Survivor Millennials vs Gen X Episode Finale Liveblog: “I’m Going for a Million Bucks”

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Matt
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Matt

Matt has an irrational dislike for all contestants named Michel(l)e. Also if he ever takes a strong stance about why everyone else is wrong, it is he that is inevitably wrong.

Favorite seasons: Micronesia, Heroes vs. Villains, Palau, Philippines, Pearl Islands, Cagayan
Matt
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  • gouis

    Guys.

    It’s Tony. And Sandra. And Cirie. All in the same place. Did I mention Tony?

    https://twitter.com/RedmondSurvivor/status/809125825761202176

    • gouis

      Tony looks pretty nervous. I’m concerned for him.

      • the sky is falling

        Is everyone here on the Tony train? I can’t abide by Tony-doubters.

        • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

          Depends. Can he play the “I know I’m going early so use me now” role (even though that’s just a cover)?

        • gouis

          Yes. Tony haters can go elsewhere.

        • indescribable hat

          Yes? I feel like a Tony doubter lately because I see Cirie (and Sandra) as the big headline, but I like him! Really! I just feel more strongly about Cirie and never worried he wouldn’t come back. But he’s great!

    • Alycia Swift

      I see Sandra and Tony – where is Cirie?

    • Who is beside Sandra?

      • gouis

        Unknown.

    • Diego Armando

      Cirie looks great.

    • Ms_Woozah

      Sandra and Tony are going to be on the same tribe, right? This is all I ever wanted.

    • indescribable hat

      Ciriiiiiiiiiiiiiiie! A while back some of y’all were expressing skepticism about her wanting to come back but I kept hope alive. I’m so happy.

  • EmAndScoutInBK

    Guys, maybe I’m just all emotional because of this year or something and because I have a trial tomorrow, but like, I’m glad to be here with y’all.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    David is Osama bin Laden. Maybe not the comp I’d choose, but

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    You can emphasize the fake in fake idol. But hiding it for another person? That’s something else.

    • the sky is falling

      Spy shack levels of trickery. this is a delicious gambit by David.

      • Alycia Swift

        I can’t believe it worked so far.

        • Mike Hirsch

          I’m not 100% sure how this helps David, but let’s see how it plays out!

          • jersey_luck

            It gives false comfort to the person who finds the idol, that person would assume that they found the only idol. It means that person is less likely to look to find it.

          • Meaning…the real idol was still there for Adam to find.

          • the sky is falling

            Silver lining is no one knows David made it, can’t hurt him

        • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

          I’d like someone to tell him it’s fake, but it won’t live up to the stick.

      • I guess I am a witch because I definitely made a song parody of Tony singing about being in a spy shack with David a long time ago.

    • Did David include a note? I didn’t see it when Jay opened it, but I’d think David would think of that when he hid it.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        He did as far as I saw. And he had note leftover I assume

        EDIT: I think it was wrapped when David put it in the coconut

      • MrBurkesButtons

        Yes, David included the note from his old idol.

        Should that be legal? It’s one thing to assume this object is an idol, but if a note from the producers tell you it’s legit, you should be able to trust that. Otherwise, every idol falls in doubt, and there’s no way to verify before your neck is on the line.

        • turgid_legume

          Production wants whatever will result in the best television, not the most comfort to players. Jay thinking he played a legitimate idol was excellent television. If you’re savvy enough to save your idol parchment you should be able to bluff with it.

    • sharculese

      At the same time, what did that accomplish?

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        Arguably not much. But the same could be said for any fake idols. I like this more because showing off a fake idol for yourself don’t prevent votes from coming your way. If anything, people want to flush it and will force that with votes. Letting someone else have it may make their complacent or overconfident and throw off their game. But at the end of the day, fake idols are only aesthetically nice, not strategically.

        • prettyboyprobst

          He even planned on doing this to someone from the get go (he mentioned in some pregame-content that he could do that to help with his anxiety, as it would give him a leg up on understanding what is happening in the lead up to a TC-vote) but I also agree with Diego that it didn’t do much here and could have even backfired.
          Still, it was very skillfully executed.

          • Diego Armando

            I think answer might be that he just wanted to make and use a fake idol.

          • prettyboyprobst

            He got the skills and the mischievous plan to put it to use, I can see why he would want to show that off.
            As for the backstory, that probably wasn’t in play here, but like I said these were pregame comments and it doesn’t seem too far-fetched to think that it could have helped him then.

      • Diego Armando

        I was wondering that. Couldn’t Jay finding this potentially scare Hannah, ADAM, and Bret into not voting him? I guess he wanted Jay to relax and cause good TV, which are good, but the plan had a lot of potential blowback.

      • Possibly, what it accomplished was stopping Jay finding the real idol, leaving it open for Adam. Which in turn kept Adam in the game, and ultimately led to David’s vote out and Adam’s win.

        Lots of other variables there as well obviously (if Jay had found the real idol, maybe Jay wins the entire thing instead), but it’s an interesting possibility. The real question, of course, is what was David thinking being so complacent that there were no more idols?

  • Alycia Swift

    How is Dave doing that in the dark? Must be nice to have camera light.

    • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

      He lit a fire, didn’t he?

      • Alycia Swift

        Oh duh – that’s what he was doing.

  • Alycia Swift

    I feel so bad for Jay now.

  • Purple Tentacle

    I missed where David got that legit looking necklace? That blows that shaved stick from China (?) out of the water.

    • Alycia Swift

      He made it.

      • Purple Tentacle

        That’s pretty crafty.

    • Hornacek

      Didn’t that stick have a face on it?

  • I’m 12 minutes behind, but I had to punch in for my biannual reminder that DAYUM long-sleeve T Jeff is my favorite Jeff.

    Oh wait, he just said “curled up in front of the couch.” Well…I still would have sex with him.

    • m0nit0rman

      I caught that too… Live TV is HARD!

    • Ms. Sweaterfan

      Haha! Sometimes during finales don’t you just get so excited you fall right off the couch and just curl up there?

    • indescribable hat

      I mean you could be, right? Sometimes I sit on the floor and lean on the couch. I’m sure that’s what he meant!

  • the sky is falling

    Yeses! I called it, Legacy is immunity! That’s way too powerful.

    • Alycia Swift

      Especially if he wins the next one.

    • Purple Tentacle

      Also kind of a let down….we’ve waited all season for the reveal and that’s it?

  • Alycia Swift

    Wow – David did a puzzle. And the shine is falling off Jay.

    • the sky is falling

      David build puzzles with a 3D printer pre-show. Puzzles are his forte.

      • Alycia Swift

        But he has not done well with them despite practicing before this.

      • Hornacek

        They lay down before him like …

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    YAAAAAAAAAASSSSSSSS I LOVE IT JAY

    EDIT: “I don’t know why I’m clapping.”

  • Alycia Swift

    Hannah and Ken look fine. Bret looks pissed.

    • But at least it looks bad on Jay, not on David.

    • the sky is falling

      Bret thought there was beer involved.

    • sharculese

      Production: How many Bret eye roll shots do you have from FTC?

      Camera crew: Couple hundred, maybe?

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Even if I was starving, I still won’t touch the asparagus.

    • prettyboyprobst

      You’re missing out! (Not on nutrition, though.)

  • Alycia Swift

    David – incredibly tempting and incredibly dumb.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Are we watching a new tectonic shift in alliance building re: the road to Final Tribal v. who you sit with? I mean, we’ve all had the same discussion here for weeks, but this endgame might make it more widespread. There’s always been a tension between the two in the maneuvering at the end, but it seems more and more like the payers are taking unnecessary risks while they assume that they make it to the end.

  • Alycia Swift

    Sunday is stunning.

    • But man, that is some Midwest Church Hair.

    • Sad Lil

      Darn tootin!

  • the sky is falling

    BRING BACK JAY ASAP! best survivor exit top 10 list, he’s on it

    • Roswulf

      Heck, he’s arguably on it twice given how great he was at the Michaela boot.

      But yeah, Jay should be back, and he will be back.

    • Something Quirky

      But what about ‘Justin’?

  • Alycia Swift

    Well the Legacy Advantage did not do much but it was a decent idea.

    • jersey_luck

      It would worked better if person who gave up didn’t get eliminated by random chance and lost because they were in the minority.

    • Hornacek

      The real legacy (cough) of the legacy advantage will be if players in future seasons will be thinking about it when making friends with other people pre-merge they wouldn’t normally make friends with.

  • gouis

    Jay could have had a real doofus exit when you combine the fake idol and the challenge failure. But he handled it like such a champ. I need him back ASAP.

    • corndogshuffle

      I was just smiling the whole time. Jay WILL play again and I can’t wait to see what he looks like on a second chance.

      • andythesaint

        I’m actually glad he isn’t coming back right away. Back-to-back is a death sentence. He just needs a bit of seasoning and he might be unstoppable.

        • indescribable hat

          He’d be delicious with a bit of seasoning.

    • Baulderstone

      Jay’s smooth use of the Reward Stealing Advantage was enough to more than counter a false idol play.

    • sharculese

      Jay Andrea Boehlke’d that shit.

    • Ms_Woozah

      Jay is probably my favorite player of the season. Three months ago I would not have believed I would ever say that.

    • He’d built up so much goodwill that I was fine with it at that point. And at least David had gone the extra mile of hiding it in a coconut, putting a mark on the coconut, and wrapping it in an actual note. It’s not like it was a fucking stick.

      • Diego Armando

        I will state that I would have fallen for that easily.

        • From the couch, the only real giveaway that it wasn’t an idol was that the paint on the fake idol was pink, instead one of the four tribe colors.

      • gouis

        I was just worried he was going to be upset at tribal. That thing was 100% authentic looking. And instead of getting upset his face just lit up, and was like “WOW YOU GOT ME GOOD! SURVIVOR!!!!”

        • He’s so great. I would’ve bro-hugged him and done finger guns at him as he walked off. It’s the send-off he deserved.

          • Hornacek

            If I could find it I’d post the animated GIF of Jeff doing finger guns from the tribal a few episodes ago.

        • Baulderstone

          Yeah, that was fantastic. I already liked Jay, but his departure made me a true Jay fan. If he returns, and I expect he will, I’m going to be actively rooting for him all season.

          Given that the fake idol was serving no strategic purpose, it really could have blown up in David’s face and made him look like a dick. Jay’s reaction made it look like David gave him the best goodbye gift that one Survivor fan can give another.

      • Dezbot

        That stick was da real MVP.

  • Loved how the camera caught Bret putting on his backpack when Jay pulled out the “idol.” This show is good.

    • the sky is falling

      Do we have enough for a top 10 list of fake idols? Cause that one gives the randy idol a run for its money.

      • Wentworth’s wasn’t bad.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        Top fake idols, or top fake idol plays? Because the stick is always number one on the former

        • the sky is falling

          I was thinking plays. the fucking stick is the greatest easily.

        • Baulderstone

          This was a fantastically made idol, but as an idol play, I don’t think it really did much. It made Jay go to his doom with less of a fight, but I don’t know that he would have had any moves left anyway.

      • corndogshuffle

        I think in terms of execution, David’s fake idol might be the best ever. He even hid it inside a coconut. I don’t know that any fake idol can match this when you factor in everything.

        • the sky is falling

          Yes, that was very ingenious

  • THIS PUZZLE PHRASE. I am triggered. Go away, Trump’s America.

    • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

      They’ve been getting progressively worse each season. Or is that regressively worse?

      • Sylvisual

        Regressive. Old age does that to you.

        • Alycia Swift

          Yes, I know that for sure.

  • Alycia Swift

    Not a participation trophy – hilarious.

    • corndogshuffle

      The participation trophy thing drives me crazy, but I did a literal spit take when I saw that that was a puzzle answer. For Immunity at final five, no less.

    • andythesaint

      We will never let this meme die.

  • Ken: great at being wet, bad at doing things.

    • Sylvisual

      I thought his fans were good at being wet.

      • touché

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        It’s not so much something you’re good at. It’s a constant state of being.

    • Whoops. There goes my shot.

    • Alycia Swift

      That’s the most excited Ken’s been all season.

      • That’s because he doesn’t get to look at himself.

        • Alycia Swift

          That cracked me up.

  • New game: every time Bret says ‘crazy’, take a drink. If you make it to the second episode still conscious, award yourself a participation trophy.

    • corndogshuffle

      Bret drinking game rules

      1. Every time he says crazy, drink
      2. Every time he drinks, drink

      We are so screwed.

    • m0nit0rman

      I really liked Bret, but the writing off of people with other opinions as “crazy” seems to point to a lot of the bigger problems we’re dealing with these days.

      • Hornacek

        “These people aren’t voting the way I want them to do! It’s as if they have their own goals that don’t include me winning the game! They’re crazy!” (takes drink)

        • Thirty-five Sandcastles

          So much this. He really went out like an ass when he was voted off. “You guys just gave David a million bucks. Don’t you realize it was your duty to play the game in a manner that makes it easier for ME to get the million bucks?”

          • Hornacek

            When he started referring to everyone else as “crazies” I knew for sure he wasn’t winning (not that I thought he was winning before).

  • gouis

    @BlackDynamite as the resident Hannah fan club president can you tell her to take a shower?

    • gouis

      Also I don’t know how to input you until you comment. DISQUS FAIL

    • Black Dynamite

      It’s really bad.

      • gouis

        Thank you for your honesty.

  • the sky is falling

    puzzle alternate phrase thread:

    gen X: If you wanna fuck with the Eagles, you need to learn to fly.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    So Participation Trophy is a terrible word puzzle solution, but I don’t know what else I would’ve expected. Maybe I just want someone to say “Battle For The Ages” before this season ends.

    • Hornacek

      I would have accepted THIS ISN’T REALLY A THEME.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Do they always rehide idols this late? Or is it just that no one ever looks for them?

    • the sky is falling

      I’m all for idol madness, but calling shenanigans on new idol at final 5. Too late, survivor, too late.

    • Alycia Swift

      They do if they are all played. They probably hid it 2 tribals ago and it just was not found.

  • Oh sweet, Zeke brought enough shirts to share with the other boys.

  • Bret said it.

    • Hannah is an idiot.

      • That was their shot. I’m not unhappy or anything – I’ve come to like The David Show also starring Survivor – but that was it.

        • corndogshuffle

          I’m thrilled because I think David just won… but (plot armor aside) I’m amazed that David wasn’t taken out there.

          • Alycia Swift

            Ken or David have to win immunity. If Adam wins, David goes home or there’s a firemaking challenge.

            And Ken did not break his promise so far to Adam.

          • the sky is falling

            Nope, Hannah goes in that case

          • corndogshuffle

            Even if that happens I think David’s worst case scenario is a fire making challenge against Hannah.

          • If Adam wins I wouldn’t put it past Hannah to vote off Ken at this point.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    So I nailed the Jay -> Bret order, but no way Hannah comes in second after the jury sees that she kept David

  • corndogshuffle

    Oh Hannah… I love David, but that just wasn’t smart.

  • Alycia Swift

    Ok Will no one is looking at you.

    Bret is a bad sport. The only one so far on this season.

  • Black Dynamite

    Hannah Moment of the Week: I can’t defend this move. Voting out Bret over Adam is ridiculously awful. I’m devastated by Hannah’s bad play.

    • sharculese

      No, you don’t understand. She was making her moves.

  • I love quality comedy.

  • Alycia Swift

    This is a great challenge-

    • corndogshuffle

      Great FIC. I love this challenge anyway, but the added wrinkle of the clock made it just that much more interesting.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Is Hannah throwing this to Ken? It’s hard to tell.

    • Alycia Swift

      Did not think of that. But possibly.

  • the sky is falling

    and Ken just gave David 1 million dollars. boom!

    • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

      and I thought they had them all watch Cagayan. He won’t learn a damn thing from Woo

      • corndogshuffle

        I was just thinking “so, Ken is Woo”. Then I saw this. Just incredible.

    • and Ken just gave me 1 million boners. sploosh

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        you should probably get that checked out

      • the sky is falling

        cBS is gonna cash in on the David Ken sitcom

        • corndogshuffle

          I hope they hire David to write it.

        • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

          Didn’t they already cancel the Odd Couple?

        • “Abs and the Beardpatch,” Mondays at 9:30.

  • the sky is falling

    Dave/Ken has to be the most adorable alliance since JT/Fishbach

  • Alycia Swift

    Ok – Bret may be a bitter juror.

  • corndogshuffle

    “OK, Jeff Probst.”

    Jesus H. Christ I love Hannah.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    WHAAAAAAAAAT HOYL SHIT

  • the sky is falling

    FUCK YOU KEN!

    • gouis

      You wish

  • Alycia Swift

    Ken has a shot against Adam. But not a big one. But he had no shot against David.

    • the sky is falling

      He had no shot either way fuck his “honor” I’m pissed. Fucker

      • corndogshuffle

        I kind of hope he gets zero votes. I’m not going to be gutted like I was in the Kaoh Rong finale but Ken wasn’t going to win anyway, so I wanted to see David fight for it.

        • the sky is falling

          Ken is dead to me

          • corndogshuffle

            If he even tries to bring up honor after voting David out he will be laughed out of the room. Adam is going to destroy both Ken and Hannah. I would bet heavily on that.

  • Adam’s gotta be winning this now right?

    • corndogshuffle

      I think that’s what’s about to happen.

      • Alycia Swift

        I do too. But Ken has a shot. Adam will use the mother story.

        This is one of the better finales. Thank God we are not having Jeff show us stuff like crying girls, how much food the Survivor eats, etc.

        • corndogshuffle

          I think this season is a great example in favor of a final six finale. No down time whatsoever, it’s been super exciting. I don’t think Ken stands a chance, but I don’t miss Jeff’s interruptions. Just two hours of Survivor.

        • If Adam doesn’t win I hope the ghost of his dead mother fucking haunts the producers for putting us through that heartbreak in her name.

    • I certainly hope so. He was my preseason pick and I really like him, but I’m worried that Ken might pull it off. It really depends on what Jay decides to do at FTC.

      • Alycia Swift

        Jay probably already said something at Ponderosa.

    • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

      I’ll have the winner on my Pick 4 and probably finish outside of the Top 100. That’ll be fun.

      • Assistant Dragon Slayer

        I had the pre-season consensus winner pick and the actual winner in Outcasts and I’m not going to be anywhere close to qualifying for Champions League. Although I’m going to move up a bunch of spots.

    • I’m not sure about this jury. I really…don’t know how the votes are going to go.

    • Kent McK

      I don’t think the jurors like Adam.

    • Alycia Swift

      I wonder if we get opening speeches b/c we have about 15 minutes before it runs over to the reunion.

      • Alycia Swift

        No speeches.

        • Taylor’s question was basically ‘what’s your opening speech?’

          • Alycia Swift

            Yes. It was.

  • gouis

    I would not have guessed Ken flipping in a million years.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Congrats John on the Predictions win. I think we the readers are locked into third, which might be better than we normally do

  • gouis

    I loooove Ken, but if he wins the early season edgicers win again. We cannot let that happen.

    • sharculese

      I can’t wait to listen to Dom & Colin next week.

      • gouis

        You’ll have to let us know.

        I also think the edgicers thought David was a clear winner post merge. Glad they’re wrong on every count.

  • Welp, Trump’s win has officially fallen to the second-most surprising vote of 2016. Sad!

    • gouis

      No.

  • “DAMN KIDS DON’T KNOW HOW TO JUST SIT.” – Ken, 31 going on 102

    • WAIT A MINUTE THIS IS HIS TRIBAL COUNCIL STRATEGY
      THEY USED FORESHADOWING AAAAAAAAAAAA

    • sharculese

      Ken’s luxury item was a bag of Werther’s Originals.

  • the sky is falling

    Finale was going great, then Ken ruins it. YOU HAD ONE JOB,

    • Alycia Swift

      I’m fine with this outcome.

      • the sky is falling

        Not me, oh well, Tony was the only guy I rooted for who won, typical

        • Alycia Swift

          And while I’ve come to appreciate Tony, I did not root for him. I rooted for Kass.

    • corndogshuffle

      Still really exciting, but shit. A final three with David nor Jay was the only way I could have been even slightly disappointed with the winner, and that’s what happened. I won’t be gutted like I was in Kaoh Rong, but this is not what I wanted to see.

      • the sky is falling

        It was a great finale, agreed

      • Alycia Swift

        Very good finale so far. I have a big grin on my face. So different from last season and Worlds Apart and even Cambodia.

        • corndogshuffle

          Jay’s vote out may have been the most sincerely positive vote out this late in the history of Survivor. It’s just impossible to be in a bad mood with that guy around. This is an amazing finale.

  • Alycia Swift

    Ken’s gotta bring up his daughter.

    • Dezbot

      Wait, what??? I totally missed all the gossip this season (probably because I didn’t spend much time at Sucks because work). Also, for that matter, what is Zeke’s secret that people were hoping he talked about? I remember seeing a rumor that he was trans, but it was just a rumor.

  • the sky is falling

    Ken is ugly now. FIGHT ME, LOL

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Is that true? Did Hannah vote correctly on every vote except Jessica?

    • sharculese

      Jessica doesn’t really count, since it was a tie, but she voted correctly everywhere else except Taylor.

  • Okay, Clean Taylor isn’t bad-looking.

    Wow, David is a human person.

    Damn, Sunday, like Jessica, is a stone cold fox.

  • the sky is falling

    Terrible final 3

  • the sky is falling

    Adam is being a dick in ftc

  • Kent McK

    Before this gets ugly I just want to mention how great the shot of Ken stabbing the stingray was.

