-winners but they aren’t really underrated. Wentworth is correctly rated for example.

          • Black Dynamite

            Yeah, I’m running into that same issue when I’m thinking of answers. It’s all people who’ve gotten their proper credit.

          • Kemper Boyd

            clue: I think a lot of them are women…

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            Yes, thinking through the implications of what would make a player “underrated”, it would almost have to be a) a one-time player, b) a woman, c) on a despised/forgotten season, and d) in the alliance that opposed the eventual winner (because the winner’s allies are either goats or very likely to be properly rated).

            On that basis, I think Holly from Nicaragua might be the one. I would never say she’s as good as Cirie in her first season, but she has a very similar story arc (starts the season having a nervous breakdown, but gets her legs under her as the game goes on, organizes the boot of the biggest remaining threat heading into the endgame, but falls victim at F4 to the winner’s immunity run).

            They obviously don’t fit criteria c) or d), but I’d also like to put in a good word for Becky and Sundra. They’re remembered as being inert pawns, but I watched Cook Islands a couple months ago and I think people forget how completely the Tyler Perry idol shut down any possibility of taking out Yul. And Sundra in particular did not get the edit she deserved IMO.

          • Roswulf

            On Becky and Sundra, they were hurt not just by the Tyler Perry Idol, but also by the first Final Three. That was an essentially impossible twist to plan for, and it meant they were both unexpectedly drawing dead at four.

            Granted the path to victory in a final two did involve “beating Ozzy and/or Yul at challenges,” but it was SOMETHING.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Holly is absolutely underrated as a player. A lot of the players who are most underrated in gameplay are women who then only played once and got far but didn’t win.

      • Purplerockmatt

        this one is underrated because it was so damn long ago, but Lex

        • Kemper Boyd

          He’s pretty well respected but yeah he was very good. I there are a few players from early seasons who are underrated for their gameplay but celebrated for their importance in the lore. I think Jerri is one of those too.

      • Roswulf

        I semi-seriously think the answer is Woo, if not now, then in a couple years when memories fade a bit and he crystallizes in the collective memory solely as “clueless guy who literally gave away the win.”

        He really was reasonably competent in Second Chances, and even in his first go around he managed to recover from significant setbacks to position himself to win the game.*

        Hey, the question was most underrated. Woo has a VERY low bar to clear.

        *GIANT ASTERISK

      • Other Scott

        Jon M….okay I can’t do it.

        Maybe Sierra Dawn Thomas? I think you really have to look into World’s Apart people who got screwed by Mike’s immunity run because there’s not really precedent for that for them to account for in their play.

        • Purplerockmatt

          if you are looking at World’s Apart that way then Rodney is winning that season.

          • Other Scott

            Then I think if you believe that, then maybe Rodney is the answer?

            …shudder.

          • Purplerockmatt

            yeah that was my point

          • Max_Jets

            I believe Rodney would have won and would actually be a great answer to this question.

        • Kemper Boyd

          The player most screwed by Mike was Carolyn not indecisive Sierra who always wanted to make a move but never did, even before Mike.

          • Other Scott

            I disagree on the basis that Sierra was probably the one giving confessionals about thinking about switching, but we never saw her being actually indecisive on the show. And I don’t think she really had incentive to switch to the likable people from the awful people anyways.

            In favour of it not being her, she badly screwed up that Final 5 situation.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Carolyn was involved in actual decision making and was playing the game. Sierra just wasn’t at all. I don’t think she’d have found a way past top 5 had Mike not been around.

          • Alycia Swift

            Carolyn, although nasty sometimes, and part of the overall annoying people, was on the ball from day 1. She was the one who followed So and found the idol herself. I wish I could have liked her more — if she had cut ties with Rodney and the like I might have.

    • Diego Armando

      What are your most and least favorite Immunity and Reward Challenges? Also, can Survivor make you (Andy and John) care about challenges?

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        My favorite Immunity challenges are the F4/F5 challenges, the ones with the giant mazes or the obstacle courses or the Olympian staircases.

        • Purplerockmatt

          yeah i love those too. or the ones with tons of different stations where they run through this series of insane obstacles and it is just huge

        • jersey_luck

          For a final immunity in my opinion it should either be endurance challenge or a skill based one like the ones in Tocantins or Samoa. The maze are okay but I believe the final challenge should be a test of willpower and focus.