    David: “I trust that you will do the right thing.”

    Ken sits in silence and stabs stingray.

    • I think he specifically was stabbing the stingray near the butt, too. Which, as a 12-year old boy, I giggled at.

    • Purplerockmatt

      he had a real Matt from Amazon look in his eye as he did that too

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Is David chewing spit? What’s up with his cheek?

    • Dezbot

      He’s secretly a chipmunk.

  • The kids are fighting. Ken might come out of this smelling like a rose.

    • the sky is falling

      Fuck Ken!

    • Alycia Swift

      It looks like David understands why Ken did it.

    • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

      It’s interesting that no one is asking Ken questions anymore.

      EDIT: never mind, Bret opens with Ken

      • Alycia Swift

        Michele – good question for Adam.

    • I think some of the later questions saved it for Adam, but he did not look good in the first half. We’ll see though – I still thought Aubry was a favorite coming out of the Kaoh Rong FTC, so I’m preparing for the worst.

      • What hurt Aubry is that the harcore pro-Michele jurors got to end the FTC.

        • Prom King

          Not to mention being in Ponderosa.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        I feel like Chris, Bret, and Jay are locked in for Adam. I don’t remember if those instincts were right in KR, but that’s a big lead for Ken or Hannah to overcome. I think all three will get at least one vote.

        • I think he also has Will. I wonder if we’ll get our first non-majority winner.

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            What are you talking about, Adam’s a white male /s

          • Pretty sure it was only a sweep because I said this 4 minutes before the votes were read.

        • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

          Never mind, it was a sweep. Didn’t see that coming.

          • Alycia Swift

            Did not either. That’s what’s disappointing.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Zeke is barefoot.

  • Alycia Swift

    Adam might be blowing this. He is throwing both the others under the bus.

    • the sky is falling

      Yeah he is Amandaing this tc

  • Alycia Swift

    Wow – This is a bitter jury.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    This Final Tribal was so messy, but Chris and Ken saved it. I’m happy now

    • Alycia Swift

      Ken should have said that Adam never came to him.

      • Yep, he fumbled there and Adam picked up the ball.

        • Best bit is Adam didn’t even need to lie about it – he just sat there and nodded solemnly.

  • Purple Tentacle

    Maybe I’m being judgmental, but I think it’s kind of gross for Adam to bring this up.

    • Hornacek

      I would have much rather if Jay brought it up, but he never would have without Adam’s approval to do so.

      • Dezbot

        Jay was the one who told him he didn’t have to talk about it if he didn’t want to, and Adam was quiet. I found it interesting that it was David who got him to finally open up.

    • indescribable hat

      What, gross for him not to pretend he’s not going through something deeply upsetting? I get that you probably mean it seems like he’s using it to win, but when bad shit is happening to you I find it’s sometimes considered impolite to talk about it and I’m kind of touchy about that. He’s been carrying this around without telling most of the cast for 39 days, and he’s in a lot of genuine pain, and sure, not telling then and telling now is the best strategic choice, but it’s not dishonest, and I don’t think it’s out of bounds. If he’s going to play Survivor right now at all I don’t have any problem with him being honest about his life when he chooses to open up. Life is shitty and messy and hard, and I know we don’t usually have to look at pain like this in our Survivor finale, but I don’t think there’s any obligation to “play fair” or something by concealing your genuine suffering.

      • Purple Tentacle

        It’s not about it being “impolite”, it’s about using it to win in the FTC.

        He didn’t tell his castmates because he knew it would hurt him before the FTC and he mentioned it at FTC because he knew it would help him. I’m sure his suffering is genuine, but I’m also sure keeping it a secret and revealing it were strategic and there will always be something about that that’s gross to me.

        I’m not always crazy about when players bring sympathy into FTC – not even Jeremy bringing up his unborn kid, but at least he wasn’t using someone else’s disease in that case.

        You can think whatever you want and I can think whatever I want.

        • indescribable hat

          OK, I think I see it as using his own experience of grief and fear and whatnot, not as using something he doesn’t have a right to, if that makes sense. I also think it takes a lot of self control not to break down about it here at the end of the game, when it can’t get him voted out anymore and all emotions have gotta be turned up pretty high.

          I also tend to hold juries responsible for what arguments work. If they’re open to taking your life outside the game into account, why leave it on the table?

          Clearly this pushed buttons for you that it didn’t for me. I basically thought Adam had a really tough task keeping this a secret so he wouldn’t be voted out for it but still connecting genuinely with people, and I see talking about it at FTC not as telling a sob story so much as baring his soul a little. Baring your soul a little at FTC is good strategy, no question, but not one I think is unusual or that bothers me. For Adam, though, his situation meant that getting honest and opening up meant talking about his mom’s illness.

          I think what upset me, and I know I didn’t explain this at all, is the idea that Adam would be subject to more restrictions on how he plays because he’s going through something in real life. My inclination is to grant him more leeway.

          • Purple Tentacle

            I wouldn’t. I would have likely changed my vote to someone else on principle.

            Oddly, I’m more OK with Johnny Fairplay style lying because there’s no one suffering on the other end.

            Part of what I dislike about Adam’s situation is that losing a parent is something literally almost everyone goes through and those that don’t have bigger issues (dying early, abandonment, etc). There was nothing unique about his situation except that he chose to go on a gameshow during it. And then he wants sympathy for playing a game while going through a tough time? No fucking dice for me. He chose Survivor over being with his mom in her final weeks and while I won’t fault him for his decision, I won’t give him props for it either.

  • the sky is falling

    There we go, ugh, congrats Adam. Ugh, I am going to hell

    • the sky is falling

      Tbh, I feel compassion for him losing his mom, but seems so calculated in terms of survivor

      • Purple Tentacle

        Agreed.

        Though, to be fair, if I were dying and I had a relative going on a game show, I’d tell them to milk my disease for all it’s worth.

      • Equally calculated: the producers instructing David to start with Hannah and leave Adam until last. That was not an accident.

        • sharculese

          Or David just went left to right.

        • andythesaint

          Love the cynicism.

          (Love this bit about loving the cynicism. I hope it never dies).

      • Alycia Swift

        Feel the same. Would have liked Jay to bring it up. But it was good that he did not as well.

        Jay really grew on me.

      • gouis

        Give me a break. He HAS to say it.

        • the sky is falling

          Ok, you are right, I am just bitter about David. Of that final 3 Adam was obvious the winner

          • gouis

            David was a great player. Goes out right before the final like many great players (Rob C., Cirie, etc)

          • David was a great player who the others were entirely right to vote out, and the spectacularly bad play that would have had to occur to have delivered him the win would have lessened the season for me.

      • He knows it helps him in front of the jury, but it’s always on his mind. Not bringing it up would’ve been a dishonest answer to David’s question.

        • Baulderstone

          I feel what makes it dishonest is to hide it for the whole game and then reveal it to the jury. He wasn’t just being honest. He was using it calculatedly.

          • gouis

            JFC it’s Survivor.

          • Baulderstone

            Yeah, and I’m just giving my opinion.

          • sharculese

            Literally nobody said this about Jeremy, who spent the whole game talking about how he wasn’t telling people Val was pregnant.

          • Baulderstone

            Maybe I didn’t, but I certainly thought it. I just don’t like it when things from outside the game get brought in front of the jury. I realize I am probably a cold-hearted bastard for it.

          • sharculese

            I don’t care because I don’t think they matter.

          • Baulderstone

            Fair enough. It’s not something I get heavily worked up about.

          • Thirty-five Sandcastles

            I kinda sorta feel you there. But I’m more like “I don’t give a damn about your [non game drama], but feel free to try to your sympathy play as it may work on others.”

          • corndogshuffle

            That’s not true. But I do think it’s stupid to say this about Adam.

          • Purple Tentacle

            I didn’t like Jeremy’s ploy either (I’d rather vote on strategy), but using something joyful as a ploy is a bit different than using something traumatic.

          • Thirty-five Sandcastles

            Isn’t “calculating” the recommended way to play games involving strategy?

          • indescribable hat

            Is it calculated in a different or worse way from every other thing people do or say in this game? I think this is one more moment of genuine human connection that of course influences how people feel about you and therefore how they treat you in the game. I think it puts people off because it was so raw, but that’s Adam’s reality right now.

    • Kent McK

      They did include him saying “even if I don’t win,” so… And Ken was getting the triumphant music while talking about his daughter. Though I hope you’re right.

  • Did Will ask a jury question?

    • He told Ken he was great or something.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        It was kinda a back handed compliment. He said he respected the vote out of David more than the previous 38 days. Considering only an idiot would keep Dave, it doesn’t say much of Ken’s game.

        • I choose to read it as Ken is beautiful and he respected his butt.

        • prettyboyprobst

          Agreed, but I still feel like Ken needed the affirmation in that moment (probably not what Will intended) and I honestly feel much better about David losing considering he didn’t vote for Ken despite the fact his vote-out should have been a no-brainer and not come as surprise to him.

          Zeke’s FTC argument doesn’t hold any water either imho, Ken (and Hannah) were not crazy to hold on to that loyal voting alliance among all the trust-clusters (yes, I’m of the opinion they are actually a thing, but also just a word and you probably should not base your jury vote solely on who did advance survivor-gameplay the most anyways) for as long as they could and needed to.

    • corndogshuffle

      I’m sure he said something, but I don’t remember it. Feels about right.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    I hope no one mentions the dragon Michelle is wearing on her shoulder

    • prettyboyprobst

      We dodged a bullet there. I was bracing myself when Probst went to her late.

  • Purple Tentacle

    Ugh, Adam does not deserve a sweep.

    • sharculese

      I went into this finale thinking “anyone can win this except Hannah or Ken.” So … against them, maybe he does?

      • corndogshuffle

        Unfortunately I have to agree. Adam is insanely “meh” for me but Ken and Hannah are something beyond that. So, it’s hard to hate on Adam as much as I’d rather have seen two or three other people win ahead of Adam.

      • andythesaint

        Any of the other four finalists would’ve won against them. I think it’s possible anybody post-merge would’ve won against them (including Sunday and Will).

        • sharculese

          My roommate was very bullish on Hannah during FTC and I started to wonder if I was missing something.

          Then they didnt show anyones vote and i knew it was Adam.

          • indescribable hat

            I liked her a little more this episode. I have a sense that if she could explain herself a little more clearly and confidently she might look much better, but I also second-guess that sense.

  • Damn. Did not see unanimous coming at all.

  • corndogshuffle

    Well, at least he had a more compelling story than Michele.

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Adam, Cochran, J.T., Jeremy, Earl. I see two types of players.

    • gouis

      You know there are more than 4 winners right? And some are even women.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        I’m sorry, I’m in a Cook Island mindset.

        No, these are the four winners who the jury unanimously voted for. Two had decent games but were helped immensely by sloppy tribals. Two had actually transcendent games.

        • gouis

          Good point. Sorry for being snarky.

    • jersey_luck

      You forgot JT from Tocantins.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        That I did. It’s fixed now.

  • gouis

    Top 10 season seems certain. Top 5?

    • the sky is falling

      No way top 5, top 15, ok

      • Alycia Swift

        Top 10 for me. I am still smiling. I do feel bad that it was a clean sweep though.

        • the sky is falling

          Different strokes, I’m as annoyed about this one as first Russel Hantz run

    • Kent McK

      Yeah, it is for sure a top five season for me. Cagayan, Heroes vs. Villains, Pearl Islands, Millennials vs. Gen X, Amazon.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        I still put Cambodia over this season

        • I don’t know about that.

          • Diego Armando

            Cambodia was better.

          • Incorrect.

          • corndogshuffle

            So, how many seasons are worse than Cambodia for you? I gots ta know!

          • Other Scott

            Barb, I’m pretty much of the same opinion about you as Cambodia.

            Cambodia was better.

          • No…No

          • Diego Armando

            I stand by my statement. I will say that we all have our season that everyone seems to love, but we don’t. Mine is China, Andy’s is Micronesia, Prom King’s is Amazon, etc.

          • corndogshuffle

            As someone who stands with Andy where Micronesia is concerned, I totally get it.

      • the sky is falling

        Amazon over this one, easily

    • corndogshuffle

      I was willing to put it in the top ten depending on winner, but as a player (not a human) Adam leaves me cold. Knee jerk reaction, it’s somewhere around #12-14 for me.

      • gouis

        He was wonderfully erratic.

        • corndogshuffle

          Unfortunately I don’t tend to like that sort of winner. But Adam is tearing me up right now with his story.

          • Purple Tentacle

            I guess I’m cynical, but the “She died an hour after I got home” kind of set off BS alarms for me. I don’t know. I might just be a dick.

          • gouis

            ???????????????????????

          • corndogshuffle

            Adam doesn’t gain anything by lying about this. I don’t see the BS alert. Maybe it wasn’t a literal hour, but that’s not much BS to be honest.

          • She died 2 days after the final trial council, so I don’t think it’s bullshit.

          • sharculese

            She straight up did. We’ve known for a while she died two days after the game ended.

          • Prom King

            Ugh.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Yeahhh, you might just be a dick.

          • I’m fine with cynicism and people having opinions on players based on what little of them that we see on the show, but this is the guy’s real life. It isn’t a Jonny Fairplay situation- Adam’s mother actually did have cancer, and she actually did die shortly after he got home.

            Let’s not split hairs about how well the guy that just lost the woman that brought him into this world was measuring time during her final days. Feel free to criticize Adam’s play, but let’s not attack his grief as being anything less than genuine.

          • Purple Tentacle

            This is pretty self righteous. I’m not attacking his grief. It’s obviously 100% genuine.

            I’m questioning the details that he’s volunteering and wondering if he’s perhaps exaggerating certain aspects, such as the timing, to make it a better story. We have already seen him use his mom’s illness as part of his narrative and it seems like that’s something that’s built into millennials in the era of reality tv.

            You can go ahead and think I’m an awful person for wondering, whatever.

          • My point is that the details are fairly insignificant. Does it matter if his mom died 48 hours after he got back or two weeks after he got back? I’m just wondering what benefit you think he gets from that. Empathy from the audience?

            And what makes you question the details? Just random speculation?

          • Purple Tentacle

            My point is that the details are fairly insignificant.

            And my questioning them is also fairly insignificant.

            Does it matter if his mom died 48 hours after he got back or two weeks after he got back?

            He said an hour. I thought it seemed unlikely. Why do you care?

            I’m just wondering what benefit you think he gets from that.

            He gets the benefit of self mythologizing and a better narrative? Same as everyone else who has stretched the truth or ever told a meaningless lie?

            And what makes you question the details? Just random speculation?

            Yes. It seemed unlikely. I don’t see anything wrong with hearing an unlikely story and thinking “I’m not sure I’m buying this 100%.” Of course, if that sets me at odds with you and the community, so be it.

          • I’m not trying to make you feel attacked here. And the answer to “Why do you care?” is that I like to actively engage with the commenters here and make sure I understand them and their arguments. And I’m glad you clarified what you’d said previously.

            I strongly disagree that Adam had any interest in making a “better narrative” for himself, though.

          • Purple Tentacle

            Sorry, I don’t always respond well when I feel like I’m being tsk tsked, especially when I’m doing something I feel like everyone should do, such as not take everyone at their word.

            I would argue that anyone going on a reality show, especially someone who grew up on reality tv, is heavily invested in making a better narrative for themselves.

            Adam had already turned me off using his mom’s illness to win a game show, so while I don’t doubt his grief is real, the false-sounding details soured me a bit further.

      • Purple Tentacle

        Weird, I hated this season. I guess I finished it, which is more than I can say for some seasons.

        • gouis

          ?????????????????????????????????

          • Purple Tentacle

            I hated the theme, I didn’t care most of the players, the first 3/4ths of the season seemed like such a clusterfuck of non-strategy to me.

      • Baulderstone

        Yeah, I am not upset that Adam won, but he played badly so many times it is hard to feel it was a great ending to the season.

        • corndogshuffle

          Agree 100%. It’s not like I’m unhappy that Adam won or that I think he didn’t earn it. It’s just very “blah” for me. Hard to hate on someone with his story winning the game, but that doesn’t make what he did in the game any less mediocre (far worse at times) on average.

          • Alycia Swift

            I look at it this way – it is hard – but he did way more than OWM.

          • corndogshuffle

            Fact. And he had something that OWM really didn’t have – two obvious goats as FTC opponents. It’s easy to come to peace with Adam beating Ken/Hannah. Michele over Aubry, not so much.

          • I at least feel that Adam was erratic at times, but he was a dynamic player who was always trying things, even if those things were bad ideas. He ultimately was an asset to the season even if he wasn’t its best player.

          • corndogshuffle

            Agree. I’m pretty disappointed that David didn’t win and if David didn’t win I wanted Jay. And it looked really good for David about halfway through the finale. But I know it’s partly bitterness for me. This season was better for Adam being there.

          • Ms_Woozah

            This.

          • Diego Armando

            I think some of his erraticness was due to his grief. I wonder if ADAM without a dying mom would play better. I do respect that he actually was able to recover from mistakes and correct his behaviors.

    • jersey_luck

      This is very middle tier Survivor for me. The back half was will put in the top half but the Gen X tribe as a whole were boring and dull, the fact that there was that the women did awful, the season lacked a villain and I don’t really feel the winner

      • the sky is falling

        This is true, looking back its gonna fall in rankings, emotions are always heightened on finale night

      • Baulderstone

        I actually liked the lack of villain.

        • Ms_Woozah

          Agreed. The “villains” lately have actually just been straight-up despicable people, and it was super refreshing to have a more easy-going cast where everyone respected one another.

          • Baulderstone

            Yeah. Villains are typically either straight-up awful people, as you say, or they are isolated people actually playing the game in a season where nobody else is.

            There were a number of people here who could have been handed that second kind of villain edit in a season where they were surrounded by goats and models. Instead, we had a lot of active players all going at once and largely respecting each others game.

        • Prom King

          Definitely. Instead we got complex characters like Zeke and Jay who had villainous moments that were only small parts of who they were.

      • sharculese

        Yup, sticking by saying this is a weird, messy season. It’s not terrible or offensive, but it’s jittery.

        • corndogshuffle

          Do you think putting it mid tier (granted, I have it upper mid tier) speaks to what you’re saying? Or do you have it more lower mid tier or even third tier (I’m calling tiers as being 11 seasons since 11 is one third now).

          • sharculese

            It’s high teens.

          • corndogshuffle

            We feel pretty similarly about it then, I just have slightly different quibbles than you which make me put it 3-5 seasons higher. It’s a flawed season, but I’m glad I got to watch it.

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            So this season is equivalent to Will. Got it.

          • Diego Armando

            It would be in the 9-15 range for me. It will take some time to fairly evaluate it. I feel it had a more satisfactory ending than some seasons (Amazon cough cough) in that range, but the theme definitely got obnoxious at times.

        • andythesaint

          It took the shape of its winner, then.

          • sharculese

            Scroll down. I sajd as much last night.

          • andythesaint

            Dude. I may never get through all these comments.

          • sharculese

            Good thing I have no problem with quoting myself:

            I feel like this finale really cobbled together why this season has felt baggy and shapeless to me: it’s the story of a guy who kept taking his shot and missing, but then did just enough to make sure it didn’t blow back on him. That’s a story, but it’s not the most compelling one in the world.

            I’m a lot less upset with the Adam win than other people seem to be, but I’m not revisiting this season any time soon.

    • corndogshuffle

      I definitely have Borneo, The Amazon, Pearl Islands, Palau, China, Tocantins, Heroes vs. Villains, Philippines, Cagayan, and Cambodia above this season. I’d put this in the group with Blood vs. Water, Cook Islands, Panama, and Kaoh Rong. So somewhere between 11-15.

      • Right now I have it between China and Tocantins, which puts it 7th out of the 21 seasons I’ve seen. I’m sure a lot of that is recency, but it’s easily top half for me.

        • corndogshuffle

          Those are two of my top four. Especially depending on what you haven’t seen I think a ranking of 7/21 is very defensible.

          • The big ones that I haven’t seen are probably Amazon, Pearl Islands, and Palau.

          • corndogshuffle

            That’s #3, #6, and #10 in my rankings. Depending on what you like I could easily see MvX staying at #7 or falling to #10.

          • Diego Armando

            Paula is fighting for a spot in my Top 5. Pearl Islands is really good. Amazon is good, but has some definite flaws.

    • I currently have it as 6th out of the sixteen seasons I have seen, but I am currently watching Cagayan so it was surely drop to 7.

    • Diego Armando

      A Top 10 possibility. I have enough trouble figuring out which to put in my Top 5 anyway, so no to part 2 (The stupid theme and fitting, but flawed winner hold it out)

    • Ms_Woozah

      I loved it. I still think Cambodia was more fun overall, but I loved this cast and their level of gameplay. Winner definitely better than last season.

      • Dezbot

        I highly enjoyed this season, and I was rooting for Adam for a long time, possibly more than David (but honestly, only rooting this hard after my faves, Michaela and Zeke, were out). I’m happy he won and I didn’t even mind the landslide vote for him, either.

    • Other Scott

      This season simply didn’t work for me that well. It’s hard to explain aside from the overall story kind of sucked.

    • prettyboyprobst

      My gut says…
      *goes to the bathroom
      *washes hands
      *continues typing
      …to top ten and possibly even better.

    • Prom King

      For me, in the top half of seasons but definitely not top 10.

  • Kent McK

    Wow. So happy for Adam. That was awesome. I totally got blindsided.

    • gouis

      Same.

  • I guess the best move of the season was Adam not telling everyone about his mom until he made it to FTC. Kept David and Jay as the “jury threat” shields, where that news would have put him. Busted it out once he was at home plate.

  • Alycia Swift

    Half the players are crying. Zeke is sort of stone-faced.

  • the sky is falling

    Possible cast spoilers I’m confused why Jay isn’t coming back, perhaps not interested in doing back to back

    • gouis

      Might have not wanted to bring back anyone in the finale. The same could be said for David.

      • Kent McK

        I was just thinking the same thing. How the hell is David not on next season? He turn it down?

        • gouis

          He has a good job and maybe didn’t want to come back right away. If you ask any returnees they almost all wish they waited longer.

          • the sky is falling

            Except Russell

          • Kent McK

            I am hoping for Season 36: David vs. Tony

          • the sky is falling

            Oh my god, no, they need to be allies

          • Purple Rock Emma

            He also was soooo skinny by the end. Might have turned it down for health, like Sandra for All Stars/Courtney for Micronesia.

        • the sky is falling

          Agreed, whatever you think of Dave and Jay, they were more interesting than two who got in

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            I was going to say that having Michaela and Zeke instead of Jay and David keeps the gender ratio balanced, but they could have easily put Michael in over Hali or Sierra. So I don’t know.

          • Alycia Swift

            Even Jessica would have been a better choice than the two they had.

          • andythesaint

            Jay apparently was an alternate for Koah Rong, and headed to Cambodia and everything. So that’s a lot of time to give to Survivor in one year.

            Also, they might’ve had to lock down the two returnees earlier than Jay exiting the game.

        • Something Quirky

          I feel like his story arc is completed, though. The only reason to bring him back would be to see how he starts off when he’s not terrified of things, but then whoever else from this season would have just said how much of a threat he was.

      • the sky is falling

        Sounds legit,

    • jersey_luck

      Honestly Jay fills the Ozzy and Malcolm slot and more people know and like those two.

      • the sky is falling

        Ok, makes sense, but Jay is better than both those guys, I have never smiled more at a guys exit

        • Kent McK

          Malcolm is great. But yeah, Ozzy is a dick and I hope he does terribly.

          • gouis

            I wouldn’t worry too much about that. It’s a certainty.

          • the sky is falling

            I doubt Ozzie makes merge

      • I hate that that’s become a casting type. Jay and Malcolm are objectively good players, in a way that Ozzy and, say, Joe are not.

    • Ms_Woozah

      I feel they might be saving him for a new Second Chances season, or a FvF

  • Hornacek

    Random thoughts (finale):

    Just start the show, Jeff!

    I forgot that David and Ken were sitting next to each other on the boat on day one. Foreshadowing!

    I thought from last week’s preview that David was making a fake idol for himself, but this is so much better! Please, someone find it!

    And so the legacy advantage gives Ken immunity when he didn’t actually need it. Yawn.

    You know they added this steak reward just so the reward-steal would be used. If Jay hadn’t used it production would have run in and said “Jay, this is the last reward challenge. Isn’t there something you want to do now?”

    David’s pre-season puzzle practicing FINALLY pays off! Well, with some help from Jay.

    I think Jay did David a favor by stealing that reward.

    Poor Ken – he’s sure no one has snuck off under his nose to find an idol, but not only did that happen, someone else snuck off to make that idol!

    Jay finding out the idol is fake is like watching Charlie Brown try to kick the football.

    Ken reveals what the legacy advantage is. Jessica nearly faints.

    Everyone is all smiles and friendly when Jay leaves. I love this final six!

    I don’t know whether to laugh or say “Shut up Jeff!” after seeing what the word scramble is.

    Ken decides to let Jeff know that the Survivors are indeed ready.

    Ken redeems last week’s bad spelling.

    Poor Adam – plays 2 idols and neither of them were effective.

    I love when player A says that player B made a bad decision but what they really mean is that they made a bad decision for player A.

    Adam is in the lead! Adam loses everything and must start over! This is Adam’s entire game condensed into one challenge.

    A tie at the final immunity. Survivor first?

    “Ken seconds left!”

    Ken says Adam and David would “fight like men” at a fire-making challenge – the least expected manly-men battle of the season..

    Well now I guess Adam wins?

    I miss the opening statements. Maybe if we didn’t have 10 jurors to get through? Just saying.

    Does Ken just have to sit back and let Hannah and Adam bicker amongst themselves?

    Hannah seemed to own Adam in their back-and-forths, but is the jury gonna vote against a guy with a dying mother?

    This episode is too long. Short reunion!

    What the hell happened to Will’s hair???

    Adam wins unanimously. I don’t know, I guess it’s ok? Who’s gonna vote against a guy when the last thing they hear before voting is “My mother has cancer”?

    • the sky is falling

      Yeah, gotta be a real asshole to not vote for Adam there

    • No opening statements started with Worlds Apart, which had 8 jurors.

      • Hornacek

        Yeah, when I noticed they didn’t do them I thought “Oh yeah, that’s been a thing for a few seasons.” But I still wish they did them.

        • Me too. When it happens in Worlds Apart, I said that it is an opportunity for the finalists to frame their narrative. Instead, they usually give the finalist who probably didn’t have a question to ask them what is their narrative.

  • gouis

    If you think Michelle’s dragon thing is cute/fun just remember that she likes dragons because she believes they’re the same as dinosaurs because she’s a creationist and thinks the earth is 6,000 years old.

    • Maybe she went to the creationist museum like the Duggars did early on. Yes, I have watched more Duggar programming than Breaking Bad. When I was younger, I had weird cultural priorities.

    • Alycia Swift

      What she had, you can buy at any ren faire.

    • prettyboyprobst

      I don’t, but I think Michelle is cute, so I’m willing to act as if that thing on her dress and everything about why it was there didn’t happen.

    • Diego Armando

      Not great, but there are so many more toxic things to believe in that a love of dragons is refreshingly quaint.

      • gouis

        I work in science research and education. Creationism is not “quaint”. It’s the type of thinking that caused this election.

    • Max_Jets

      Still cute, still fun, Michelle has my heart and she’s never letting go.

    • Hornacek

      Come on, Marco Polo saw them in China!

    • I prefer to think it’s because Michelle has listened to all the podcasts and heard everyone mocking her over that, and decided to troll us.

  • Black Dynamite

    Hannah Final Reflection: She is a flawed player but she was such a fun character to watch. The rise of Hannah is complete, Hannah Forever! We were all witnesses.

    • the sky is falling

      Isn’t Hannah just a weak imitation of Aubrey though? edit: a more annoying Aubrey.

      • Could Aubrey flirt with Ken like THAT? I think not.

        • Purple Tentacle

          Aubrey flirted hardcore with Nick.

          So yes.

          Though I’m not sure she would have since Ken seems kind of dim.

          • gouis

            Nick isn’t anywhere near Ken’s league. They’re in different multiverses.

          • Purple Tentacle

            I disagree. Nick is handsome, particularly with a beard that covers up his weird mouth area.

          • Wow, I don’t remember that at all. But, hey, good call.

          • Alycia Swift

            We did not see much flirting from Aubrey with Nick and Nick was out just after the merge.

      • Black Dynamite

        No, they may fill the same archetype for Survivor but Hannah is different from Aubry and amazing in her own way.

      • the sky is falling

        She is like the worst qualities of Shirin and Aubrey combined

        • gouis

          WOW shots fired

          • the sky is falling

            I was out at “panic attack while sitting out of challenge ” *shrug*

        • Roswulf

          So…like 95% Shirin?

          *Waits to be banned from the site*

          • You’re dead to me.

      • corndogshuffle

        As a player I think she is a weak imitation. As a character, I think Hannah pops a lot better.

        • Max_Jets

          Hannah was great, but Aubs did have some killer confessionals.

          • prettyboyprobst

            Other than her stealthy presence as a challenge beast, her
            confessionals and abilty to make sense with words were by far her
            strongest suit in my opinion. She would make an amazing public speaker
            (or could have made for a promising poitician in a pre-post-factual
            world), but I actually like Hannah better in most other ways, most
            importantly both as a player (maybe there is some recency bias, but at
            least as good. Both were playing really hard, harder than the respective juries could stomach) and a character.

          • Max_Jets

            I wrote more than I thought I was going to, but here are the reasons I think Aubry is the better player (my personal bias excluded):

            They both have similar strengths and weaknesses in that they are perceptive of their surroundings but give off a weak image to their competition, but I think Aubry’s flaws are smaller and strengths are greater. Aubry really had her finger on the pulse of the game. We saw confessional after confessional of Aubry knowing exactly what the dynamics were and what she needed to do. Hannah was similar, perhaps less articulate, but we at least didn’t get AS much support for how perceptive she was. Part of this is likely editing, but we also see multiple examples where Hannah is completely thrown off by what is going on (Michelle telling her to vote for Mari, Michaela vote), while Aubry is rarely caught off guard. I’m curious what Hannah says in her exit interviews about how she thought her chances against Adam were before going into FTC, since we know that Aubry saw Michele as a threat in the finals. I could see it going either way.

            Another problem they both have is putting their enemies at ease. We see this for Aubry in the episode where Peter is voted off. I don’t remember exactly how it goes down, but some combination of Scot/Tai/Julia approach Aubry with their plan and Aubry does absolutely nothing to reassure them. She is difficult for her enemies to read which makes them not trust her. The Hannah equivalent would be her conversation with Zeke before the rock draw, which I would say is significantly worse.

            The main reason I would put Aubry over Hannah is because of her one really great move (flipping Tai and excluding Michele and Julia from the Scot vote), which I think is one of the greatest moves in modern Survivor.

            Hopefully that was articulate, but I’m not exactly Aubry.

          • prettyboyprobst

            I like it, gives me a chance to answer with a shorter response for once.

            You certainly made a valid case for Aubry over Hannah and also pointed out some similiarities I didn’t notice before. I can’t say that I’m even close to remembering everything of how KR unfolded, so there could be some great Aubry stuff that I left out when making that judgement.

            But to play Hannah’s advocate a little longer: Her meltdown in the should-be conversation with Zeke was pretty much indefensible from the looks of it. On top of that, most (in Hannah’s case all) of their victims proved rather unforgiving when it came to casting the final votes, but I think they both kept a relationship with them that was good enough to have a somewhat reasonable hope that they could still gain some votes from these people in a FTC.
            I didn’t expect many Hannah-votes because of the exit interviews, but I can see how Hannah might have thought she could have a shot. Hannah seemed more well-liked where Aubry was more respected by her peers, but it’s possible that Hannah thought she deserves more respect too and I would concur. David’s early insecurities seemed to be a plus in many of the juror’s books, whereas Hannah didn’t seem to get any credit for transforming her game over time. And neither of them engaged in Russel-Hantz levels of burning the opposition is what I’m saying.

            Aubry’s vote change was much worse than Hannah’s indecision on the Mari vote (which was their first tribal and she was perceptive enough to trust her gut, that what Michelle was whispering would actually benefit her, which it did) and I don’t think we can fault her too much for being left out of the Michaela-vote. She rebounded very well from that and to me that was more of a result of more active (some might say overplaying) competition.

            The more stable game (oh, I just realized I’m going even longer – sorry!) is also what, I imagine, made it easier for Aubry to keep her finger on the pulse, although as part of the season she probably played a part in making it so.
            Hannah otoh played in a season where people had generally good working relationships with each other, but where there often was no telling who would vote with whom this week or the next. Except for a few exceptions, and Hannah got an in with the biggest trust cluster, that also proved to be most loyal, even though none of them knew her pre-merge. That gave her a base of four (pretty soon only three) votes to work with and act on their plans while still keeping a tight relationship with Adam to scrape together majorities each tribal. Not to mention the shield that being in an alliance with David and Ken provides.

            Finally I really want to adress the Tai-thing. I have said before that I was thoroughly impressed at what Aubry was able to do as Tai whisperer, and I give her more credit for managing him throughout the post-merge than for getting him on her side (both were crucial), but here’s the problem I have with Tai as the big point in Aubry’s favor: First of all, there is only one Tai and I was never under the impression what she did with Tai would work with anyone else and she was lucky to have had such a weird combination of principled but moldable player at her disposal. But more importantly second of all, and I was waiting for an opportunity to repeat myself here, I remain convinced that she was gifted Tai’s vote for her great move and the remainder of the game as a result of the language-barrier. Scot and Jason never understood (although they probably did by now) why Tai flipped on them because they didn’t realize Tai wanted them to actually entertain the idea of working with Aubry (which of course was not what AUbry suggested). That would have been a crazy and inplausible thing to do for the three of them, so they (in my mind) appropriately took it as Tai telling his alliance-buddies “hey, you won’t even believe what Aubry just said to me! She must think I’m stupid…”), to which they reply by having his back (“Let’s get her off instead!”), at which point Tai didn’t dare to speak out again because he probably didn’t know wtf just happened.

            One can debate whether it’s fair to deduct points for making the most of her circumstances, but I think it’s necessary here, as they were so unique and without Tai flipping, I don’t think we would even be talking about her. (But I’m aware I brought her up)

          • Max_Jets

            I agree that Aubry’s vote for Peter was worse than Hannah taking her time on the Mari vote and that is a good point. But my point was more that Hannah still seemed completely oblivious that there was a counter alliance against Mari. Not too damning for Hannah, as her allies were also unaware, but comparing it to Aubry’s awareness – in on the Liz vote, in on the Peter vote, knows she’s in danger at the merge vote, in on the remainder of the votes, knows when Julia is flipping – there isn’t much contest. Perhaps that has to do with the difference in the seasons. It’s always hard to tell with these things.

            That’s a good point about Tai too, but Aubry still knew how to talk to him in a way that Scot and Jason did not which is to her credit. Language barrier or not, moldable (this keeps correcting to Mom table…) or not, Tai’s vote was up for grabs from anyone and he went with Aubry because he adored her. & you’re right, her getting Tai to stay loyal after not voting with him at final 6 might be her most impressive move. There was no Tai around for Hannah though, which I guess is your point. I still haven’t seen evidence that Hannah can do anything that impressive, but she did build some good alliances.

            Thinking back on it, I do think Hannah played a very strong game. The editors probably learned their lesson with the Aubry/Michele situation, but after her final tribal performance I’m sure there are some good Hannah confessionals we missed out on with her explaining her game. I think I might have voted for her at FTC. She probably lost when Will was voted out though. I understand why Hannah would think she had a chance against Adam, but if she couldn’t get one vote from that amazing performance she probably never did.

          • prettyboyprobst

            1.) What’s a mom table? Is that where babies get their diapers changed? Is it even a word?
            [in my mommy-tongue that’s (what would translate to) wrapping table]

            2.) At the rate I forget about about stuff I watched, I really shouldn’t engage in deep-dive cross season comparisons, even if it is the two latest ones we’re talking about.
            Having said that, Aubry always being aware of what’s going on is certainly impressive, Hannah’s game probably just “spoke to me” more because she had not nearly the fan-support despite doing really good, so my subconscious mind tells me to pick up the slack.
            But my final point about Tai was really that Aubry had one, not that Hannah didn’t. Nobody should be allowed a Tai! 😉

            3.) I don’t even know who would have gotten my vote out of those three. I like Adam and am a sucker for his sad story, I think Ken played a really strong game and that Hannah was severely underrated.
            There were some online confessionals that shed a light on her game in the lead-up to the finale (still haven’t seen any of the new material like “jury speaks” etc.), but like for everyone the strategic content is few and far between in these.
            I think you’re right that her winning chances were d.o.a. at final tribal and I loved that she stood up for herself and her game, but there has to be a better way to paint a convincing picture of her game for the jury. I get why she couldn’t let some of the remarks by Adam and jurors slide, she had to intervene there, but being that combative also didn’t seem to help. I know I would have trouble to stick to my talking points and keep a cool head during a sitaution like this FTC, and to no one’s surprise that seemed hard for Hannah, too. (I also still need to rewatch the finale, I hope I’m not too harsh here)

            I only wish the jurors weren’t as busy patting themselves on their backs for not being bitter at all and thought more about the games of the finalists from their respective perspectives. Some turns of Hannah’s path through the game made her gameplay appear
            even bolder and more masterful than Aubry’s to me (see memory-warning & underdog-disclaimer under 2nd) and I wish some jurors would have taken the time and brainpower to see what she (or Ken) was trying to accomplish.

            Instead they seemed to reduce the game they were watching to “Vote out David” and judged fittingly to the season’s theme, rewarding trying rather than achieving.

          • Max_Jets

            That’s alright, my memory is pretty bad too. I don’t even remember what I’ve said in this discussion! Some of the stuff Hannah was saying (needing to split up Bret and Sunday, making sure she still had Ken as an ally) made so much sense, but without that explanation it made her look kinda dumb for most of the game. It’s hard for the jury to change their minds about that in a few minutes. Probst said there would be some change to the jury next season (I’m wondering if there will be more of a round table discussion/deliberation that gives them more time to make a decision). I wonder if whatever it is will help change the jury’s perception of players like Hannah.

          • HBO CEO of Tits

            Also, Aubry got votes.

          • corndogshuffle

            Aubry was way better at talking about the game, which I think speaks to her status as a superior player. I probably undesold Aubry to make my point about Hannah.

    • Diego Armando

      I think Hannah works best when in small doses. That way we can get the quirk and not have to suffer through her crappy gameplay,

    • prettyboyprobst

      You’re probably the right person to ask: Were Hannah’s little twitches* ever discussed around here and I missed it in one of the mammoth-threads?

      (Or what would you call it? Stress reactions, panic hiccups, almost stress-voms, supressed gag reflexes or maybe gastro-oesophageal goofs?)

      Because I wondered where the board would come down on these, as the editors certainly feasted on them (I started to count them in the double episode before thanksgiving and lost count at around twenty with plenty of time to go in the second part). I say it’s cute, but maybe some people were more weirded out by them? Was there a poll at some point? If not, who dropped the ball here?

      • Black Dynamite

        I probably missed it too. I like the term “panic hiccups.” If I ventured a guess, I would say it was probably mixed with more people weirded out. I just took it as part of the total package of Hannah. So I’ll also say cute.

        • prettyboyprobst

          But once you got hiccups, they’re usually reoccuring in pretty regular intervals, right? Which is not what’s happening with Hannah, so maybe “singular panic hiccups”?

          (not my first language, so please don’t hesitate if you can smoothen this )

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    I don’t know why I just checked r/Survivor to see if Adam had a post or comment there. He’s on stage…

  • WOOP WOOP WOOP “A Moment With Michaela” up next WOOP WOOP WOOP

  • Kent McK

    That vest is just so Ken. Vintage baby.

  • the sky is falling

    All I know is survivor finale followed by Star Wars movie next day is a good fucking week.

    • Purple Rock Emma

      I’m just glad I’m seeing Rogue One on Sunday instead of a late-night showing the day it comes out. I was so fucking exhausted last year.

      • Dezbot

        It’s playing here at 7 p.m., though I’m going to the 7:30 p.m. showing. Still hard on a day when I had to be up at 4:30 a.m., but better than a midnight showing!

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    Will’s face! Still not getting respect for his moves

    • gouis

      Will sucks.

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        I don’t disagree

  • I feel like this was the best all-around finale in a while. All three of the votes were exciting, and even if it wasn’t a great FTC, there hasn’t been a really good one in the last few years.

    • the sky is falling

      Yeah, FTc was boring, but rest of episode was great. not sure if any ftc can beat Sue Hawk

      • Max_Jets

        Trish in Cagayan and Erik in Samoa are the two that rival it. I’d probably put them both above Sue’s just because they make me tear up.

    • I actually think the FTC was probably one of the better ones in a while. All three came in to fight. What I will be interested in seeing is how set in the stones those Adam votes were. I have a werid gut feeling that those hardcore with Jay voted for Adam. Based on her reunion answer, I think Jessica was going in voting for Adam (which is weird).

      • sharculese

        Also, everyone asked actual questions.

        • Actually, not quite. Chris did the full David Murphy with Adam.

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            Chris played football, not baseball

          • I don’t get it.

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            I think I’m fine with that. It’s an obscure reference.

          • Black Dynamite

            I got and enjoyed the reference.

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            You’re my kind of people.

          • corndogshuffle

            Is this an attempted Daniel Murphy joke?

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            No it is not

          • prettyboyprobst

            Only a half-Murphy. But that was the moment I liked the least about the FTC, other than that and the Clean sweep it was fine.

          • Remind me: what is the difference?

          • prettyboyprobst

            Proposing at the reunion iirc (but one could try if advocating for a Finalist while doing a kneefall is enough to count, especially for jurors that are already married that’s the only Way)

          • I got it. I couldn’t remember from TEOS.

          • Come On In Here

            To do a full-Murphy he has to propose to someone no one remembers at the reunion show.

          • Alycia Swift

            And unlike Murphy, Chris was wrong in what he said.

          • Yeah, that was extremely weird. Why didn’t Hannah pounce on that question? We were clearly shown that Hannah was the only one to talk to Ken.

        • Dezbot

          Except Sunday’s question, which was clearly fed to her by the producers. 😀

          • Hornacek

            I assume that some jurors can’t come up with a good question so the producers are ready with some options for those jurors.

          • Dezbot

            Or they hated her speaking voice as much as I did and wanted her to speak as little as possible.

          • Hornacek

            Cast of Fargo: How dare you!

  • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

    I applied when I was 19. What does Will have that I don’t?