      • Kemper Boyd

        I really love the violent ones. So people holding onto the poles and the get the bag to your mat ones.

        • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

          “they about to see some ta-tas”

        • Alycia Swift

          I do too for some reason …

          but not for the tat-tas reason.

    • Guest rite

      Jay’s piling votes onto Taylor this episode was pretty great, but when he voted out Michaela I immediately wanted Heroes v Villains II. Do you think that will ever happen? Or was it too perfect to be replicated? Is there a cast out there where the villains tribe wouldn’t make you hate the season?

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        I don’t know if you could fill out a cast of either. It’s stopped being honorable v. deceptive gameplay, because most people realize you need to fill out with a bit of each. The only villains I can see might be Kyle Jason? Carolyn Rivera? Dan and Will won’t/shouldn’t be cast again.

        • Roswulf

          There’s a giant Rodney shaped hole in your post!

          Sincerely, I’d kind of like to see Rodney come back. He’s an active player with some strategic game, and also an entertaining buffoon. And while, yes, sexist asshole, he doesn’t take it to a level I find actively unpleasant to watch.

          Other recent villains who I would like to see return include Reed and Abi Maria.

          • I’d like to see Reed back. I think we have had enough Abi for a little while. We know how her game goes and it isn’t going to change.

          • Alycia Swift

            I don’t think anyone would be stupid enough to think they can manager her the third time (except Pete).

          • Hornacek

            I predict that anyone that played with Abi in the future would probably want to give a retroactive apology to RC afterwards.

          • Hornacek

            The only stipulation I have to Rodney playing again is that it must be scheduled so that he is on the island on his birthday.

          • Alycia Swift

            And I’m the opposite – I thought he was unpleasant to watch, just as unpleasant as Dan and Will (he did egg Will on).

        • I actually find it easier to come up with villains who could return than heroes (assuming we try to avoid too many returnees etc).

          VILLAINS TRIBE:
          Jay/Adam (depending on how this series plays out)
          Kyle Jason/Nick Maiorano (I enjoyed Nick. I did not enjoy Jason)
          Peter Baggenstos
          Reed
          Pete Yurkowski
          Sash Lenahan

          Missy/Carolyn/Trish (pick 2)
          Erinn Lobdell
          Natalie Bolton
          Figgy
          Morgan McLeod

          HEROES TRIBE
          Mike Holloway
          LJ
          Reynold
          Terry Dietz
          Ken
          Matt Elrod

          Michaela
          Aubry/Cydney
          Lisa Welchel
          Natalie Anderson
          Brenda
          Chelsea

          Some are obviously questionable as heroes or villains, but they were last time too.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Only the Natalies on this list deserve to be on HvV2 and barely/

          • I think it’s more that it’s quite hard to come up with 20 returnees who haven’t already played a second time, full stop (I made an exception for Brenda as she was so memorably screwed over her second time, and for Terry because same). Even without a theme.

            I mean, obviously Figgy, Morgan, Missy etc ONLY make that list because I had to come up with some female villains, but still…

          • Kemper Boyd

            But HvV included 3rd time players, there is your downfall. It included bloody loads of 3rd time players like a third of the cast.
            Rob, Amanda, Stephanie, Jerri, Rupert, Colby, Parvati, Cirie.

          • This is true, but I don’t want to encourage them. I don’t need to see Rupert play a 5th time.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Oh god no. But I’m sure he will one day.

          • Kemper Boyd

            So put the cap at 3rd timers and aim for only 8. Allow yourself to put people in who will never play again.
            Heroes:
            Natalie Anderson
            Kelly Wentworth (1)
            Kim Spradlin
            Cydney
            Lisa

            Yu; (2)
            Joey Amazing (3)
            Cochran (4)

            Bob Crowley
            Ken

            Villains:
            Carolyn
            Nat Bolton
            Julia

            Corinne (5)

            Jason
            Reed
            Tony
            Bob Dawg
            Jim (because he’s desperate and I couldn’t think of a 5th man)

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            I guess I figure the villains are harder to fill out because I agree more strongly with your Hero picks, esp. the women (but not Brenda anymore). For me, I don’t know if either Peter showed enough to warrant a return.