    • gouis

      A love of Ronald Reagan?

      • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

        I probably don’t drink enough milk

        • gouis

          Your bones aren’t strong enough!

    • Basso profundo.

    • corndogshuffle

      Jesus Christ and Ronald Reagan.

      • DrVanNostrand

        Who are the co-founders of the Republican Party, Alex?

    • Alycia Swift

      Are you religious?

    • A screenshot from that time Probst accidentally Snapchatted his penis.

      • corndogshuffle

        Boy, that escalated quickly.

      • DrVanNostrand

        And you wonder why they seem to hate you and refuse to ever bring back the purple rock. What could the reason possibly be? The mystery may never be solved.

    • Hornacek

      The role of president of the Randy Bailey fan club?

  • sharculese

    Paul looks like fucking Zeus.

    • the sky is falling

      Upvote for sticking with you picks

      • I really admire the commitment.

    • Prom King

      Seeing all of that amazing hair in all of its glory was the first time I enjoyed Paul all season! He’s like the Lion King.

  • gouis

    LOL 2 total minutes talking to women, and half of that was about how Hannah flirted.

  • Alycia Swift

    Wow Sunday is gorgeous – she also kept what she lost off.

    • gouis

      …………..

    • corndogshuffle

      Was about to post this about Jessica but I didn’t want to be the first person to make a comment like that.

      • Alycia Swift

        Her too. Hannah too.

        • corndogshuffle

          To be honest everyone cleaned up good that I saw.

  • These Words

    I was all over the place on this one. Every time something happened that I was hoping for (eg David getting the ax) I then got mad when it actually happened. Then I was hoping Adam wouldn’t bring up his mom but glad when he did. Then I wanted Adam to win but was mad at the unanimous vote. Didn’t want Ken to win but found myself disappointed he didn’t get the million for his daughter. Fuck. I need to quit watching this show. Lol

    • Alycia Swift

      That’s how I feel but I’m still smiling.

  • Alycia Swift

    Wow did not know Chris had a sense of humor.

    • Mike Hirsch

      That was a pretty solid joke, even if his timing was a bit off.

      • Alycia Swift

        Yes. It was.

  • I knew Taylor had a baby, but hearing Jeff call him a father made me realize that, holy shit, this man is responsible for a child. I imagine that’s similar to how I’ll feel on January 20.

    • Taylor procreating at age 22 is how we end up in situations like January 20.

      • DrVanNostrand

        If only people had remembered to wear condoms on voting day!

    • the sky is falling

      Nothing is certain until Monday, cmon electoral college, bring it home

    • Purple Rock Emma

      The guy I was sitting next to and I were like, “uhh, I don’t think I want to applaud this.”

      • I really appreciate how Jeff very clearly hinted at what happened between Taylor and Figgy, since he knew he couldn’t actually say it outright.

        • I think he thought that Figgy would bring it up, especially since she hinted that she would in all of her exit press.

      • Come On In Here

        “I just ran the math, and yeah, I really don’t want to applaud this.”

  • Mike Hirsch

    You guys, this has been one of the better reunion specials in that it hasn’t been ridiculously awful.

    Overall, while Adam wasn’t my favorite this season, he was a worthy enough winner, and the season gave us maximum Ken, so that was great too. I look forward to seeing a few of these people play again.

    • Alycia Swift

      Yes, it was. Most of the cast was talked to.

      Adam was a middle of the road winner. I am still smiling because I like the cast and like the finale but I am disappointed that it was a clean sweep.

    • Roswulf

      I think this might be the best reunion special ever, in that it wasn’t pointless.

      The story of the season was not complete without Adam talking about his homecoming.

  • Purple Tentacle

    God, I fucking hated Malcolm. Fucking ugh.

    • Baulderstone

      Oddly, Adam made me think of Malcolm at times. I realize they aren’t much alike as people. It was just had a tendency to make big plays that fell flat.

      • Purple Tentacle

        That was part of my issue with Malcolm…I thought he was just an awful player but fans seemed to think he was some Survivor god. He never seemed capable of reading the room though.

        I also disliked the golden boy edit, though from what I understand, he has a more mean spirited sense of humor in real life, so I likely would have liked him more if they had portrayed him that way.

        • Dezbot

          Eh, I love my OG Man-Bun. I won’t mind seeing him play again.

    • gouis

      You’ve got a lot of flaming takes today

      • Purple Tentacle

        I’m a loner, Dottie. A rebel.

    • This is fine. Just know that I’m going to change your mind on this.

    • Prom King

      But that’s like saying you hate sunshine.

    • indescribable hat

      I’m reasonably fond of him, but I worry that more of us will join you the more we see of him. (He’s a much, much better Ozzy, but I worry he has some Ozzy-like tendencies.)

  • What was Caleb’s game change? Seeing his life flash before his eyes and coming back from the brink? How many points do you get in fantasy Survivor for that?

    • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

      I’ve heard people who changed the game and people who need to change their games

    • sharculese

      Sierra’s game change was not playing Survivor.

      • Purple Tentacle

        I loved her. She was such a spitfire with her scorched earth policy.

        • gouis

          So you hate Malcolm and love Sierra ‘Game Changer’ Dawn Thomas?

          • Purple Tentacle

            Wait, who is that? I thought were were talking about the girl who voted out her mom.

          • corndogshuffle

            Ohhh, you mean Ciera. Not to be confused with Sierra.

          • Purple Tentacle

            Whoops.

            I have no recollection of Sierra then.

            Though if gouis is this bothered by my opinions, perhaps I should keep my opinions of Colton and Naonka to myself.

          • gouis

            YOU LIKE COLTON?!!?!?!!??

          • Purple Tentacle

            Yes. I thought he was a fun villain. I like colorful, flawed characters, even if they’re nasty people.

          • Prom King

            I loathed him so much the first time around. The second time I watched the season, he was the only thing that was interesting besides Kim. Both were pretty masterful and he was her only viable strategic threat.

          • corndogshuffle

            Oh please do tell.

            (I don’t even know if Sierra remembers Sierra, so you aren’t alone there)

          • Roswulf

            People, Ciera and Cirie are good. Sierra and Sarah are not.

            C good, S bad.

          • gouis

            That’s the correct response to Sierra.

          • Marlene

            Bwahahaha

        • sharculese

          Ciera voted out her mom.

          Sierra did nothing all season because she was in an alliance with Rodney, Dan, and Will, and knew all she had to do was get to the end.

          • Alycia Swift

            She was the original OWM.

          • corndogshuffle

            Wasn’t Tyler the OWM that season?

          • Alycia Swift

            There was more than one.

        • m0nit0rman

          Hey! Ciera gave us this:

          http://i.imgur.com/o8EGp3P.gif

    • There are a lot of odd choices, but we have Tony, Cirie, and Sandra. I’m fine with that.

      • I’m not complaining about Caleb, me shallow and he pretty. But just title the season “Survivor: People You Like On TV Again.”

        • Alycia Swift

          He is not as pretty as Ken.

          • They are very different people, inside and out. Caleb is a reality TV whore who has waxed, tattooed, and chiseled himself into hotness. Ken is just Regular Dude Hot.

      • jersey_luck

        And the funny thing is that realistically those could be first three boots next season.

        • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

          I think it’s part of the reason Yau man will never return to our screens

          • jersey_luck

            I think the reason that Yau-Man is not coming back is that is from those middle seasons came back already and lost quickly in his second go around and doesn’t have any interest in coming back.

          • Alycia Swift

            He’s also older too. He has go to be in his 60s by now.

        • corndogshuffle

          This really is the darkest timeline.

        • The good news is with a season like this, everyone’s a threat, so it will be hard for them to pick obvious “we have to get rid of that person” early boots.

          ………aside from Tony, who they know they have to get rid of first.

    • corndogshuffle

      I think he changed the game by making Survivor realize that salt and pepper is a shitty reward, especially if you’re risking heat stroke.

    • DrVanNostrand

      His game change was not suing Survivor for almost killing him.

  • I’m glad that she finally officially changed her name to Ciera Shevotedouthermom.

  • gouis

    Ozzy looks like hispanic Johnny Depp.

    • Mike Hirsch

      Like “Johnny Depp” in the Tim and Eric movie.

    • corndogshuffle

      I will never unsee this.

    • “Perennial Favorite” Ozzy, you mean. Also, please hold all of my vomit.

      • Diego Armando

        Kids love him. I think that is the primary reason he is popular at the moment.

        • He’s Survivor Elmo. I get it.

          • Something Quirky

            This made me genuinely laugh out loud.

    • sharculese

      Johnny Derp.

      • This deserves more love than it’s getting.

        • DrVanNostrand

          I’ve got your backs

    • Alycia Swift

      Doesn’t he now look like he did in Cook Islands (the haircut)?

      • gouis

        I don’t remember him having so many accessories in CI

        • Alycia Swift

          You are probably right. I just thought the haircut looked familiar.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            It’s more the Micronesia haircut, I’d say.

  • Purple Tentacle

    I wasn’t paying attention….are they having new players and veteran players or are they not revealing all the #gamechangers yet?

    • corndogshuffle

      The second thing. They didn’t reveal the full cast.

      • Purple Tentacle

        Thanks.

        • corndogshuffle

          No problem!

      • Yeah, that was odd.

        • Kent McK

          Where was fan favorite Sierra Dawn Thomas!?

          • Alycia Swift

            And Haley Ford?

          • prettyboyprobst

            Back off!

            Unless you honestly wanted to see Hali on that stage, then please go on!

          • Mike Hirsch

            Fan favorite GAME CHANGER Sierra Dawn Thomas.

          • corndogshuffle

            She was there, you just didn’t see her. She’s still playing her Worlds Apart game.

          • Hornacek

            I was going to say she was a seat-filler during the reunion, but then I realized the no one from the audience left their seat to talk to Jeff.

          • andythesaint

            I’m sure she was too busy to make the finale.

            bwahahahahahahahahahaha

        • corndogshuffle

          Conspiracy theory – they only mentioned people who made the merge because they wanted them to seem pumped!

      • Alycia Swift

        And did not mention someone else who was there.

        • corndogshuffle

          A couple of bizarre omissions.

        • indescribable hat

          Yeah super weird

      • Mike Hirsch

        “Ladies and gentlemen, the pre-jury members of season 34! Here they are now because you won’t see much of them later!”

        • Kent McK

          Don’t you dare.

        • corndogshuffle

          We came up with very similar ideas. Only I went optimistic instead of pessimistic.

      • Kent McK

        They should have just brought out Tony.

        • corndogshuffle

          I would not have complained about that even a little bit.

        • gouis

          He had a really nice sweater.

        • Marlene

          I’d argue Sandra and Tony. That’s powerful.

        • Hornacek

          Jeff: “Here’s Tony!”
          (Tony comes on stage, massive applause)
          Jeff: “And the rest!”
          (all the others come on stage)

    • Ms_Woozah

      Andrea showed up to an NYC screening I was at tonight, and while she told us she couldn’t technically admit to anything yet, she did say “the choice of the people they decided to reveal tonight is confusing to me.” Take that as you will.

      • The most confusing part is them not revealing that other S34 player who was SITTING THERE ON THE STAGE. “Michaela! Michaela is back! And also some other guy, but I can’t remember his name right now. But isn’t Michaela great?”

  • Weirdly, I’m sort of realising that the winner Adam is most like is Sandra. He got an awful lot of credit from the jury for repeatedly failing to vote out David.

    • I think there is a slight difference there. Sandra was wanting to work with the Heroes, which garnered their respect.

      • Not hugely different from Adam’s argument that he would have saved both Bret and Sunday at their vote outs if Hannah hadn’t been such an idiot.

        I agree there are plenty of ways in which it’s not the same, but there are still some parallels.

      • Kent McK

        Those Heres definitely weren’t bitter though.

        • I am not surely they weren’t. It is just a different frame to hide their bitterness.

    • Alycia Swift

      And for convincing Ken to flip when he did not do that – at least from what we saw.

    • Diego Armando

      Showing that you were willing to help those who got booted is sometimes better than personally booting them.

      • Yeah, it worked out great for him. The last four people onto the jury were two people he straight-up told he was voting out, who respected him for it, and two people he got to entirely absolve himself from and blame on Hannah.

        • Diego Armando

          ADAM: I TRIED TO HELP YOU BUT HANNAH WENT ROGUE.

          Hannah: It was my idea to screw you over to keep David around.

          I wonder why ADAM got their votes?

          • Know your audience, Hannah.

    • Baulderstone

      Boasting about always being on the wrong side of the vote was odd, but hey, it worked. What do I know?

      • I think the only one he was actually on the wrong side of was Bret, and that was because Hannah messed it up for him. A lot of the others he did actually vote with the majority, but only while loudly complaining that he didn’t want to and it was only due to other peoples’ stupidity that this was happening. It was very Sandra.

        • Baulderstone

          True. I guess I should say that boasting about never being in control of the game was odd.

    • indescribable hat

      Yeeeah I was trying to construct some kind of Hannah-Parvati comparison, but that probably works better. Parvati knows she can beat Russell, so she thinks she doesn’t need to clip him, and she’s right, but she’s wrong because juries are complicated. Hannah bets she can get David at the last minute, so she doesn’t need to take him out sooner, and she’s right, but she’s wrong because juries are complicated.

    • andythesaint

      Same.

  • Season ends with camera zooming in on unanimous victor Adam, but unwilling to pull close enough to remove Ken from the shot. I feel you, camera.

    • Alycia Swift

      And Ken just staring at the camera.

      • Directly into my soul.

        • Alycia Swift

          Mine 2.

          • Ken 2020.

          • gouis

            FINALLY SOMETHING WE ALL CAN GET BEHIND

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            We’re getting behind Ken now?

          • gouis

            Honestly, whatever Ken prefers.

          • You’re setting me up to say something really dirty right now. I shall refrain, for once.

          • It was on a tee for you. A TEE!

  • Hornacek

    Random thoughts (reunion):

    All of Adam’s personal story is touching, but we’re 20 minutes into this and we haven’t talked any strategy or gameplay, or to anyone but Adam.

    Hannah is adorable! When she was talking about how she was taking chances I really wanted her to pull an Adrien Brody and just kiss Ken.

    When Jeff asked Ken if he was single, was Ken leaning his head towards Hannah?

    That was the entire Figgy and Taylor discussion? Lame. And all Taylor said in the entire reunion was “Yeah.”

    Mamanuca Islands.

    The Worlds Apart cast felt upstaged at their own reunion? Well move over – the Millennials vs GenXers are getting upstaged by 7 alls-tars.

    Players talked to: Adam, David, Jay, Zeke, Bret, Hannah, Ken, Michaela, Jessica, Will, Sunday, Figgy, Taylor, Chris, Michelle

    I love this site and its people! See you all in March! (well, and in the off season)

    • gouis

      Agreed that Adam’s gameplay is going to be lost in all his emotional stuff.

      • corndogshuffle

        It’s gonna feel a little strange dissecting Adam’s game given how powerful his story is (I won’t pretend it didn’t get to me) but man. As far as “game play” goes this is not fantastic.

        • Yep, it escalated quickly from 11 weeks of “Adam is not good at ‘Survivor'” to — seriously, this actually happened — 10-0-0.

          He rebounded enough to become a plausible winner, but…10-0-0, y’all. You would’ve been laughed outta town if you had predicted that until, like, 9:55 ET tonight.

          • corndogshuffle

            It was a surprisingly similar arc to Kaoh Rong, just with a more palatable winner (or at least a winner with better goats).

          • Diego Armando

            I at least understand why he won unanimously.

          • corndogshuffle

            Oh yeah. Unlike Kaoh Rong, it was pretty clear what was happening before FTC happened. With Kaoh Rong, you needed to be an edgic person to see that win. With MvX, it was obvious as soon as David left what was about to happen. I’d rather get blindsided by the vote at four than at FTC.

      • Hornacek

        At this point it feels like “What gameplay?” But after time has passed I’ll probably look back better at what he did. But man, he also did some real dumb things in the game.

        • I think he did a lot of terribly stupid things, but also a lot of good things, and then also made it seem incredibly dramatic, and that was enough to finish on top.

          Adam is America. USA! USA! USA!

          • Hornacek

            Considering what America did this past year, Americans might want to lay off chanting “USA! USA! USA!” for about 4 years.

          • Good luck with that.

    • corndogshuffle

      Hannah is *adorkable.

    • Alycia Swift

      That’s more players than he’s talked to in years. Missed: Lucy, Paul, Rachel, CC and I’m blanking.

      • Mari

        • Alycia Swift

          Wow. My brain is mush.

      • Hornacek

        At the 20 minute mark with only Adam talked to I thought “Ok, Jeff is only gonna get to talk to half of the cast, if that.” Was pleasantly surprised he talked to 15 people, and didn’t miss any of the ones that got left out.

    • I said this in a tweet but Probst loves this season because of the stories. This just caused an epiphany: As much as Probst loves #BigMovezzz, Probst really loves sappy stories that he can sink into a bit more especially when they feed into Big Moves.

      • Ms_Woozah

        And this season actually had both!

      • Hornacek

        I believe Jeff when he says that scene of the season was the conversation between Zeke and Bret. As much as he loves Big Moves ™, those kind of emotional moments are one of the things that keep him on the show.

        • I know this may sound odd, but I think Jeff is oddly fascinated by gay men. He was enamored with Josh and Reed during the SJDS finale and was intrigued by Caleb picking Colton as a soulmate.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            To be fair, I think a lot of us were intrigued (in a confused way) about Caleb picking Colton.

          • Hornacek

            Jeff: “Seriously, Caleb, what the hell do you see in him?”

          • Come On In Here

            Jeff has a little Tom Cruise in him… if you know what I mean.

          • indescribable hat

            Is it that he likes them more or that we’re a bit surprised he includes them in Jeff’s Club for Important Cool Manly Men?

          • It is not so much that he likes them but it is how he likes them. This is definitely more about Reed and Josh, who got the lion’s share of the SJDS reunion airtime for being b level characters for that season.

    • Roswulf

      I had no problem at all with centering the reunion on Adam’s personal story. We’ve got lots of better venues to discuss strategy, exit interviews and comment sections and podcasts galore.

      The reunion was the time for this story.

      • Hornacek

        But for a Survivor reunion show, I want Jeff to ask questions about things that happened on the show. Moves made, alliances formed, moments that changed the direction of the game. I really feel for Adam, but by the 20 minute mark I thought I had gone through a time warp and was watching an episode of The Jeff Probst Talk Show.

        • sharculese

          85 percent of Survivor watchers wont find out what happened to Adam’s mom if they dont talk about it there.

          • Hornacek

            Yeah, and I know the show has to care about those 85% of viewers, but I don’t.

          • sharculese

            Those people keep it on the air. We don’t.

    • Crappy

      I thought this was one of the better reunions .. possibly the best in a long time

      • Diego Armando

        Honestly, yeah. Most people got talked to. Emotions and goodwill was present. No extraneous crap.

        • sharculese

          It could have had more Paul.

    • Come On In Here

      Ken and Hannah were weirdly flirty during the reunion. I’m thinking they went to the afterparty, Hannah got a little drunk, they went back to the hotel and Ken walked her to her room and said goodnight because he is a man of honor…

      • Hornacek

        Normally I would say Ken was way out of Hannah’s league. But with Ken’s insecurity, social tics, etc I could easily see him and Hannah together.

      • Hornacek

        “Ken and Hannah were weirdly flirty during the reunion”

        Not as much as the true couple of the season (Chris and Bret).

  • So, can I ask for an official ruling on the Season 34 cast spoilers? Can we talk about all 20 or just the ones featured on stage?

    • Alycia Swift

      I want to talk about all 20.

      • Do it.

        • So the explanation of why some of these people were game changers was bullshit, right?

          • Obviously. But I like that it’s actual game changers and some bad/inert players. That way I have people that can get booted early and I won’t care that we lost them.

            (One in particular I desperately want to be the first boot.)

          • I am specifically talking about Michaela and the seashells. She is not a game changer for showing her strategy with sea shells.

          • She’s a game changer for winning a round of a challenge while topless. Like Sugar!

          • indescribable hat

            And Amanda!

          • prettyboyprobst

            I really want the big-name&big-target players to band together (ok, maybe not that particular one, and Ciera can go early as well), but how high are the odds of this actually happening?

            Also, I forgot about many who are in S34 since the cast was leaked, meaning what the ratio exactly is, but I feel like there were a lot of FFSDTs in there.

    • gouis

      PLEASE ALL

    • Alycia Swift

      Cirie looked good. She lost a lot of weight. Sandra is looking older.

      • But I like the longer hair on her and she already has an epic quote.

        • Alycia Swift

          Yep. I would love to see her win again.

      • corndogshuffle

        Cirie almost biffed it when she came on stage. Am I a bad person for thinking that that would have been hilarious?

        • It is very Varner-esque.

          • corndogshuffle

            Probably not a coincidence that Varner is one of my favorite characters ever!

          • Well then I’ve got good news for you…

          • corndogshuffle

            Spoiler tag? 🙂

          • The spoiler tag has been lifted!

          • I hope you’re sitting down, because it’s a game changer.

          • Is it a Mamanuca Island?

        • Alycia Swift

          Are you one of the Survivor Historians – the one who likes seeing old people fall?

          • His name is Paul and Cirie is not that old.

          • Alycia Swift

            I know his name is Paul. I agree that Cirie is not that old. I think she’s around my age.

          • corndogshuffle

            She was born in 1970, just looked it up. Although I’m sure Barbara Anderson knew that offhand.

          • Hornacek

            1970? Wow, that’s old! (covers face, hobbles away)

          • corndogshuffle

            Cirie’s not *that* old. Although she is Gen X, which means she is an old and I’m supposed to want her to lose.

      • prettyboyprobst

        Cece too, didn’t she? (Honest question, was not exactly watching in HD)

        • I honestly didn’t get a good look at her.

          • Hornacek

            We got a good look at her red dress when they talked to whoever was sitting in front of her.

          • But not of her face.

          • Hornacek

            They made the right decision.

            (not saying anything bad about her face)

    • gouis

      I really don’t understand why Ozzy is back. He already got an entire season that was 50% based around him. And it was TERRIBLE.

      We already have new (and actually likable) physical threats for that spot. Just bring back Joe Anglim again for christsakes. Or Jay (in an ideal world). What the fuck does Ozzy have for us?

      • He’s a fan favorite who isn’t busy shacking up with Wiglesworth?

        • Mike Hirsch

          Who’s doing what now?

          • corndogshuffle
          • Mike Hirsch

            Well how about that.

          • corndogshuffle

            Ain’t that some shit?

          • Dezbot

            Wait, are they dating?

          • Remember when he said that he was going to be a fire fighter? Nope, not what he is doing at all. Also, he is a hardcore conservative.

          • Diego Armando

            This is why I don’t read about anything these people do outside of Survivor.

            (Note, I tend not to care about where people fall politically on this show, we have had great and terrible players from all ends of the spectrum. I care more about being good at the game).

          • I don’t care either but he’s one of those that buys into the liberal media crap.

          • prettyboyprobst

            You’re still talking about Ozzy, right (or Joe now)?

          • 100 percent Joe.

          • prettyboyprobst

            Oh wow. I knew about the Wiglesworth-rumors, but I didn’t take him to be that dense in that way.

          • He had a tweet about why the liberal media sucks for buffering videos, or something off the wall.

          • prettyboyprobst

            Sounds out there enough for it to be an innocent joke, but you can never tell with these people…

          • MsFjordstone

            Oh, FFS.

          • Diego Armando

            Ooooh. That’s sad.

            One of the good things about Survivor is that it brings people from all walks of life together on the island. This allows the castaways to interact with people they might not have in real life and grow in understanding. Something I’ve learned in life is that integration is the best way to stop prejudice. It becomes harder to dislike groups of people once you actually meet them and realize that they are just normal humans.

        • Hornacek

          This has been Barbara Anderson with this week’s Survivor Gossip Update.

      • Hornacek

        Haven’t you heard? When Jeff is walking on the streets, everyone he talks to says that Ozzy is one of their top five favorite players.

        Which means Jeff is walking down the wrong streets.

        • andythesaint

          Nah. Every other comment on the Survivor FB boards during the Second Chance voting was “where are Ozzie and Roopert?”

          Yes. For SECOND chance. Ozzy is incredibly popular. Because Americans are stupid.

          • Hornacek

            Come on Russia, the Survivor FB website is the one you should be hacking and taking down.

    • Kent McK

      I don’t really think anyone listening to Survivor podcasts and habitually talking about Survivor online views the cast list as a spoiler. Didn’t everyone see who the 18 not on this season were like 6 months ago?

      • I think some people were staying spoiler-free.

        • corndogshuffle

          I do think at this point talking about the cast shouldn’t count as a spoiler. But I’m going to wait for John or Andy to give an official verdict before I openly talk about people.

          • I just didn’t want to dive in without them saying yay or nay.

          • gouis

            I asked Andy he said it was fine.

          • Andy hasn’t watched the episode yet, right?

          • gouis

            Shhhh

    • Go ahead.

    • Ms_Woozah

      Have you seen the tribe divisions? Basically, I am all in for one tribe, and the other can burn in hell.

      • I have seen them, but can’t remember. Doesn’t one tribe have Sandra and Tony on it?

        • Ms_Woozah

          Yep. And Varner and Malcolm and Michaela. The other tribe has Cirie and Zeke but those are the only ones I care about over there.

      • Hornacek

        I wouldn’t be surprised if the tribes were mixed up by episode three. Or even sooner – THAT would be a game changer!

  • Mike Hirsch

    From the recently posted interview with EW for next season: Fascinating in what way?
    I anticipated a bloodbath out of the gate, and instead, it’s more like the movie Jaws. It felt very much like all 20 people were looking at each other saying: We know the shark is in the water. When’s it going to hit the boat? When’s it going to attack the boat? And so it has a very uneasy feeling in the beginning as people aren’t sure what to do, which is really interesting because, on the surface, you would think these are game players.
    1) I’m not sure Jeff has seen Jaws. I think he’s thinking of Jaws 2.
    2) No, seriously, 20 people looking at each other (including at least two people who appear to be vying for a Ringo Starr lookalike award) saying they know the shark is in the water is LITERALLY the plot of Jaws 2.
    3) Have you guys seen Jaws 2? I am willing to pontificate about it at length if not.
    4) Lea Thompson is not in Jaws 2. But she is in Jaws 3-D (which to my mind is not completely awful. I’d argue it’s the third best Jaws movie). This may be dating me a little, but Lea Thompson was one of my earliest crushes (Diane Lane was the other. A Little Romance and Six-Pack). So her presence elevates not only Jaws 3-D, but the whole Jaws franchise.
    5) I’ve completely lost my train of thought, but I definitely had a point about Survivor when I started typing this. But now all I can think about is how I want to watch SpaceCamp.

    • corndogshuffle

      So on a scale of 1-10, how good is Jaws 2?

      • Mike Hirsch

        I’d give it a 6. Maybe a 7, if it’s like, a rainy Saturday.

        • corndogshuffle

          I’m actually surprised. I thought you would have said either a 1 or a 10 based on the tone of your comment.

          • Mike Hirsch

            I’m a fan of mediocrity.

          • That explains why you listen to the podcast, at least.

    • You brought up Lea Thompson but didn’t bring up Back to the Future?

      • Mike Hirsch

        Back to the Future is like, a given. But the crush was further bolstered by her appearances in things like Red Dawn, All The Right Moves, Howard the Duck (which was a little unsettling but hey, whatever), and the aforementioned Jaws 3-D and SpaceCamp.

        • Alycia Swift

          She was on the Muppets reboot. She’s Kermit’s crush (like the celebrity he could do within a relationship).

          • Mike Hirsch

            I always felt a kinship with Kermit, and now I know why.

          • <—-best Muppet

            (Kermit is definitely Top 5)

          • Alycia Swift

            Ok – new question for the podcast – Top 5 Muppets.

          • 1. Bert
            2. Grover (SuperGrover and WaiterGrover forms challenge for #1)
            3. Ernie
            4. Kermit
            5. Count von Count

            Honorable mentions: Gonzo, Cookie Monster, Janice, those yip-yip-yip-yip-UHHUH-UHHUH aliens, Stadler & Waldorf, Miss Piggy when angry/karate (not kissy-kissy), Beaker

            Last place: Elmo

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Wher’s the Rowlf love?

          • ehhhhhhh

          • Hornacek

            His story in the Jason Segel movie was epic!

          • StormofCuteness

            1. Miss Piggy
            2. Grover
            3. Animal
            4. Ernie (and Bert-best couple)
            5. Kermit

          • Come On In Here

            1) Beaker
            2) Beaker
            3) Beaker
            4) Beaker
            5) The Swedish Chef

          • TheForRealDeal

            1. Beaker
            2. That rat guy
            3. Roosevelt Franklin
            4. Sam the Eagle
            5. Troy McClure.

          • Hornacek

            Upvoted for #5

          • TheForRealDeal
          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            Some Kind of Wonderful. Cmon guys.

          • Come On In Here

            Which made sense as she already has had a relationship with felt.

    • gouis

      How many times have you seen Jaws 2

      • Mike Hirsch

        Possibly two dozen. It used to be on tv a lot when I was in high school. Like, on TBS several
        times in one week.

        • gouis

          Holy. Shit.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Sadly that’s about half as many times as I saw Jaws 3-D.

          • gouis

            Damn, y’all love shitty shark movies.

          • corndogshuffle

            Jaws… 3-D?

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            It was one of those movies where you wear these funny glasses to make it look like stuff is coming out of the screen at you.

          • corndogshuffle

            Was it Jaws in 3-D, or was it a third Jaws movie?

          • gouis

            Both

          • It can truly be both things.

          • Mike Hirsch

            If only.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Third Jaws movie. Shot at Sea World. In the third dimension!

          • Mike Hirsch

            There are dolphins!

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            And Dennis Quaid puts a clothespin on his beagle’s ears to keep them out of the dog food!

          • Kids these days only get the two dimensions. Probably because they’re too weak to handle depth.

          • corndogshuffle

            Meow hold on a second… every movie is in 3D meowadays.

            The meow thing works much better in speech than in text. Damn.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            Back in our day we had the occasional 3-D movie and we liked it!

          • corndogshuffle

            I don’t remember any 3-D movies from my childhood. The 90’s were a backward time. 🙁

          • Baulderstone

            As a Gen Xer, I was raised with a Viewmaster in my hand. Those 3-D Peanuts stories instilled me with more character than you will ever get from those Youtubes where people open Kinder eggs.

          • gouis

            FOUND THE YOUNGIN

          • corndogshuffle

            Hah, you totally don’t have as many years left to live as me.

          • Mike Hirsch

            It features a fantastic performance from Simon “Manimal” MacCorkindale as the world’s most obnoxious douchebag.

          • Saturday Night Palsy

            And thanks to him we get to see the shark explode and have its jaws fly right at the screen!

          • Mike Hirsch

            And yet I can basically name none of the characters who spend most of the movie harassed by the shark. One was probably a Terry or Terri. And one guy has a unibrow. One guy sort of resembles Robert Sean Leonard.

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            I also have seen Jaws 3-D probably a dozen times and know exactly zero of the characters names, but I remember the water-skiing pyramid!

          • corndogshuffle

            Is this a real movie or is everyone here just making shit up?

          • EmAndScoutInBK

            Wouldn’t it be awesome if we were collectively screwing with you?

          • corndogshuffle

            It really would. And I would have no idea. It’s the perfect crime.

          • And it is absolutely something that the people here would do, too.

          • corndogshuffle

            And that’s why I hang out here. True story.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            Hey guys, remember how bad the 2005 Jaws reboot was? What were they thinking?!?!

    • Violina23

      OMG Space camp! With the robot that’s not Johnny 5

      • Mike Hirsch

        And Joaquin Phoenix! Back when he was Leaf.

      • EmAndScoutInBK

        JINX!!! JINX THE ROBOT!

    • Baulderstone

      I’ve never seen Jaws 2, but I have heard it. When I was in elementary school, I was working on some school project in the living room, but my parents wanted to watch it. As I was too young, they told me just to sit with my back to it. So I listened to the entire thing, and I am betting what I pictured in my head was a lot more terrifying than the actual movie.

      • Mike Hirsch

        This was a big thing with me as well when I was a kid. I had an older brother, and I heard a lot of movies that proved far more terrifying in my head than they actually were once I watched them.
        But damn, some movies *sound* scary!

    • EmAndScoutInBK

      I will watch Jaws 2 and 3 any day. But never Jaws 4. Never.

      • Mike Hirsch

        The Jawses were on Netflix recently. I may throw them on while at work today. (Working from home is the tops.)
        But yes, Jaws 4 should remain a myth, a rumor. A whisper on the wind.

        • Hornacek

          The only good thing to come out of Jaws 4 is Michael Caine’s quote about how it paid for his house.

      • Hornacek

        I guess for you that movie was too … (puts on sunglasses) … personal.

    • EmAndScoutInBK

      Also, SpaceCamp freaking rules. Watched it 100x as a kid.

    • Crappy

      Jeff’s answers in that interview makes me think that the season is not as a strategy heavy as some may anticipate an All-Stars season to be,, it may not even be that good IMO.. this comment ” And then the game finds a rhythm and becomes really interesting on a whole different level.” seems like a code word for it being a so-so season.. otherwise Jeff would already be hailing it as the next best thing

      • Mike Hirsch

        It kind of worried me a little bit, like it’s code for “all the duller people make it far.”

      • Diego Armando

        I’m still hyped though.

    • Hornacek

      Jeannot Szwarc, is that you?

      • Mike Hirsch

        Guilty, you got me.

    • Purplerockmatt

      I just want to tell you that this is my favorite comment, possibly ever, and that Jeff is definitely thinking of Jaws 2

      • Mike Hirsch

        Totally Jaws 2 (which I watched on Netflix today.)

    • Come On In Here

      Freakin’ LOVE SPACE CAMP!

  • Oh by the way, it seems like Michele already knew that Adam won which is why they started hanging out. Michele continues to be the worst.

    • gouis

      INFO?!!?

      • She just post a drunk Twitter video of them from their hangout this past weekend. Note: I don’t know this for sure, but if Adam knew that he won, then he is probably telling a lot of people. It is a small miracle that this season wasn’t spoiled knowing what website he frequents.

        • gouis

          Just because they’re hanging out doesn’t mean that she knew he won. But she did predict him in that online thing she had with Shireen.

          • Holy shit, good point. Let me go look at that real quick.
            TWO MINUTES LATER
            I am back. She had the final four exact. Now,that doesn’t mean anything but I have a weird hunch that she knew.

          • gouis

            Michele remains the worst.

          • Let’s just all rush to the conclusion that she was spoiled because it’s more fun that way.

          • Hey, it is more fun….but the social media stuff over the past week is just a little odd.

          • gouis

            Well it’s either that or she’s a Survivor god that not only wins seasons but predicts them perfectly (without actually watching the show)

          • corndogshuffle

            Based on her interviews I sincerely doubt that she is that perceptive.

          • prettyboyprobst

            says the guy who got all six picks in the right order!

            But I admit that it seems like the most plausible scenario when you start with Adam as the winner and go from there, so nothing to see here imo (apart from amazing fantasy chops of course)

          • The funny thing is that I originally had Adam at 4th and David winning. Then Andy told me that my only shot of beating Matt in predictions was to have Adam win. So I put Adam as the winner even though I was pretty convinced it was going to be David.

          • prettyboyprobst

            Always vote tactical on the last day of fantasy survivor, no shame in that! I switched Bret’s and Jay’s boot, which would have been enough to tie him if all the readers took my (unvoiced) example

            (oh, but you’re not supposed to know what he picked, right? CHEAT!)

          • Normally I wouldn’t know. But Matt’s picks were made on the podcast while I was out. Paternity leave has its privileges!

          • corndogshuffle

            She knew. I’m going to assume that because I don’t like her anyway. But that’s a pretty big series of coincidences if she didn’t know, and I don’t believe in coincidences for the most part.

    • I was going to make a joke on Twitter about how Stephen is probably fairly high on the most post-show hookups list but I didn’t want to get blocked by Stephen, so I didn’t…

      • That would have been an appropriate clap-back.

        • It would also require me to deliberately reply to a Survivor, which I never do.

          • Do a shot first. It will feel so natural after that.

          • I haven’t done a shot in 3 years, so that would be quite unnatural.

          • Replying to Fishbach on Twitter would be a celebratory event worthy of liquor.

          • I reply to him all the time. And when I met him and introduced myself, he said “Hey man, fuck you.”

            He gets me.

          • Hornacek

            The only way this story could be better would be if he also punched you in the face.

          • Nah, he wouldn’t dare step to me when I’m rolling with my bodyguards- my wife and Emma.

            He has a good sense of humor about it. It was said in a playful manner.

          • Hornacek

            I’m imaging Stephen trying something and Emma putting him in a headlock.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            I got “Oh, you talk a lot of shit, don’t you?”

          • corndogshuffle

            You need to get you some bourbon.

      • Crappy

        mmmmm survivor gossip.. who else other than Courtney did Stephen hook up with post survivor?

        • Liz from last season.

          • Hornacek

            But that was pre-Survivor for Liz.

          • It still counts just as much as Corinne does for Ethan.

          • Dezbot

            Ethan hooked up with Corinne!?? EWWWW.

          • Oh yeah, which is why Corrinne has an irrational hatred of Jenna Morasca.

          • Dezbot

            Corinne is just plain irrational.

          • Fair enough.

          • Purplerockmatt

            EThan hooked up with everyone

          • Crappy

            they dated before she was on the show though..

          • I am still counting it.

      • Purplerockmatt

        i did reply to that, but pointed out that he missed Ethan Zohn who I mean come on survivor gossip, am i right, or am i right?

        • You’re not wrong. He has at least four Survivor exes (Jenna L., Amber, Corrinne,Jenna M.). However, the only confirmed outside of Survivor relationship that Ozzy had was with Amanda (unless I am missing 1). At that point, Stephen easily tops him. Boston Rob tops him. Candice tops him.

          • andythesaint

            I’ll bet Stephen knows more than just Amanda. I’m sure there’s been more than just Amanda.

          • I am sure he does, but I am just going off confirmed off-island relationships (although I wonder if I should include showmance as well).

  • Kent McK

    The real game changer to me is this season’s edit. I thought Adam had no chance after how ridiculous he looked around the merge. I was very pleasantly surprised tonight.

    • gouis

      SUCK IT EDGIC

      • Production needs to find an American named Edward Gic, recruit him, and then see if he wins. That would settle everything.

        • Alycia Swift

          Sounds like a Batman villain.

          • He’s probably of Basque descent.

          • Hornacek

            Don’t be afraid to use your claws, boyd!

        • Hornacek

          Survivor 36: Edward Gic vs. Jennifer X(avier)

      • gouis

        Current top post on the edgic subreddit? “Time to close this sub”

        • WE DID IT, YOU GUYS!*

          *What we did was simply say “Nuh uh”, but it totally worked.

          • gouis

            I’ll take it.

        • sharculese

          I almost want to go and drink their tears. Almost. I’m saving that for next Tuesday.

          • Why next Tuesday?

          • sharculese

            That’s generally when D&C post. Although they do take a little longer with the finale.

          • Gotcha.

          • They were so close.

          • sharculese

            So close and yet, oh man, it’s going to be fun listening to Colin talk about how wrong he was.

          • He was a big early Michele proponent, right?

          • sharculese

            A lot of Kaoh Rong was him saying “it doesnt matter what we just saw because Michele is winning.”

          • Yuck, but he wasn’t spoiled, right?

          • sharculese

            I dont think so.

          • And by spoiled, I mean just go off Probst’s assertion that Michele was like Parvati like many of us did…(note I was not a crazy OWM like some of them were).

      • Kent McK
      • Violina23

        I was avoiding edgic… Were they calling it for David?

        • gouis

          It was 100% Ken until about the merge. Then 100% David.

        • corndogshuffle

          Mostly. There were a few dissenters, but David was the clear #1 choice.

        • I saw a few calling it for Adam, but not many. However, this was the anti-spoiler season.

          • Diego Armando

            I thought in week 3 or 4 when the topic of obvious winner Ken came up that ADAM was being groomed for the winner spot. His idol finding scene seemed like an Earl on the Mountain moment. I did drop him down massively after the Taylor boot, so I will not brag too much about being right.

          • I had my suspicions, because it would have just been so cold to include all those confessionals about Adam wanting to make his mom proud, get to final tribal council for her, etc, and then go out just beforehand. Unnecessarily cruel.

          • So I guess that quote from a couple weeks ago about the last thing left on his Survivor bucket list is winning was a winner’s quote. Who would have thought it?

          • Purplerockmatt

            yeah i had heard some rumblings that there were people on Adam early and I saw some pre-merge signs, but man he faded hard for so long I thought it wasn’t happening

      • Kemper Boyd

        I was so so worried for a minute that Colin Stone was going to be right.

        • Diego Armando

          I was worried that Hannah might somehow win and I would need to go into damage control. That faded the second Chris vouched for ADAM.

      • The guy who does the edit reads over on RHaP had Jay winning, because of some bullshit about bats and the moon, so I found Jay going out at 6 similarly pleasing.

    • Crappy

      Edit was fantastic this season IMO. Very little story manipulation. They did not try to give undue credit to the winner and showed the story as it is.

  • Diego Armando

    WOO, ADAM HERE! ADAM’S SO BITTERSWEET ABOUT THE OUTCOME OF THE SEASON. ADAM IS HAPPY FOR ALL SUPPORT AND WILL ANSWER ANY QUESTION YOU WANT.

    • Adam is with Woo? I ship it.

      • Diego Armando

        ADAM ONLY HAS EYES FOR TAYLOR, BUT WOO IS WELCOME TO JOIN OUR MENAGE.

        • Something Quirky

          C’mon, man. Adam/Jay 4EVA

  • Violina23

    Do you guys think Adam’s reveal about his mom actually changed any votes? I general call bullshit on jurors claiming they haven’t made up their minds yet at FTC, but in this case, I’m wondering

    • I don’t think we will know until the Jury Speaks videos are available.

    • I think he would have won, but I don’t think it would have been unanimous. I think a few of the kids were on the fence, and I’m still shocked Ken didn’t get Jessica’s vote.

      • Alycia Swift

        I agree. I thought all three were pretty good at tribal. I would have liked to have seen more tribal.

      • Diego Armando

        I think voting out David shot him in the foot, since that removed the honor card his entire game was based around.

        • I agree, but Adam was floundering at the beginning of FTC and it looked like he was in big trouble. But I guess it’s indisputable that all of them were at least seriously considering giving Adam their vote going into FTC.