          • Pete was very entertaining when he did RHaP, while Peter…you’re probably right, but he was SO hilariously awful. I guess you could replace him with Phillip…

          • Hornacek

            If Pete did come back I would also want Peter back only so Jeff would have to call Pete “Pete-bro” to differentiate them.

          • Alycia Swift

            Good list except Reynold while not quite a villian, is closer to one than a hero. And not Figgy or Morgan. I’d rather see Michaela or Jessica.

            EDIT – I just realized that you cast them as villians and neither of the other two would be (so far).

          • I’ve got Michaela in my heroes column right now, and Jessica hasn’t done anything particularly villainous yet. Plus, demographically, you need a couple of ‘young hot’ girls for that tribe. I guess Brenda could be a villain maybe?

            My guy heroes tribe is mostly buff guys with blue eyes and Reynold is very much one of those guys. He could easily be swapped for Malcolm or Joe though.

          • Hornacek

            Reyndolds redeemed himself in my eyes a bit with his FTC jury question where he encouraged Dawn to say what she really thought of him. I can’t remember exactly what she said but it was not flattering (sexist and arrogant?), and he seemed happy that he got her to admit it.

        • Alycia Swift

          Other than Kyle Jason: Scott Pollard, Jay from this season (Taylor too), Rodney (although I don’t want to see him again), Reed?.

          If you are including players that have played more than once, you have Abi Maria (again) and Tasha (she was not great the second time around), Kass (who could go either way).

    • Scarlett3639

      If Probst couldn’t host anymore for some reason, what former contestant would you like to see take over?

      My vote is Penner, but I think there are several interesting options.

      • Alycia Swift

        That would be my choice as well.

    • Side Character

      Maybe this is more of a question for sharculese to answer, but anyway…
      Now that we’ve reached the point of eligibility, who is the most useless player this season (so far)?

  • Sunday: ‘I’m getting bored of Adam and Taylor’s stupid feud driving the narrative here. I demand that we adjust our gameplans accordingly to give centre stage to MY stupid imaginary feud instead.’

    • Kemper Boyd

      Sunday: I’m a boring mom lady who won’t get a good storyline, I must be a cliche and hate the other white mom lady for that time I tried to vote her out.

      • All Sunday’s secret scenes from the last 5 episodes were just her going ‘I’m sure Jessica gave me a funny look at the challenge earlier. She hates me doesn’t she? She totally hates me. Do you think Jessica hates me?’, which is why Sunday has had no screentime. The producers are just ‘Sorry, unless Jessica has a secret stash of food as well we’re going with the Taylor thing.’

        • Sunday is just trying to take out every woman in the game so she can go on some kind of Chris Daugherty-esque run to final tribal council.

          • Because when given a choice of a woman or a bunch of men, Survivor juries have historically…oh wait.

          • I didn’t say it was a *good* strategy.

        • Kemper Boyd

          I bet Jessica’s confessionals are all “Sunday, she’s fine I guess, I don’t mind working with her again”.

          • Baulderstone

            I suspect if they had some of those, they would be playing them for dramatic juxtaposition. When asked about Sunday in confessionals. Jessica probably responds with a silent shrug.

        • Sadie

          Classic guilty conscience. She blamed taking out Paul on Jess and turned against her and now she cannot escape the feeling.

          That GenX group was never going to have long-term rehabilitation.Their last tribal was so expository. Everyone, except David and Ken wanted her gone and no one can really forget that. This temporary ceasefire is 100% due to David and Chris burying the hatched. And for that, they both get a load if credit. It was vital that they needed to make sure they had the Millennial threat under control first.

      • Hornacek

        I’m really hoping that we find out that Sunday’s feud with Jessica is 100% one-sided.

        • Baulderstone

          The complete inability of the editors to present a clip of Jessica saying anything about Sunday might be an indicator that is the case. Surely they were at least fishing to get Jessica talking about Sunday in one of the confessionals.

          • Hornacek

            I loved Shambo’s one-sided feud with Laura in Samoa that Laura knew nothing about.