          • Good point. This makes me wonder if this FTC was edited out of order, because you know who else had a similar FTC edit? Michele.

          • Hornacek

            Plus Hannah was kicking him under the bus so much that Kelley Wentworth almost showed up and said “Hey, that’s my move!”

        • Alycia Swift

          That’s why I think that if he had not voted out David and let them fight it out, it might have been a little different.

          • Diego Armando

            Well, I think he still gets second place, but still gets votes. He was also hurt by the fact that the betrayal happened the night before the Final Tribal. If David and Jessica had another day or two to get over the hurt, they might have voted for him. Emotions are always raw the day after.

      • I wrote down below, but Jessica’s reunion answer maybe shed some light on something. She brought up that Adam drew the rock. Ken and Hannah didn’t. Maybe that was the deciding factor.

        • That could have been her!

      • prettyboyprobst

        That’s how I feel about it in retrospect, only that I assume that, given he ended up with all ten votes, some of the millenials were considering the unanimous decision but were ready to throw a vote this or that way, if a FTC-performance merits it.
        And I also thought that both Hannah and Ken had a better FTC and even played a better overall game and one of them probably should have won, if it wasn’t for Adam’s FTC-bombshell.
        I thought Adam had some good tribal councils leading up to the final one though, which had to have helped him a lot, and there wasn’t one contestant among the final six I wouldn’t be happy with as a winner, if they made it in front of the jury.

    • corndogshuffle

      I feel about this the way I felt about Jeremy. I wouldn’t be surprised if changed a vote or three, but I don’t think it changed the outcome. If there were any protest votes I think this is the way to negate those.

      • Alycia Swift

        Jeremy’s win – I was not surprised. Spencer got cocky and Tasha only worked with those in her alliance (from what we heard in interviews later and was not nice to those not).

        • Yeap. Spencer especially shot himself in the foot with that F5 (?) or F4 tribal where he talked about poisoning the jury—the jury that is largely older than you by at least 10 years. Yeah, he could do that in Cagayan when he had a few younger people in that jury, but in Cambodia.

        • corndogshuffle

          Oh I thought Jeremy was winning even before the swap happened. I just mean that in terms of the FTC it seemed like a Jeremy win the whole way. His speech about Val and their baby was just icing on the cake.

    • Diego Armando

      I think he had at least 7-8 votes, but it probably sealed up the few fence sitters.

    • Alycia Swift

      I wonder if it would have gone better for him if Ken had not voted David out and let them fight it out with firemaking.

      • I think worse – voting out David was literally the only move he could point to, and his story about playing for his daughter was a decent one. He was just unlucky that Adam had a much, much better story that trumped his.

        • HBO CEO of Tits

          Dead Moms over Living Daughters, as the saying goes.

    • Ms_Woozah

      I have a sneaking suspicion Jay told the jury and worked on Adam’s behalf on Ponderosa.

      • I’m not sure if Jay would actively have told them, but I definitely think Jay must have done some good PR work on Adam’s behalf. With, say, Taylor.

      • Hornacek

        I’m wondering if Jay at least told David, who seemed to give Adam the perfect opening to end the FTC by talking about his mother.

  • Now that the Survivor offseason is officially upon us, I wanted to take a second just to thank you all for coming here to talk with us each week- about the show and almost anything else on your mind. I’m overjoyed and honored to have such an amazing community here.

    I hope you all will stick around between now and March, since we’ll be posting new stuff until then. But regardless, I wanted to make sure you knew that we (and I’m speaking for all of us at PRP) really appreciate you all.

    (Especially you, Sad Lil.)

    • Sad Lil

      Back at you, hot stuff!

      • John, did you design a Disqus bot

        • Sad Lil

          How rude!

        • If I did, I’d definitely make it call me hot. But I wouldn’t make it Lil.

        • It’s definitely not Matt, because it would be Savage then.

    • Diego Armando

      Thank you for providing us with this community. This has been a truly shitty year for me and plenty of other people, and I am happy you provided a place for us to carry on and discuss freely.

    • Sad Lil

      Also when you gonna re-watch Lil’s season? I gotta lot to say!

      • Diego Armando

        John rewatched it a year or two ago. He loved it.

        • It remained as great as I remembered.

          • Kemper Boyd

            it’s a top 3 season for me.

      • Kemper Boyd

        I rewatched it last summer.

        • Diego Armando

          So did I. Or watched the majority of episodes I did not watch live. Good stuff.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Top 3 season. And a top rewatch too.

        • Ms_Woozah

          Same! Still holds up

    • Although we may disagree frequently, we can all agree that our Survivor experiences would not be the same without this site. So, thank you all (John, Andy, Emma, Mark, Matt) for your great work in creating this community.

      • Alycia Swift

        What she said.

        And thanks for making sure that people do not get too nasty to each other.

        • That’s one of my favorite parts of this group we have here- we disagree frequently, but it’s always done with a respect for each other.

          And it will stay that way, because I found out that Disqus allows me to ban people.

      • Kemper Boyd

        Innit dough.

    • Saturday Night Palsy

      You’re welcome, John.

      • I want you to know that the following statement is absolutely, 100% true:

        The parenthetical at the end originally said, “Except Saturday Night Palsy. Fuck that guy.”

        • Saturday Night Palsy

          I believe it.

    • StormofCuteness

      John, your predictions came true (mostly). Kudos and bragging rights earned and deserved. Enjoy!

      • That is (mostly) correct, although I won because I went with what I thought was a far less likely winner in order to have a shot at beating Matt.

        • Diego Armando

          Also you had ADAM from the beginning and would win a tie.

      • sharculese

        Hey just wanted to let you know I felt bad for not thinking of you when I listed out the Purple Rock RPDR crew.

        Weve never talked about it here, which is, I think, why I forgot.

        • StormofCuteness

          Luckily, I missed this unforgivable slight. 😆
          I love RPDR even more than Survivor! 😱 Probably shouldn’t have said so here…

    • Kemper Boyd

      You guys are the best. What am I going to do for the next 3 months? I’m hoping for a rewatch and some weird off season posts.

      • Well, you’re in luck!

        • Kemper Boyd

          If I start working on it over Christmas break, I’d say today but I’m off work sick and somehow have to move house by Wednesday! I can do my worst reunion outfits post I planned a year ago (Michelle Schubert ignited my passion again).

          • We’ll be accepting proposals. We’ve already gotten some, actually.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Other people are better writers and less lazy than me so I will have no hard feelings.

          • It’s a long offseason. There’s plenty of time to submit. And obviously we respect laziness.

          • Kemper Boyd

            have you ever tried to get a moving company in under 5 days? it’s not easy and that is all I can focus on today.

          • SpicyMayoJaySimpson

            Really? Because I have some ideas. Although I don’t have the access to footage needed to write this, how about a ranking of all the word puzzle phrases? I can also offer The Purple Rock PodPopcast Blog. If that becomes a regular post, you can mail me my residuals. Though maybe that infringes on the last half hour of the actual podcast.

          • Dutch

            I’d personally love to see a Guatemala rewatch. One of the most underrated seasons, in my opinion, as well as a unique location.

          • So, if I wanted to write an article trolling a certain season, I could?

          • Sure. Bring me your hottest take.

          • Oh God, I was joking. Also, I didn’t think you would say yes.

          • In honour of Ken… “Top imaginary Survivor boyfriends, and how you broke up”

        • corndogshuffle

          Nicaragua and One World?

          • Sylvisual

            Well, that’s my homework at least…

          • corndogshuffle

            You can probably skip the homework once or twice and still get an A.

            If you DO watch those do yourself a favor and watch your favorite season in between. You’ll need it.

          • At least you don’t have 12 seasons of homework to do.

          • Why would… What have we ever done to you to wish such a thing on us?

          • corndogshuffle

            Well one of those I thought I heard “spoiled” (hinted at more accurately) on a podcast. The other one I was just being a jerk.

            Any ideas which ones you’re gonna end up doing?

    • Ms_Woozah

      <3

    • corndogshuffle

      Thanks so much for the community you’ve helped create! Looking forward to toughing out the abnormally long winter offseason together.

    • Hornacek

      Here here!

      Or is it “Hear hear!”? Whichever one is correct.

    • Something Quirky

      I’ll let you know if there are any particularly interesting questions on the Survivor application.

  • Diego Armando

    That was an entertaining finale. I called the result. ADAM isn’t the best winner, but I will take a flawed, try hard player over a sentient piece of driftwood any day of the week. Honestly, this season was so much better than it should have been. I think I would enjoy seeing Zeke, Jay, Michaela & Bret again (they have the most to offer on a repeat viewing). ADAM might be interesting to see in a season where death is not hanging over his head. I feel like we got the perfect David arc and saw everything Ken and Hannah could give us.

  • I was just trying to Google Image search for the gif of Cirie falling down and I found the logo of the Purple Rock fantasy league instead. What are you trying to tell me, PRP Gods?

    • Our SEO is the best.

  • Alycia Swift

    Goodnight all. More posting tomorrow but I have to get some sleep. The adrenaline has worn off.

    • Same here. I’m exhausted.

  • sharculese

    I feel like this finale really cobbled together why this season has felt baggy and shapeless to me: it’s the story of a guy who kept taking his shot and missing, but then did just enough to make sure it didn’t blow back on him. That’s a story, but it’s not the most compelling one in the world.

    I’m a lot less upset with the Adam win than other people seem to be, but I’m not revisiting this season any time soon.

    • After having the conversation with a few people (including yourself), I finally realized what the story of this season was: It is about these underdogs who overcame great odds to get to be the power players. But, I formed that narrative with the idea that David was our winner. Tonight, it definitely feels like that story has met a conclusion but not the “right” conclusion. But, Adam is a compelling character if not the most dominant winner.

      I have a weird hunch that he falls as a mid-tier winner if that in the TEOS winner rankings.

      • Other Scott

        Adam is basically Aras as a winner, except with more easily recognizable mistakes

        • I think Aras could argue that he kept the crazies together as a coherent whole for a long time. Adam couldn’t.

          • Purplerockmatt

            please Cirie kept that group together

          • But Aras got the credit at the end…didn’t he….I actually never finished watching that season.

          • Alycia Swift

            Well Cirie was not there to get credit. I think she could have talked her way into the win if she got there.

          • Oh yeah.

        • Prom King

          Aras was the leader of his pack. Adam was never a leader. Aras also really never made any mistakes.

        • Diego Armando

          And a personality. Heyo!

      • Adam always struck me as a guy badly in need of an alliance partner to take care of the social side for him – the Trish to his Tony, the Amber to his Rob, etc.

        • Diego Armando

          Hannah was not stable enough.

          • Alycia Swift

            Sunday would have been the best at that. Otherwise, there really was not anyone.

          • Had the triforce not got to her first, I feel like that player could have been Michelle.

      • Kemper Boyd

        I would put him real low, like Fabio low.

        • I wouldn’t say that he is that low.

        • I think if you list his accomplishments – finding two immunity idols and an advantage, ridding us of Figgy, making a couple of showy (albeit unnecessary) tribal council plays, playing the advantage by not playing it, shamelessly helping Ken to an immunity win to make sure neither of his preferred targets could get it, winning Jay over, then coolly stabbing both him and David in the front, doing far better jury management than either Ken or Hannah, etc, then he has a considerably better resume than an awful lot of Survivor winners.

          He made a lot of mistakes as well, but at least he made it interesting.

          • Hornacek

            Counterpoints: he misplayed both immunity idols, he thought the reward-steal was a good thing, he told Taylor about his advantage (the worst person he could have told), and he let Taylor and Jay throw him under the bus by accusing him of stealing food too).

            Most of the votes that he was in on, I didn’t get the impression that he was directing the vote, just going along with everyone else. Which is a good thing to do – don’t make waves and make yourself seen as a threat – but that doesn’t mean you can later say that you directed all the votes.

            It seemed like he gave Jay his advantage as thanks for including him in the loved ones reward, not because he had realized that advantage was terrible.

            Adam did some good things in the game, but I feel like he did an equal number of bad things.

          • This is true. So then the question becomes – does playing the game hard and doing a lot of things (some good, some bad) trump doing next to nothing, but making one key move at the right time (like, say, Michele)?

            I think I prefer it this way around, because I think having dynamic players around creates a more interesting season than static, by-the numbers players. Like how we all know that the best Survivor strategy for an alliance is a pagonging…but that’s really boring to watch. I’ll accept having slightly (but only slightly!) worse players in exchange for an interesting season.

          • Hornacek

            I mean, Tony played hard and made some bad decisions too, but he was able to course correct and regain control, and his good decisions seemed to outshine his bad ones.

            I don’t think I can say the same about Adam. When he made bad decisions, it was like he turned into the skid and things just kept getting worse. And after he didn’t recover by regaining control, he did it by fading into the background. Don’t get me wrong, that’s a good strategy to get the target off your back, but it doesn’t make you a power player or someone that’s controlling the votes.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Counter-counterpoint: He may have technically misplayed both idols, but neither of them were foolish plays by any means. (That said, I wanted to scream at him when he told Hannah he had the idol.)

          • Hornacek

            Agreed, but I’ve been reading lots of people talking about how Adam played an amazing game and using “he found 2 idols!” to back it up, when in fact he did find those idols but he didn’t really make his plans work when he played both of them.

            And yes, it was very stupid of him to tell Hannah that he had that second one. Bret’s RHAP exit interview when he was describing when he realized that Adam had done that was great.

    • m0nit0rman

      …baggy and shapeless to me: it’s the story of a guy who kept taking his shot and missing…

      You said you weren’t go to tell anyone!

    • DrVanNostrand

      Ken and Hannah were just playing loser’s games. Ken waited until final 4 to take out a threat, when he had to choose between losing to David or Adam. It’s not an uncommon ending, and I thought the season leading up to the finale was a lot of fun.

      • With a different jury, Ken might have had a shot against Adam. And it’s hard to know how powerful Adam’s revelation about his mother was – did that flip some votes his way, or were they all already locked in? I agree they should have made their moves earlier, but I was still surprised that it was a shut-out as I thought all three of them had arguments both for and against.

        There have definitely been much worse final threes anyway.

        • Other Scott

          I think Ken was a bad combination of weird and arrogant with his morals and honour. I don’t think any jury really respects that.

          • Dezbot

            His blow-up with Will turned the tide on him. His full arrogance popped out and nobody likes being condescended to in Survivor.

          • Other Scott

            I don’t think it turned the tide, I think it just revealed to the viewers what the castaways always saw.

    • Assistant Dragon Slayer

      I’m more interested in the journey than the destination so I absolutely loved this season. But as we’ve already established, watch Survivor however you want to. MvGX will rank below Cagayan (partly because it had both a great journey and a great winner) but maybe not much lower.

      And you at least have to give this season credit for making edging look silly.

    • Kemper Boyd

      The thing that is likeable is a cast who even when they are coming up against each other in the game seem to genuinely like each other and treat each other with a level of respect. That’s it. The narrative wasn’t strong.

  • I am not good with math, but I think the Pick 4 is going to be very close this year.

    • Hornacek

      Not for all of us.

      • I am just saying that Sneaky Sneaky may not have had the blowout win as I thought they might have had a couple of weeks ago.

  • Roswulf

    I’m still coping with the whole of the finale- a surprisingly fantastic end to a very strong season.

    But I want to say now OH DEAR GOD SHOULD JEFF NOT INTERVIEW PEOPLE ABOUT THE DEATHS OF THEIR LOVED ONES. The smug smirk is so very wrong.

    • Yeah, that was awful. I also hated how he interjected Jay into the conversation to draw out the news about Adam’s mom.

    • DrVanNostrand

      I stopped after the votes were read, and now I’m really happy about that.

      • Roswulf

        I’d actually still recommend watching the first segment of the finale- it’s a necessary post-script to one of the season’s main stories. And while Jeff is awful, Adam is not. He tells a an incalculable emotional story very well.

  • DrVanNostrand

    Man, I wish I could spend more time here today, but I leave for vacation in about 4 hours.

    1. Ken surprised me for the first time all season. Way to go Ken, nice move! But also….. way too little too late. I think Adam and his Mom was way more powerful than Jeremy and his baby, but still, Adam had this. Ken’s game was a throwback to the first few seasons of Survivor, and it’s time has passed. After Hannah’s FTC performance, even she might have beaten him….

    2. Speaking of Hannah, she did so much better at FTC than I ever could’ve imagined. She wasn’t going to win, for all the reasons Andy, John, and everyone here articulated all season, but that was some good work.

    3. Congratulations Adam. You displayed some of the worst play I’ve ever seen, but also a lot of really good play. You were also entertaining, playing hard, always working, and you never gave up. Adam’s particular story was probably the one that reached me the most in the history of Survivor, and I make Andy look like an emotional wreck. He probably would’ve won either way, but I hope this brings some small amount of happiness to his family in a difficult time.

    I’m off to Colombia!! Enjoy the conversation everyone!

    • Other Scott

      Ken probably really regrets handing the win to Adam instead of David now.

      • One of the interesting parts from Adam’s RHaP interview was that apparently Adam did tell one other person about his mother whilst still in the game – and that person was Ken, before the David vote. He claims he knew Ken was struggling with the idea of voting David out, and wanted to give him a reason to feel good about keeping Adam in the game.

        If that’s true, Adam is a much savvier social player than we gave him credit for.

        • Other Scott

          That’s really weird on the show’s part then. Because they completely gave the credit for Ken’s flip to Hannah rather than their winner Adam, and really let Chris hang out to dry in the process.

          I think they already are worried about Adam being seen as using his dying Mom as manipulation to get jury votes (I have one non-Survivor watcher who thinks Adam is one of the worst human beings in existence for a) being out there when his mom was dying and b) using that with the jury), and they didn’t want their winner to be seen as using his dying mom to get saved in the Final 4 as well.

          • Conversely, there are commenters on here who I think would like Adam a lot more if they thought he was genuinely that manipulative. You know who you are.

          • Come On In Here

            I’ve always wondered if he was being manipulative, but everything from him seemed so genuine that I just can’t help but think that he was nothing but genuine. So, if he was being manipulative, count me as one of the fools he suckered.

        • Hornacek

          Yes, if that’s true it makes me feel a bit better about Adam.

          But then again it could be interpreted as Adam using his mother’s illness as a strategic tool, which I don’t know if I like.

          Conflicted!

  • Ms_Woozah

    In retrospect Adam’s “winner edit” seems more clear – there were just more players this time around that also got strong narratives that made it seem less obvious than other seasons. Adam made some pretty big blunders but turned it around when it counted. It’s pretty impossible to play a perfect game – you just have to have played a better game than the two people sitting next to you.

    Although I think it’s bullshit that Adam got the full credit when Hannah did most of the talking to Ken (according to what we were shown), and I’m surprised Hannah got 0 votes. But while I thought she had strong arguments at FTC, she repeatedly told them that she was responsible for everyone being there. No matter how “evolved in the game” the jury thinks they are, they still probably don’t like hearing it put so bluntly and preferred Adam’s less erratic, more humble style.

    • I wonder if Zeke really steered the “evolution of strategy” narrative in Ponderosa. Apparently, he talked “wrangling votes” in his Jury Speaks video, which seems like he is definitely more decided than what it seemed.

      • That’s interesting, because Zeke really seemed to dislike Adam. I’d assumed that if anyone had swung the jury at Ponderosa it would have been Jay.

        • Yes, but Zeke has his whole final five alliance in there with him…Jay just brought in Taylor and Michelle I bet.

    • Adam sitting there nodding solemnly as Chris mistakenly credited him for flipping Ken might be my favourite Adam moment of the game. For once, he looked a gift horse in the mouth and didn’t immediately put his foot in it (to mix a metaphor). Keep your mouth shut and take that credit, buddy!

      • Diego Armando

        Plus Ken chiming in that no one flipped him left no entry for Hannah to plausibly claim the credit that she actually deserved.

    • Kemper Boyd

      I put him in my fantasy team because I thought his edit in the first episode was clear. I’m glad I was right. I’m also really glad Colin Stone was wrong.

      • Diego Armando

        After listening to the fist episode of the podcast, I switched Mari for ADAM. That was great.

        • Kemper Boyd

          I switched Taylor because I hated him.

        • Sylvisual

          I swapped Adam for Zeke. That went well.

        • HBO CEO of Tits

          I stood pat with my Adam, Hannah, Micahela, Zeke team after 1, because they all looked good. I’ll finish respectably I assume, but David was too much of a point monster for me to place without him.

  • StormofCuteness

    Before reading anything, I just want to thank everyone at PRP for being my safe place away from all the negativity and horrors of 2016. You’re fun and funny and I’m grateful to have found such a great group to share my Survivor love with.
    Oh, and my fiance asked me who I thought would win before the show began, and I said, more confidently than I felt, Adam! I now feel justified in holding this over him and everyone forever. The End. 😉

    • Diego Armando

      Congrats. Thank you for being here.

  • Prom King

    Surprisingly fun, tense, surprising finale. Also very emotional but that wasn’t exactly a surprise.

    Adam is probably the only winner I wanted to win starting in the finale itself and because of reasons so specifically beyond the game (I read earlier about his mom passing). I don’t think I’ve felt that way about any other winner. I still think Ken played a really underrated game, certainly superior to Hannah’s (and I enjoyed him as a character more than Adam or Hannah), but by the time it came to the vote, I was hoping so hard it would be Adam.

    Final tribal with Hannah and Adam bickering back & forth right in front of stoic Ken was hilarious!

    Zeke is a favorite but I didn’t care for his question about “how you evolved the game” – ugh.