      • hardcöre umlaut

        Exactly. At this point there are 3 women left against 8 men. Any woman actively trying to vote out another woman is shooting herself in the foot.

  • The three-tribe merge has definitely had the desired effect in terms of keeping the game open.

    I thought that Gen X, at least, would be pragmatic about sticking together for the first few votes (those boring logical Gen-Xers), but it looks like if Sunday gets her way that won’t be the case. The Millennials are clearly totally fractured. I thought Taylor going might end the Adam feud, but it’s looking like Jay is more than willing to take up that baton now.

    The most interesting part about all the links everyone has, really, is how difficult it’s going to get to control the flow of information (witness the previews, for example). Say Sunday does manage to convince Chris and Bret to go after Jessica next week. Even bringing in Jay and Will, that’s only five. Who’s going to be the sixth?

    David? But he’s not going to want to burn Ken and Jessica.
    Zeke? Is he really going to want to flip to an alliance that a) includes Jay and b) he’s clearly not at the center of?
    Hannah? Hard to get her vote without her leaking it to Zeke I think, at which point…see above.
    Adam? lol

    With this many numbers still in the game, it still looks really difficult to corral all the votes you need to change the momentum of the game. I’d say Jay and Will are still most at risk, because there’s at least consensus there. Adam too could become a consensus vote. But for basically everyone else there are so many different dynamics in play that without someone actively doing something to damage their own game (granted, Sunday could manage just that by trying to break up her alliance too soon) it’s hard to see how you build a large enough voting bloc to do anything. It’s fascinating.

    (Now, watch me be proved completely wrong next week when it turns out everyone hates Jessica and the editors just forgot to tell us or something).

    • Kemper Boyd

      I really enjoy the 2 to 3 to merge or even 2 to 3 to 2 then merge as it means there are fewer people at the merge who have never met each other and don’t have links through other allies.

    • It also means that initial trust has been shaken while initial distrust has gotten stronger. For example, Adam with Jay/Will.

  • So, I was doing my Survivor math and unless there is another double boot along the way, we are looking at another 6 person finale. I hope that isn’t true, but that’s the way it is working.

    • jersey_luck

      Yah I have seen that one coming all season long. I also did not the many tribal councils in the Cambodia’s finale. The final tribal council honestly suffered because of the lack time spent towards the jury’s questions and speeches.

      • Although I cannot deny that “No Votes Counted” was excited and Jeremy trying to get Keith’s attention was funny, having four tribal councils in two hours including FTC is not a good idea. Having the truncated FTC is not good, especially since we get rid of opening statements which can be crucial for framing the narrative.

        • Other Scott

          Yeah but we had a 4 person finale in Kaoh Rong and still got rid of the opening statements.

          I think they’re going away from FTC being much of a thing. Which makes sense, as it’s never really worked as intended as a vote decider and the effectiveness in your final tribal council doesn’t really correlate all that well into how many votes you get at the end.

          • jersey_luck

            That probably true, but it is a bit a shame that is happening because it is the only time we see how the jury reacts to the finalists on the show. It should be the natural end point to the stories the show as been telling for entire season. It should be last major point for the people on the show and is the sum of the parts.

          • To counter that, we had closing statements in Kaoh Rong.

            FTC is not being much of a thing because it has always been the chance for the players to justify their game. However, it has suddenly shifted to “last chance to prove that you can be a worthy returnee” for the jury members.

          • Alycia Swift

            I have to admit that I miss the days when the final episode was a big, big deal and we got the interviews with the jurors in what they were looking for on the show (and did not have to seek them out.)

    • Purplerockmatt

      i think even with a double boot that is happening. Maybe they use the double episode next week to do 3 boots in two episodes

      • That is my hope as well, but man having three exit press interviews during the Thanksgiving weekend is rough.

        • Alycia Swift

          They usually reschedule the exit press interviews if there is a major holiday since the handlers at CBS close down. If you are talking about RHAP, he will likely do the Know It Alls – a longer one – as usual, then do the other interviews Friday but do the exit press ones Monday.

          • Good to know!

          • Hornacek

            The RHAP exit interviews for Thanksgiving have always (?) been on the following Monday, and Rob’s confirmed this for next week’s episode.

      • Hornacek

        It would be crazy and probably never happen but I am hoping that both episodes next week are double-boot episodes meaning 4 exit interviews.

  • Crappy

    I am gonna defend Adam a bit here. It is obvious he is way overplaying and doing bad socially as a result. But I kind of relate to him being a hot mess out there since I can totally imagine myself being in a same situation if I was out there.. that is over thinking strategically and in turn messing up my whole game.

    Everyone says that social game is the most important one but in post Tony era, everyone also wants to play the hardest. So is looking for an idol when rest are out goat hunting in group or are bonding over merge meal a bad move or a good move? Adam also seems to be overthinking about his position in respective alliances, hence his attempts to juggle between millennials and extended Gen X bloc. Or ill-advised attempt to try to use Taylor as a pawn.

    His ideas are good IMO but both his social read (not picking up that Taylor would not work with him under any circumstance or Jay is getting turned off by the frank side conversation) and execution is pretty bad. So yeah that probably does make him a bad survivor player but also shows the difference between knowing and executing strategy. Someone like Shirin suffered from the same problem IMO.

    • Agreed. And, as I mentioned in a comment below, if you view Adam’s game through the lens of ‘guy who left his dying mother at home to play Survivor like they both always dreamed of, and is terrified of not making the most of this shot at this very difficult time in his life’, he becomes a lot more sympathetic.

    • Kemper Boyd

      Did Michele not prove that playing the hardest means nothing if it’s done the wrong way?

      • Crappy

        She may have but a lot of survivor players will always play as hard as they can. I guess you can chalk it down to what John said about everyone playing the way that it suits them . Besides I would argue that we still have not really established what exactly Aubry did wrong to lose to Michele last season other than jury liking the latter more. If we go by Jason’s post watching the TV edit comments then it seems she actually needed to make more overt big moves to gain visibility than actually play ‘less hard’.

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          I don’t take Jason at his word about that. I think the key piece of information that they didn’t show (because they couldn’t) was the way Scot, Jason, and (surprisingly) Julia completely froze out Cydney at Ponderosa. That means that they had little idea what happened in the game after Joe’s medevac, and strongly implies that they were Dead-Sea salty and were never going to admit they got outplayed by a nerd.

          • jersey_luck

            To be honest I would say the one thing Jason regrets would be not voting for Tai over Michele.

          • Hornacek

            I would say the one thing Jason regrets is that he’s only the number one bounty hunter is south-western Michigan, not southern Michigan.

    • jersey_luck

      If I had to guess the main point of his continuing relationship with Taylor was an attempt to get his jury vote. If I am right, then Adam has a poor read on the jury and the people in the game. I feel bad for Adam because he could be in really bad place coming home to his dying mother after being salvaged by the jury in the game he loves.

      Also the most important part of the game is social game as shown in the past three seasons. The jury has to like you more then the more other people in the game for some reason.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        Maybe for Mike that’s true, but I would say that gameplay is still important and social game is the tiebreaker. Or maybe a social game makes your strategy look better. Jeremy and Spencer had decently comparable strategic gameplay. Koah Rong jurors said afterward that Aubry’s strategic moves weren’t apparent, so Michele, Aubry, and Tai may have looked like they were on equal strategic footing (maybe not Tai).

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    HOLY SH*T HOLY SH*T HOLY MOTHERF*CKING SH*T

    The implosion of GenX and the possible retargeting onto Jay makes next week’s tribal look like it’ll be crazier than this week. Does Will know that in confirming Jay’s idol he’s just encouraging a vote where he goes home himself?

    Taylor was doing some Trumped up fear-monging there. “He can rip a loved ones visit out of your hands.” Obviously this was filmed over the summer, but the parallels are eerie.

    Confirming what we may have already known, Adam can’t keep his cool at tribal. Being blindsided and slandered at tribal can provoke that reaction, but it would have been better to lay onto the fact that Taylor did something immediately harmful to the tribe; your advantage has yet to have been played. Then promise that you wouldn’t use your advantage on the loved ones visit (if you use it at all). Even if that sounds like an empty promise, that’s what you get for trusting your secret to the biggest idiot on the island.