    Chris’ comment to Ken was also ridiculous since Adam clearly didn’t do any convincing. Although it’s funny to realize right now that it was yet another example of Chris being wrong. Chris is always wrong! Hope he’s better at being a lawyer than he is at reading people. Still, he made up for it by saying my favorite comment of the reunion, with his funny and good-natured dig at Bret.

    Loved how deep so many of the characters were this season. Other things I loved about the season: all the focus on social anxiety, all of the missed opportunities and misplayed idols, and all of THE EEEEEEMOTIOOOOOONS. And despite all of the emotions, very little petty mean-spiritedness, which has sort of curdled recent seasons like Koah Rong and especially Worlds Apart for me. This was a feel-good season.

    Favorite characters:
    1. Michaela
    2. Zeke
    3. Ken
    4. David
    5. Adam

  • turgid_legume

    Disjointed thoughts:

    1. The Legacy Advantage had the potential to be very interesting, but it turned out to be rather disappointing and inconsequential. Still, I can’t fault either the players or the producers for that; it was down to luck and circumstance. I’d rather have production in the lab tinkering with ideas than a static show. (And what ever happened to having the idols hidden at challenges? That was fucking amazing, you guys. Perhaps they realize how great it is and don’t want to overuse it, but that had better return next season.) The reward steal, however, I can do without.

    2. I might be in a minority but I thought Hannah did a really good job — or at least something far from the meltdown I expected — arguing her case at final tribal council. Coming in I felt strongly that Adam was a winner… and I still felt that way afterwards, but I at least thought Hannah would get two or three votes and Ken would get one or two. I’m fine with Adam winning regardless of the numbers, though I was hoping for a David win. Although the more I think about it, the editors really did a good job with Adam, because he really felt like a clumsy fool at times early in the game, so it’s to their credit (and to his) that he felt like a satisfying winner at the end.

    3. As apparently I’m a robot that has nothing
    buts cobwebs and coal tar where a heart should be, I felt nothing at
    all during Adam’s whole thing during the reunion. If anything I wanted it to just end already because having someone in tears sharing their personal nightmare on live television just doesn’t seem like a very good idea. Strangely I was more sad for Ken, as he looked very crestfallen and disappointed, staring downwards the whole time, as if he thought he was going to do better. I wanted to hear more from the rest of the cast and less about Adam, but conversely Jeff somehow did better than expected in that department. But what in the hell was the point behind revealing Michaela was returning but not mentioning Zeke? Did he think he was saving that surprise for later? But the cast had been leaked long ago… I don’t get it.

    • Kemper Boyd

      I think the Legacy Advantage’s main job is for future players to know it could exist and fuck up the final few tribals.

    • Hornacek

      I agree that Hannah did much better than expected at FTC. It was obvious from the jury’s questions that she wasn’t going to win, but if you take away Adam’s reveal about his mother and base your vote solely on FTC performance, I could be easily swayed into voting for Adam, who I thought did not do well at FTC, but (a) the jury was already going to vote for him, and (b) the reveal about his mother just sealed the deal.

  • Adam did it guys – he beat you. Adam beat you, he voted all of you out (except you, Bret), he is the reason that you don’t have your million dollars, and THIS TIME, Adam is not sorry.

  • Crappy

    This final 3 .. I think it was probably a very weak F3 but I think it is an very interesting use case for a survivor jury decisions. It will go down as one of most talked about results IMO. Lets look at all the 3 people there..

    Ken: I can’t believe I am saying this.. but I think Ken played the best game he could and had the least flaws to his his game than the other 2. He is not a survivor strategy expert like David, Zeke or Adam so he can’t play that numbers game. He picked an ally who could, built a solid alliance with Jessica, Hannah and somewhat with Adam as well. He used that to reach the F3 and then ultimately did make that one final strategic move. His game could be compared with some one like Denise.
    Ken’s problem was 2 fold
    – He did not make close relationships with people other than his core alliance. This is reflected in his relationship with other Gen X-ers.
    – Wrong jury for him. Every jury has its blind-spots and this one only ever wanted to vote for a player who played super hard. They could not see the winner of this season, possibly the most strategy heavy season alongside Cambodia, being an old school player like Ken. Even David, who was his closest ally, could not throw him a vote.

    Hannah: There is merit to her arguments in the TC that she controlled the votes to a large extent after some point in the merge. She was never blindsided at TC after the rock draw. I go see where the Dawn comparisons are coming off but I disagree with
    – Just like Dawn, Hannah is the one who was pivotal in a lot of big moves this season and essentially with her strategic game she drove the F3’s composition.
    – Unlike Dawn i don’t think her main problem was betraying her allies. I think that could have worked for her if she had a coherent narrative to her strategy. Jury just did not believe she had a long term view of what she wanted to do or despite her actually succeeding in her main motive, bought them as a good moves for her. In a meta way, just like a lot of convo this season regarding big moves, they did not go with results oriented way of evaluating someone’s strategic game.

    Adam: I love me some Sophie and for me she is one of the most insightful survivor commentators about (watch her recap of Tony’s game after LJ blindside).. and I think she had it bang on in the KIA that Adam’s relationship with jury can be encapsulated by the one with Jay. Most of the players did not always find him the best of ally or player, disliked him at certain points.. BUT.. they did still had some personal relationship with him, recognized that he was playing really hard and even if he could not execute all the moves he had the right strategy..
    – His narrative of openly targeting David after F6 worked for him in a same way as Sandra opposing Russell in HVV. Jury thought it was unpardonable to keep David in the game for so long and he was seen as the one most aware of the fact and pushing others to see the same. So in a funny way, he got the credit for Ken’s move against David when he had the least to do with it. Credit should go mostly to Ken and Hannah. But for the jury, they see only the narrative shown on TC and what David may have told them. David, who was firmly told by Adam that he knows the right move is to get him out, probably reinforced that opinion.
    – Despite the win ultimately he remains a player with good strategic ideas and poor execution… for example putting in the work to find 3 hidden items in a season has to be lauded .but telling Hannah about the idol was super dumb.. you just saw Jeremy not tell his close allies about the idol and use it perfectly.

    The biggest take away from this season IMO will be to see if this does signal a shift in how juries will rule from now onward.

    • prettyboyprobst

      I honestly expected a close vote between Ken and Adam, most likely with one or two stray hannah votes.

      I do wonder if the majority of the jury was blasting her outwardly for keeping David at f5 while secretly hoping for Bret to make f3, so they could vote for him. If that were the case, I think she made the right move in keeping David, as it protected her from Adam turning his back on her on the next vote, while both David and Brett would have beaten her and I’m not sure that there’s a big difference in their challenge prowess.

      Only 30 minutes in, but Sophie is fantastic on the podcasts. Not sure that I like her vocal fry melodic speech pattern, but I secretly love it!

      • Crappy

        I agreed with KIA take that Hannah’s move ended up helping Adam instead of herself. If Adam actually takes out David at F7, I don’t think he even reaches F3 . Again shades of Sandra benefiting from not able to get Russell out in HVV.
        I don’t think Bret’s ouster played a role. Essentially, jury thought voting out David was an obvious move to make F7 onward and not doing so hurt Hannah a lot. The fact that she disagrees with their take and want to champion her strategy is irrelevant since jury is going to vote based on their perception. Adam since F5 started to go after David as a huge threat in tribal councils, Hannah did nothing to suggest she thought the same. Adam created the narrative that he was the one who was trying his hardest to get David out and ended up getting credit for his boot… heck he flat out said at that F4 council that his goal at final IC was to make sure David did not win. Hannah needed to create the same narrative for her for jury to buy into her strategy.. just perking up at Final TC was not going to be enough.

        • prettyboyprobst

          I believe it was her intention for the F7 move to help both her and Adam, as she wanted him with her at F3 and couldn’t be sure that either of them would make it there (also a point made on KIA) if Ken goes rogue after losing David.
          It ended up being to Adam’s advantage, but I don’t think there was much she could do about that. As long as she wanted to stick with David and Ken (and them to stick with her), she couldn’t do more than make a few ominous statements at tribal about game plans and FTC speeches to communicate to the jury that she knows what she’s doing (I’ll have an eye on that on a rewatch). Adam gave the people what they want with his late and outspoken focus on David (there’s definitely some truth to your Sandra comparison, whom I also love), which was enough, even though he arguably had to be saved at times from his own bravery.

          It appears to me that it was enough because juries, despite having nothing but time on their hands, tend not to overthink and rather engage in group think. To sit around at Ponderosa and act like one finalist hasn’t played at all and the other couldn’t possibly know what she’s doing, so let’s lock it in for the guy we saw was ineffective until his goal lined up with theirs, is downright lazy to me. (haven’t yet watched the latest videos, including Ponderosa and “jury speaks”- lazy me!)
          It’s fine to vote for Adam because they like him better, had a more personal relationship with him, admire his story or even because they like his game, but they shouldn’t have acted like he played by far the best game of the three.

          I could go on and on, but I also want to touch on your outlook on future juries from the last sentence of your original post: Please don’t! The worst part of FTC was Zeke lecturing Ken and in the process basically telling future players: “Hey, is everything going smoothly and working in your favor? Then it’s time to shake things up and make a big move, else nobody is going to respect your game, fool!”
          If people actually start to play by his standards, the Survivor age of Stupid Moves is upon us. (Looking forward to @John’s rant on this.)

    • Kemper Boyd

      This is the weakest F3 for a really long time for me. But it shows that as long as you get there and you don’t sit next to someone more dangerous you can win. Hannah’s mistake was she 100% needed to be with Sunday and Will to have a shot at winning.

      • Alycia Swift

        I actually thought San Juan Del Sur’s final 3 was weaker. Yes, the other two got votes but only from their loved ones.

        • Kemper Boyd

          Natalie was much stronger than Adam and to me that takes it over the edge. Natalie made big moves down the stretch to win, Adam bumbled, played two idols incorrectly and won.

          • Alycia Swift

            I did not actually mean Natalie though. I love her. It was the other two I meant as being weak which made the final 3 weaker. Although I don’t think any other of the last 6 players from that season would have been stronger. I love Keith but he was not a strategic player.

          • Kemper Boyd

            But she is part of the final 3. This is an all round weak final 3. There is no stand out player in the 3.

          • corndogshuffle

            Yeah this final three was brutal, especially considering how much most of us (me included) were in love with this final six. Two people were goats and one would have been a goat if at least two or three other players in the final six were swapped in.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I really wasn’t that in love with the top 6. David and Jay were good players I really liked. Bret is fine, funny but not a big enough character, Hannah made herself a goat, she’s goat Aubry, Ken is pretty but bland and Adam is just a nice guy but nothing special.

          • I’m not sure that it’s a weak final 3 – just a relatively evenly matched final 3.

            I saw a lot of complaints this year about there being no standout players or whatever, but I thought what casting had done was cast a lot of players who all had a pretty good handle on strategy – who had the ability not just to make moves of their own, but counter/neutralise other peoples’. The fact that no one was really able to maintain a stranglehold on things can be viewed not as universally low-level gameplay, but universally strong, if you want to take a more optimistic view on it. Pretty much any one of them would elevate some of the weaker Survivor casts.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            Exactly. Somebody was comparing MvGX to Gabon because the gameplay was chaotic, nobody really had a strong grip on the game, and the winner was a bit random. I think you’re getting at the essentially difference, though. Gabon was an evenly matched cast of absolutely terrible players, MvGX was an evenly matched cast of very good players. Big difference.

          • Oooh, let’s rank losing finalists.*

            1. Becky and Ozzy
            2. Russell and Parvati
            3. Aubry and Tai
            4. Spencer and Tasha
            5. Sabrina and Chelsea
            6. Coach and Albert
            7. Amanda and Courtney
            8. Ken and Hannah
            9. Russell and Mick
            10. Gervase and Monica
            11. Lisa and Skupin
            12. Chase and Sash
            13. Carolyn and Will
            14. Dawn and Sherri
            15. Jaclyn and Missy
            16. Phillip and Nat Ten
            17. Sugar and Susie
            18. Cassandra and Dreamz

            *Rankings are based on perceived value of the pair combined, not individually (ie. Carolyn is dragged down by Will’s dead weight etc)

          • If you had to vote for one of them, individual bracket:

            1. Aubry
            2. Russell (HvV edition)
            3. Ozzy
            4. Coach
            5. Amanda
            6. Spencer
            7. Russell (Samoa edition)
            8. Sabrina
            9. Carolyn
            10. Dawn
            11. Hannah
            12. Chase
            13. Lisa
            14. Gervase
            15. Sugar
            16. Missy
            17. Phillip
            18. Dreamz

          • Purple Rock Emma

            You’d pick Russell over Parvati??

          • I thought the jury might go for Russell in that pairing. Could go either way though.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            But Parv got votes in the actual tribal council that happened and Russell didn’t get any.

          • Fair enough, she can win then. It’s not really the rock that I wish to die on either way.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            Addendum: In the three post Cook Islands F2s, would an F3 have made a difference?

            Micronesia: Definitely yes? (I haven’t seen it, but I vaguely understand this is the case)
            Tocantins: Absolutely not.
            Cagayan: Definitely yes (in the parallel universe where Woo isn’t quite such a dope).

            Put Micronesia’s 2 and 3 (any combination) below Aubry and Tai (again I’m guessing here), Stephen and Erinn below Amanda and Courtney, and Woo and Kass below Chase and Sash).

          • Also, Natalie had a solid FTC performance where she actually had to vouch for her game while Jaclyn got asked basically the same question twice and everyone was mad at Missy.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Missy played favourites and unluckily her favourites were either sitting next to her, her daughter or voting for Jac. Natalie fully explained every moment of her game. Plus she opened by saying it was a mistake for her to be there, which is my favourite opening ever.

          • Yeap. She is definitely in contention for the best winning finale with her epic idol play at F5, her speech at F4 which should have been a red flag to Missy and Jaclyn about what she is capable of at FTC, and of course, her excellent FTC performance. Even Jeremy’s horrible half Murphy doesn’t taint it.

          • Kemper Boyd

            you just gotta, guys you just gotta like give it to her

          • I can’t believe “she balled out” isn’t as iconic as “stick to the plan” or “basically a badass” for SJDS phrases.

          • Kemper Boyd

            She did fucking ball out though. In my illness fugue state last night I watched the SJDS finale in the bath and it still did it for me. Maybe my single favourite episode.

          • I have a weird relationship with that finale. I didn’t watch the first thirty minutes of it live because I thought Keith was going out at 5th, but as soon as I found out from the IMDB message boards that he was immune, I tuned in just before that tribal. I honestly believe that episode in particular is what made me into the fan that I am today.

          • Crappy

            Adam’s second idol still saved him going out at F5… otherwise there is a good chance David, Ken and Hannah vote him out instead of the Bret plan

          • Kemper Boyd

            This is true but he’s still lucky Hannah turned around and was willing to vote out David over him at 4. He should never have told anyone about it and just played it on himself. He won despite himself and that’s probably a testament to how mediocre he as as a player and how nice he is as a man.

          • Crappy

            Yeap.. very bad mistake to tell Hannah about the idol… NQAT. I think Adam embodies the concept of knowing something but not being able to execute it properly.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Yet he won!

          • He won because he shouldn’t have told Hannah about the idol…but that shouldn’t have mattered because HANNAH SHOULD HAVE BEEN FINE WITH GETTING RID OF DAVID. His inexplicable decision got cancelled out by her even more inexplicable one.

        • Other Scott

          At least San Juan Del Sur had Natalie. Adam is very much not the same level player Natalie was.

          This is the worst for me since Gabon, I even think Nicaragua’s final 3 was better.

      • Assistant Dragon Slayer

        But the weakness or strength of the F3 isn’t an accident–the people in the F3 put themselves there and kept others off. It’s kind of a paradox–a weak F3 means they did something right (making them in some sense a strong F3), and a strong F3 means something went wrong (making them a weak F3).

        • Kemper Boyd

          This is true but I think it often means there weren’t any great players in a season. I think it holds true here. Adam didn’t play well, Hannah did a Dawn even if I said she didn’t earlier and Ken is a handsome boring weirdo. But David wasn’t good enough to hold control for long, Jay was almost never on the right side of the vote and they are the best two players all season.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            I agree. I’ve said all season that this cast is highly clustered on the bell curve. No truly great players, but also few or no truly deplorable players/human beings.

          • Kemper Boyd

            just. Taylor.

          • Other Scott

            I disagree, I think a final tribal of the perceived weakest players is exactly what you get if everyone is playing at top strategy. If the strong players don’t have weaker players propping up their game, as soon as their perceived as strong they’re toast.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            I think we may not be disagreeing, actually. I think the biggest innovation in the recent past (even more than Tony’s all-moves-all-the-time) is Jeremy’s meat shield strategy*. ADAM didn’t use the words “meat shield” in his RHAP interview, but that’s what his strategy amounted to**. So I think the perceived strongest player going out at 4-6 is going to become even more common, and we may have to rethink what being the strongest player on Survivor means.

            *Jeremy may not have been the first, but he named and codified it.

            **Yeah, interviews aren’t canon; ADAM’s had months to self-justify his game.

          • Other Scott

            That’s why I think Cambodia’s strategy may have actually been even weaker than this season, because I think people knew Jeremy was the biggest threat to win, they just either couldn’t or didn’t want to do anything about it, or in Spencer’s case, waited until too late.

            I actually think Jeremy and David played pretty much identical games, the difference is Jeremy won the final immunity challenge and David did not.

          • Oooh, I like this take. Does that make Adam the Spencer who actually won?

          • Other Scott

            I think it’s more like Hannah=Spencer, Ken=Tasha, Kelley=Adam

        • Crappy

          I am not sure I agree with this.. it essentially is similar to the logic that if you reached the end, you did better than those who could not. I don’t survivor game play is that simple.
          This was always going to be a weak F3 ever since Hannah and Ken became goats. Just watch the jury videos, no one wants to vote for them. It only became a weaker one when David could not be there but was replaced by Adam, who whilst being a strategically sound player, could not execute his plans this season.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            It’s just the nature of the endgame: Everybody who has a legitimate shot at winning is simultaneously trying to get themselves and their weakest possible opponents into the FTC. The only exceptions I can think of are Kim Spradlin and Woo Hwang, who took stronger opponents along for very different reasons. That means the F3 is always going to be weaker than it could have been, given the choices available in the endgame. So somebody somewhere is always going to call it a “weak F3”.

            I can’t really construct a scenario in which Jay, David, and ADAM would have been the F3, but it would have to involve multiple screw-ups.

          • Other Scott

            Honestly I think the 3 weakest players in the finale made it to the FTC. I think Bret was a much better player than Adam this season.

          • But also a much less interesting player. Adam gave good TV. As Survivor gets increasingly meta, I think this begins to count for more.

          • Crappy

            Agreed .. but I meant this was a weak F3 in the sense that all 3 of the players played highly flawed game. Generally even in a weak F3, you have one player who was a major force that season. I think last time we had such a F3 was Nicaragua perhaps.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            OK, I get what you’re saying. It makes sense that there’s often a major force in the game in an F3 since the whole purpose of going to an F3 was to avoid weak F2s.

            And of course the other weak F3 that immediately comes to mind is Gabon. I guess the lesson is that a weak F3 will give you either arguably the worst season in the show’s history or arguably a top 10 season, and nothing in between.

        • I agree with this – I thought it was an asset to the season that David went out, because that was the right move for them to have made. Even though David probably deserved to win, I would rather have a F3 where everyone in it made the best game move open to them.

    • Purple Rock Emma

      I thought Sophie did a really great job on KIA. Lots of insight.

      • Alycia Swift

        Yes, but I wanted for the first time ever to smack Stephen. He was rude, cutting her off several times.

        • Hornacek

          In Stephen’s defense, he’s not used to directing the flow of KIA.

          • Alycia Swift

            That was not it though. He directed the flow in general ok. But he cut her off when she was trying to make a point more than once.

          • Purplerockmatt

            this is weird to say, but i have actually stopped listening to know it alls on a regular basis because while I still love Rob, Stephen has really begun to irritate me. Like a lot.

          • Maybe being on a modern season has really changed how Stephen looks at the game…who knows?

          • Other Scott

            The Know It Alls is far from my favourite survivor podcast, but it remains the only thing up the next morning after the episode has aired. Which is when I need to hear someone talk about it the most.

          • There’s a podcast that I like called “You’ve Got Treemail” that is usually up the morning after. They are definitely more focused on the story and edit (but not edgic) of the season, so they were definitely on Sharcy’s side about MvGX.

          • Other Scott

            That actually sounds really good.

            (And I’m also on Sharcy’s side about the season. I would go so far as to call it slightly below average for the show.)

          • Hornacek

            Bur normally Rob directs the flow of conversation with Steven joining in the conversation. This time Stephen directed it but maybe he still felt it was his job to speak up.

            And I’ve heard Rob interrupt Stephen on KIA plenty of times.

      • Kemper Boyd

        I think she is a really good addition to KIA. I prefer her to Stephen to be honest.

      • Max_Jets

        Sophie always kind of blows me away with her takes. It feels like she can see right through the edit and is able to read people as though she were on the island with them. I believe she is probably one of the best Survivor players ever, but we’d need to see her play again to know.

        • Reportedly, she was cut last minute for Aubry for 34. She was in the running for a long time and then a week before the finale she tweeted something like “I don’t want to see the better version of me win, thanks” which signaled that she was mad about something.