    Jay and Will voted for Taylor! I guess by doing that, Jay knew Adam wouldn’t go home this week, but by planting the seed and saving his idol, he looks to stay two more tribals. Then if you can work yourself as the ever-valuable swing vote, you’re in the clear for a bit. Might this vote end up being the biggest move of the episode? Is it already?

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      Will voted for Jay.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        whoops missed that

    • andythesaint

      Completely agreed about Will’s big mouth potentially making him the target. If they want to get out Jay next, he’s the guy they’re most likely splitting the vote with. Whereas if they assumed Jay didn’t have an idol (because he didn’t play it this week), they might ALL vote for him next time.

      • Diego Armando

        I think Will will go home since flushing Jay’s idol will likely become everyone’s top priority.

        • Hornacek

          Especially since he’s seen in the previews telling the majority alliance about it. “Hmm, it’s everyone against me and Jay, and Jay has an idol … I know, I’ll let them know Jay has the idol! That way they won’t vote for me!”

    • Baulderstone

      I don’t know how destroying the advantage really helps Adam at this point. The real harm in the revelation is that Adam was sharing his big secrets with Team Brodown and keeping them from everyone else. That he was perfectly happy to cover up their food stealing, suggesting he had some kind of understanding with them. Nobody can trust him with their voting plans now.

      Maybe he can convince them that he really wasn’t receiving anything from Taylor to cover up his stealing, but it might be hard for anyone to believe Adam is actually that dumb.

      • Roswulf

        That’s the largest harm, but there’s a smaller harm from a genuine fear that he’ll steal their reward. Taylor and Jay weren’t wrong to harp on the loved one visit- that’s the kind of fear that can lead to an irrational overreaction.

        • Baulderstone

          Yeah, he might as well destroy it. If it were an actual, useful advantage, I would say he needed to cling to it for dear life to get through the crisis he has made for himself, but it isn’t.

  • Something Quirky

    What was “Next time on Survivor”?
    (My d/l cut out, so alas I also missed Taylor’s exit speech, which I assume was not amazing.)

    • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

      He literally sounded like a five year old.

      “I made a new best friend in Jay, and I got a girlfriend in Figgy, and we’ll buy a boat, and we’ll go on adventures together on the boat.”

      • Something Quirky

        lol good luck with that, buddy. Well, I’m sure he and Jay will go bowling sometime, if he’s not too busy with fatherhood and such.

      • Sadie

        *crosses fingers* please know that babies can’t float…

        • Alycia Swift

          Or be stuffed into a Mason jar.

          • Roswulf

            Pfft, only if you aren’t great with Mason jars.

    • Hornacek

      Next time on Survivor:

      – “there’s a civil war in the GenX tribe” various GenX players seen suggesting voting another GenX person out.
      – Will tells Zeke about Jay’s idol and swears him to secrecy. Then Zeke tells someone, and that person tells someone else, and so on.

      • Something Quirky

        Thanks.

        I was surprised to read that Will voted for Jay, given how close they were on the last tribe. Who were the extra Taylor votes? Wait, Hannah? She wasn’t in the group on the beach.

        • I think Will has the germ of a decent player in him. He knows enough to cut loose from Jay and Taylor if he can, at least.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        Chris/Bret/Sunday target Jessica. Jessica/David/Ken target Chris. Will tells Zeke about Jay’s idol, who tells David, who tells everyone else on the tribe. The kicker is that Will says he needs to be judicious in who he tells, so he may be trying to make a move while Zeke/David blow up his game.

    • Roswulf

      Others have commented on the content, but it’s worth tracking down. Very good sense of comic editing, probably my favorite part of the episode.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Also, it’s easier to have more people push the crate than pull it, right? Could Hannah’s team at least caught up if they had the right strategy?

    • Yes, it’s easier to push the crate. I still don’t know that they would have caught up, because Hannah did a horrendous job of selecting her team.

      • Something Quirky

        Her theory of keeping Jay and Will close was sound, but then she should have at least snagged Ken or someone.

      • Roswulf

        To be fair, by far the most unbalanced pick was that one team got “Hannah” while the other got “Chris.”

        There’s no excuse for not having one of Brett or Ken, but she was probably doomed from moment one.

        • Baulderstone

          They probably should have gone with Freaks and Geeks rules and picked someone as equally poor at challenges as the other captain alongside Hannah.

          Then again, looking at the remaining players, I’m not sure such a person exists. Still, they could have done better than having the other captain be a challenge monster. I seem to recall the captains were random anyway.

          • Roswulf

            Yes, they said they were random. They should have dropped the randomness and done something like Ken v. Jay.

          • Baulderstone

            I don’t know. That kind of thing lends itself too easily to production meddling and manufactured drama. It’s unfortunate that we got a lopsided pick this week, but that will happen.

            In any case, I was pleased we got more detail on the schoolyard pick this week. It’s like they have been listening to my online griping about it.

          • andythesaint

            I think if it’s made clear how a schoolyard pic went, it’s because it went poorly and they want to hang the fail on someone.

          • Baulderstone

            Good point!

          • Right. This wasn’t a random draw that resulted in unbalanced teams. This was by choice.

    • Assistant Dragon Slayer

      I do obstacle course races, and coincidentally was in one last weekend with a sled-pull component. Normally it’s easier to pull, in part because you can plant your feet, lean back and let gravity do some of the work. But under that net, having most of them push was the way to go.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Cutting Floor Roundup:

    Zeke thinks he’s at the pinnacle of power. I don’t know about that. He’s no longer on the bottom, and he’s set up to keep advancing, but if GenX decides they want to stick together (unlikely, but not yet known to Zeke), then Zeke is boxed out.

    I like that Zeke called out Jeff and said choosing food isn’t about thinking you’re safe. It’s about knowing you won’t win. I would’ve been correcting Jeff all throughout that challenge.

    These titles are misleading (or maybe I’m projecting too much onto them). “I Had a Lovely Time With Will.” Might we see the development of this Zeke-Will bond that seems to be coming out of nowhere? No, just talking bout grilled cheeses? Okay. “I Rode the Wrong Wave.” Oh, does Jay realize that Taylor is a terrible alliance member? No, more challenge. Cool. “Final 3 Dilemma” Jessica might flip on David and Ken? Nope, just a decision between a million dollars and respect (and I think you lose respect by not setting yourself up to win, e.g. Woo)

    Ken: “Why do me and Adam, why does Chris and Adam, get the same portion of rice? The guy weighing 250 pounds gets the same calories as the guy weighing 110 pounds. I don’t think that seems fair.” I half expected Jeff to pop up and make a tenuous GenX-Millennial comparison.

    • Sadie

      Classic. The big guys always wonder why the little guys eat as much as them and the little guys are all like “I have no fat to burn for energy!”

      (as per David talking about food rewards. Side note: I really like that David refers to the chefs and bartenders by name in his confessionals.)

      • Baulderstone

        As a skinny guy, I will say that I eat more than almost anyone I know. My metabolism is a furnace, and I really crash hard when I have to skip meals.

    • Baulderstone

      Zeke does have the edge of being close to Chris, who is the leader of one of the Gen X factions. If his Gen X connection was someone like Bret, I’d be more worried for him.

      Zeke is also the oldest of the Millennials too, so he blends pretty well among Gen X. if Gen X is thinking about getting rid of one the “kids” he wouldn’t be an immediately obvious choice.

      • Roswulf

        Zeke’s strength is that he seems to have a lot of one-on-one bonds, and that those bonds cross alliance lines. He’s got his mini-alliance with Hannah, Adam, but he’s also got genuinely close relationships with Chris and David. And those are very good people to be close too right now.

        I think this could easily be a jury liability- eventually he is going to have to betray people who think they have a tight relationship with Zeke, and that’s a hard thing to recover from at FTC. But in the short term, it’s an enviable position.

        • Diego Armando

          Zeke was a debate champion and I think his likely Final 3 would be Hannah and Adam. I like those odds if that happens.

          • Roswulf

            Oh If Zeke manages to drag Hannah and Adam to the end, I’d say he wins unanimously. The concern is only if he has to jettison one or both of them, and ends up with other people with skills, be they Jay or Chris or David or Ken or someone yet to emerge.

          • Oh my god, that would be the biggest of FTC slam dunks ever.