          • Max_Jets

            I think it sounded a bit friendlier than that, but that is a bummer. I am a big fan of both but I might have preferred Sophie. Aubry would definitely be back for another season anyways, but Sophie will at least be on the all winners season eventually.

          • It was that tweet combined with her tweet about getting the new hair cut to look more like a model that made me wonder what CBS or Production told her.

      • Other Scott

        I always think Sophie is a little bit in left field on a lot of the things she said. Like I think the fact she thought Ken was winning until the last few jurors makes me think she’s not quite as plugged in as a lot of people say she is.

        And what was up with Stephen saying Ken and Michele are basically the same? They are nothing alike as players except they both don’t have a lot of moves to their name.

  • It might already have been said below, but I think one of the reasons I was so satisfied with an Adam win, maybe even more so than I would have been with a David win, was that it did ultimately come about through everyone making the best possible moves for them that episode (eventually).

    Adam spent the entire episode trying to make the case to his allies to get rid of both Jay and David, and he was entirely right in both cases that those were the biggest threats. David was only even still in the game because his allies had ignored opportunities to take him out, and much as he might have been the best player over the season, I didn’t actually see him doing a huge amount of strategic manoeuvring over the latter part of the season – it was consistently presented as Hannah and Ken failing to listen to reason and take their shot, rather than David actively saving himself. Had David made the final it would have felt like Ken and Hannah were just handing him and he was benefiting from their poor play, rather than something he’d really had to earn for himself.

    Instead, Hannah and Ken did finally pull the trigger and make standout moves for their game – Ken in finally accepting that he needed to actually play if he wanted to win, and Hannah genuinely asserting herself and flipping Ken with a good, well-reasoned argument. They came crashing up against something that nobody could have planned for in Adam’s story, but as things were it led to a genuinely exciting final tribal council where, had the chips fallen differently, it felt like they all had a shot at winning votes.

    Adam wasn’t the best player on the season, but he was far from the worst as well. He consistently had interesting ideas, even if the execution was off, and his read on who the threats were and who needed to go was pretty much always correct. Even his big flaws turned into assets by the end – somewhere along the way, the ‘bull in the china shop’ narrative seemed to get reframed as the straight-talking, honest player – he flat-out told both Jay and David that he was voting them out to improve his own chances, and they respected him for it, and voted for him in the end. Even Taylor voted for him. I think his ups and downs actually make the season more interesting, and it’ll be a cool one to watch again and try to work out how it actually happened.

    • Sadie

      I think it probably isn’t giving David enough credit to say he wasn’t helping himself at the end. Ultimately Hannah and Ken have to decide if they want to do what he’s pushing but he always had some kind of plan. At final 7 he was the one sitting on the beach with Ken and Hannah saying that they couldn’t put the votes in Jay because the idol would send him home. At final 6 he talked to Hannah about working with Jay as a shield and he seemed to consider it.
      At five he was again suggesting to Ken and Hannah that they vote Adam out but then Hannah told him about the idol so they stopped it from backfiring.

      Ultimately I totally agree about Adam though. It is fun to watch a game that is honest in it’a depiction of strengths and weaknesses and Adam’s bluntness served him well with the people he was booting but also it made his agenda VERY clear to the jury, which allowed him to take a lot of credit.

      (His conflicting argument about keeping shields in the game while calling out Hannah for voting out the nonthreats was not great though)

      • I guess Adam could argue that he had the chance to get rid of David earlier, and chose to boot Will instead, so that was once instance where he did deliberately keep a shield around. But yes, it undermined his argument a bit.

  • Kemper Boyd

    So I’m commenting from just before the final 4 tribal.
    I’m sure every comment I want to make is made below but I can’t read because it will spoil it.
    But Hannah is not Dawn. Dawn’s decisions were very very good strategic decisions but did it from a place where the person she voted for had strong emotional bonds with her. Hannah is a moron who keeps telling people she is with them and then votes them out even though they are trying to make the better move for her.
    I will defend Dawn on this, she couldn’t win because everyone felt personally betrayed by her in an emotional way, Hannah they are just pissed that she’s flipped and was being really dumb too.

  • Brian Gold

    For all of the talk about the “evolution of the game,” the jury here voted for… the guy they liked the most. Hannah was viewed as a flip-flopper who betrayed most of the jury (like Twila) and Ken was viewed as a hypocrite by most of the jury and didn’t have strong friendships (like Wiglesworth or Lil). Adam was likable-enough and nobody felt like he in particular betrayed them. He kept relationships with the other side (Jay, for example) and people liked him after all of it. But, you know, I guess Probst gets off on the idea that he changed the game single-handedly as Executive Producer.

    • Diego Armando

      I don’t disagree. I also don’t fault Probst, he has to sell the show and big, flashy moves make people want to watch it.

    • While all of that is true, it also seems like Adam made the most respectable big moves of the three. It was his decision to take out Figgy to weaken Taylor and Jay, it looked like he was the swing in the early pre-merge, and he made a pretty flashy showing (pun intended?) out of playing his idol on Hannah. Hannah was attacked for being a flipper, but I think she could’ve gotten some votes if her various flips had made more sense.

      • HBO CEO of Tits

        Hannah’s problem was when she voted out David, it read to the jury as “yes, you were right all along, I just didn’t want to do it with you, specifically, juror number 4.”

      • I think we have all forgotten how grateful we were to Adam at the time for taking out Figgy. All you Adam haters sit down and watch episode 5 again, and think about what might have been.

      • Brian Gold

        I think Adam won because he kept trying to take David out, to the point that people associated him with that movement. Just as Sandra was so anti-Russell vocally that it won her the anti-Russell votes. He knew the jury and cast felt David was a huge threat and tried and kept trying. It wasn’t that Adam actually made big moves (taking out Figgy is about the only thing), it’s that people saw him trying to take out the big threat.

    • Ms. Sweaterfan

      I agree that the jury just voted for who they liked the best. And even worse, I think it was pretty clear that most of the jury had made their minds up before final tribal even started. I really thought Hannah did a good job at FTC and should have at least earned a few votes with her performance.

      • Purplerockmatt

        FTC doesn’t matter anymore, everyone has made up their minds before it starts

        • When did that shift really happen? I think you still hears jurors bring up solid FTC performances while voting in South Pacific and Nicaragua, but it seems like around Philippines, you really get the groupthink of it all.

          • Alycia Swift

            Wasn’t there a time when the jury was actually kept apart? Or at Ponderosa but not allowed to talk about the game? Probably after those thing stopped.

          • I know that Jeff asked them during the AO finale if they had talked about their votes at all and they said no, which I believe because Rodger/Elisabeth voted differently and Jerri/Amber voted differently.

        • Brian Gold

          Final Tribal Council has rarely mattered. 3 times, the vote has swung. Marquesas, Neleh bombed and lost. China, Amanda bombed and lost. Micronesia, Amanda bombed and lost. Some have argued that Coach lost at the South Pacific Final Tribal as well. The rest of it is just a vote or two moving here or there. The difference is now that there’s more unanimity, not that they haven’t made up their mind.

      • I think Adam’s strategy at final tribal council was a good one – Hannah did a great job arguing in favour of her moves, and had he left her to it and just made the argument for HIS moves, maybe she’d have swayed some people. Instead he argued strongly for why two of the main moves she was citing were bad ones, and he clearly won that fight.

        In board gaming terms, it’s executing a strategy of identifying where your opponent is getting their XP and trying to block them, rather than just focusing on your own pieces and hope you can rack up more XP than they can before the game ends.

        • Hornacek

          I’ve played so much Dragon Age and Baldur’s Gate that it’s hard to remember that there are games where everyone doesn’t get the same amount of XP when you complete a task.

    • Assistant Dragon Slayer

      That’s surely true as far as it goes. That’s how the person who was clearly third-most responsible for Ken backstabbing David got credit for it. The jury voting for who they like best has always been true and always will be true until juries are given criteria that they have to base their decision on (which would be absurd). I think people like us who like the strategic game had to make our peace with that last season. But the evolution of the game refers more to how you get to the end.

      Also, “flip-flopper” is precisely what Hannah was not. She voted in complete lockstep with Ken and David the entire post-merge. She was a… tease maybe?

      • Sylvisual

        She was a tease at the reunion, too…

      • Brian Gold

        Hannah took out the Millennials at the merge and turned on them (Jay, Taylor, and Michele). She turned on Zeke and Will. She burned a lot of people to stick with Ken, David, and Adam. More than you realize. No, she didn’t flip every single vote, but she betrayed people who she kept telling she was with and swearing her loyalty to. Repeatedly. That makes people upset.

        • Hornacek

          But I thought this was the jury that wasn’t bitter and respected gameplay and didn’t vote by hurt feelings.

        • Assistant Dragon Slayer

          I understand all of that, I just think that because the jury called Hannah a flip-flopper we’ve all internalized it. She’s a flip-flopper in a social game sense, but in the actual-vote sense she was the exact opposite of a flip-flopper. The worst of both worlds! If for some reason you didn’t watch the show but only looked at the voting record, you would think she was every bit as much of a pocket vote for David as Ken was.

    • Figaro

      I almost think that the true “evolution” of the game is actually that players are nowdays much more likely to genuinely see it as just a game and have ‘no hard feelings’ when they get voted out, compared to the bitterness and anger of (some) older seasons. As mentioned in the recap, David and (someone else who I forget) were having an open discussion about how their best move was to vote each other out and there was no judgement or vindictiveness and just an overall sense of high-level gameplay

      • That was Adam, I think. And yes, it was great. David suggesting that as Ken wasn’t going to flip, it would really make more sense for Adam and Hannah to turn on each other. And Adam was just all “yes, but if I do that I won’t win, so what’s the point?”.

        Adam has been the master this season of stabbing people in the front, and to their credit they’ve taken it pretty well.

      • Brian Gold

        Right. There are still emotions, but they are less heightened. But that’s a “know your cast” thing. You still have people who are raw and angry about being blindsided and betrayed. The thing is, that’s not some wrongful “bitterness or anger,” it’s part of the design of the game. You have to vote people out and then convince them to vote for you. Jurors have always been bitter. This cast seemed less bitter than others, but I think it’s more of an anomaly how friendly they were after everything than a trend of what’s to come. And ultimately, people were still really angry at Hannah for feeling like she was responsible (whereas Adam tried to get out David), and felt Ken was a hypocrite.

  • Kemper Boyd

    OH NO
    Michaela didn’t get how bad it looked when she was doing the seashells til she watched it on tv. THAT WAS AFTER SHE FILMED THE NEXT SEASON!

    • Eep.

      Yeah, I was trying to read the faces of the people Jeff brought out for S34, to see if there were any tells about how well they did. “Perennial Favorite” Ozzy came out last and looked pretty happy; I’M TERRIFIED.

      • Of course, I am convinced that Ozzy would have hammed it in front of the cameras even if he did badly.

        • Alycia Swift

          So he can get time #5.

        • Kemper Boyd

          Or he just got laid again?

          • Very distinct possibility.

          • Kemper Boyd

            the question is fan favourite Sierra Dawn Thomas or Hali Ford? Hali Ford I bet.

          • See part of me can see that with her surfer dudette personality, but part of me cannot see her abiding with his douchiness. However, we know one person who can abide with a lot of douchiness and that is SDT.

          • Kemper Boyd

            full name her or GTFO

          • Nope, can’t abide it. I already did not like her from Worlds Apart and now I have to deal with her for another season. #Yikes

          • Alycia Swift

            Me 2. Though many were way worse.

          • Kemper Boyd

            That is why you must also call her my her fullname “Fan Favourite Sierra Dawn Thomas”.

          • Let me go throw up now.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Fun story I vomited in the street yesterday walking home from work.

          • Hornacek

            That is a fun story.

          • andythesaint

            I suspect Hali might be with Malcolm.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Malcolm is in a happy relationship with So Kim thought right?
            Look what you’ve made me do, I’m looking at his instagram for signs they are still together.

          • Pretty sure I saw something a few months ago that implied Malcolm is single now.

          • Hornacek

            @disqus_GpYJ355BVM:disqus can you confirm this?

          • I heard rumors around the time of the leaked early cast for season 34 (which featured both of them) that So and Malcolm are no longer dating, but there has been no verification.

          • That makes a lot of sense. Both are extremely well educated yet want to be beach bums.

      • Kemper Boyd

        attention. I think he’s always happy with attention.

  • Kemper Boyd

    “Next Season we are bringing together the most competitive group of players every assembled”
    And Sierra Dawn Thomas.

    • And Troy. And Hali Ford.

      • Kemper Boyd

        I forgot about them but I will never drop the …and Sierra Dawn Thomas. Although I suppose she really blazed a trail for absurdly tall women on Survivor. (if we ignore Kim).
        http://funny115.com/v3/104-13-70-2.jpg

        Also I’m 99% sure I’m putting her in my fantasy team. I want to claim Cirie, Sandra, Ciera, Sierra now. It’s a obvious name based choice and I’m also aiming to come last.

        • Roswulf

          Sarah over Sandra surely (in the sole context of name-based fantasy teams).

          • Kemper Boyd

            NO. I WILL NOT HAVE A FANTASY TEAM NEXT SEASON THAT DOESN’T HAVE SANDRA ON IT. NNNNOOOOO

          • Roswulf

            Your logic is compelling.

            I do hope the group of similarly named women ally, and at least one crucial boot is determined by a spelling error by their foes. Preferably a spelling error by Ozzie.

          • Kemper Boyd

            If we have Sierra, Ciera and Cirie in the same tribe at any point I hope they stick a spelling chart with each photo next to it up for everyone.

          • Alycia Swift

            Or Jeff can just use the last names.

          • Kemper Boyd

            They are women, that is madness.

          • Alycia Swift

            Didn’t Wentworth and Wigglesworth get that?

          • corndogshuffle

            Yes, but he definitely didn’t have a choice. He couldn’t say Kelly or even Kelly W because both work for both of them.

          • Alycia Swift

            He could have said Old Kelly and Young Kelly or Blonde Kelly and Brunette Kelly. 🙂

          • Kemper Boyd

            I’d have taken OG Kelly.

          • Alycia Swift

            and New Wave Kelly?

          • I was thinking Invisible Kelley, which could be ironic for those just watching Cambodia and not SJDS.

          • corndogshuffle

            Millennial Kelly and Gen X Kelly!

            Too soon?

          • Kemper Boyd

            Oh lord I just googled and Wentworth is only 3 months older than me. No way!

          • corndogshuffle

            Now I need to find out who my Survivor counterpart is.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I need to find one even closer to my age now.

          • corndogshuffle

            As far as I can tell the Survivor who is closest to me in age is… Purple Kelly. *sigh*

          • Kemper Boyd

            oh no. poor you.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I just found mine. She’s 4 days younger than me and her name is Semhar.

          • corndogshuffle

            That’s… not the best. Unless you love “spoken word”.

            Forgot to look at 1989… Purple Kelly is not the answer. Spencer Duhm is only 25 days older than me. Would have preferred Purple Kelly, her invisibility is more interesting than anything Spencer ever did. Although when he played he was the youngest Survivor ever.

          • We are super close in age. She’s maybe 2 weeks younger than me. I’m in between Semhar and Joaquin.

          • andythesaint

            Looks like Becky Lee is the closest in age to me. Her birthday is on September 11th.

          • corndogshuffle

            You’re a finalist! Congrats!

          • Alycia Swift

            So is mine.

          • Hornacek

            For me it’s … Chris Daughtery. I’m 11 days older than him. I’ll take it.

          • My counterpart is Katie Hanson, who is only a day older than me…boo.

          • Diego Armando

            I am one day older than Liz Markham and 3 days older than Jaclyn Schultz. I was born in the same year as Jon Misch and was at Michigan State at the same time, although I doubt he was studying in Zoology.

          • Hornacek

            Old Kelly and Kelley Classic?

          • Kemper Boyd

            Only because they are both Kell(e)y and Wiglesworth is an iconic character and Wentworth fully earnt it. They are the only surnamed women in apart from Dawson who demanded it. Also JT’s surname is Thomas and Ciera and Cirie have both played multiple times so can’t change their names now.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            S34 tribe spoiler: Sarah, Cirie, and Sierra Dawn Thomas are all on the same tribe.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Post merge Sarah, Sierra, Ciera, Cirie, Sandra all together. I doubt they all make it though.

        • andythesaint

          You can never drop it. Sierra Dawn Thomas is now an unstoppable meme. (But only with the middle name).

          • Kemper Boyd

            That is Fan Favourite Sierra Dawn Thomas to you.

        • Something Quirky

          Huh my permission to look at that link was denied.

          • Kemper Boyd

            It’s from the Funny115 of Rodneyisms where he says he’s one of the biggest dudes and it shows that Sierra was the tallest person on her season.

        • Other Scott

          So SDT SDT Cirie Ciera

          • Kemper Boyd

            OMG I DIDN’T NOTICE!
            Welp @John this better be my damn team now.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Also this is exactly why Fan Favourite Sierra Dawn Thomas must never be referred to as SDT there is one Queen of Survivor and that is S.andra D.iaz T.wine.

      • corndogshuffle

        Well, Troy certainly is competitive in his own way.

        • Diego Armando

          I assume you mean competitive in the same way sportscasters refer to a player as a competitor.

          • corndogshuffle

            That is the direction I was heading.

      • Diego Armando

        Hali was someone I actually wanted to see again. I found her entertaining and thought she had a decent handle on strategy.

    • Alycia Swift

      Did anyone see that the logo only has a male figure in it?

      • Kemper Boyd

        nope it has both, (I just googled).

        • Alycia Swift

          The one on the Entertainment Weekly page with the article with Jeff Probst only has one figure – male. Unless I just can’t see a female. It may have been changed.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Yep that is not the one I found on google. Huh. Well we’ll see. Bloody sexists!

          • Alycia Swift

            Maybe the PR department gave EW an early draft of a logo and then changed it.

          • Sylvisual

            The show has often had a habit of showcasing unfinished logos. So I’d think the EW version is more final. Brings it in line visually with the OG logos.

          • Alycia Swift

            If so, its the male-only one.

    • Hornacek

      I’m hoping Jeff calls her “Sierra Dawn Thomas” on the show due to Ciera also being on.

      Or he should call them “Ciera with a C” and “Sierra with an S”.

      • Kemper Boyd

        did you know Ciera voted out her mom?

        • Dezbot

          GET OUT!

          • Kemper Boyd

            When Jeff said it in her intro and actually said “oh Jeff come on!” out loud.

      • corndogshuffle

        I hope Jeff decides to give them last name treatment. Mostly because I think it would be great if he called Sierra “Thomas” all season.

        • andythesaint

          JT would be confused.

          • He is now known as James since adults don’t go by initials, or so I have been told.

          • andythesaint

            He will be JT whether he wants it or not. Cochran’s dad couldn’t call him John.

          • Good point…

          • Hornacek

            Plus by that point he had gone Hollywood.

          • corndogshuffle

            Damn it.

      • I hope he doesn’t do Sierra Dawn Thomas because I am already sick of hearing about Sierra Dawn Thomas.

        • Hornacek

          Wait … are you saying that Sierra Dawn Thomas is on next season? The Sierra Dawn Thomas?

          • Yes, the most Monica Culpepper-y person who is not Monica Culpepper, it’s SDT.

          • Alycia Swift

            So she’s a neat lady?

          • I beat she calls herself that.

          • Other Scott

            Don’t you dare insult Monica Culpepper around me

          • I can and I will and I want to.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Fan Favourite Sierra Dawn Thomas to you sir.

      • Kemper Boyd

        He will only ever say “Ciera who voted out her mom” and “Sierra who did nothing”.

    • Other Scott

      I am standing on my pedestal and saying Sierra Dawn Thomas was a much better player than people have given her any credit for.

      And I don’t know how she was a game changer, but I do think bringing her back makes a lot of sense. She has the potential to be a dynamic player and was stuck on a season where her best strategy was to just do nothing.

      • Assistant Dragon Slayer

        So… the next Wentworth?

        I actually have the same hunch (and it’s no more than a hunch) about Hali.

      • Kemper Boyd

        She refused to do anything repetitively she had chances to swap things up. I know Mike winning every immunity ruined the chances but she could have made moves on ROdney but never did.

        • andythesaint

          She was the exact opposite of a game changer. She consistently refused to change the game.

          • corndogshuffle

            She fought the system! Screw big moves! Game Changer!

          • Hornacek

            He’s right! Give us hell, Quimby!

        • Diego Armando

          Her plan was to go to the end with Rodney, thinking she could beat him. Turns out Rodney had other plans.

      • gouis

        Naw

  • Alycia Swift

    This article does not show on the web page. I was having trouble last night and still do not see it.

    • I’ll try contacting our web host’s customer support to see if they can figure it out. Because I’m not sure what’s happening.

      • Kemper Boyd

        it has happened to me before.

  • Something Quirky

    The channel here that broadcasts US Survivor (and made the failed first attempt at Australian Survivor) actually showed the finale live! But I didn’t know about it until afterwards 🙁

  • Crappy

    So since there has been some talk over.. if Adam won just due to his personal story .. or about the general jury stance .. I watched all the jury videos and noted down some key bits –

    Michelle – wants to vote for adam.. more aggressive strategist.. connected with adam on a personal level .. 90% sure adam unless one of Hannah or Ken put in a crazy FTC performance.

    Taylor – thinks adam has got it in the bag.. hannah is the goat..

    Chris – adam gets his vote

    Jessica – others told her hannah had commitment issues and she saw that at rocks council herself. Reason to vote for adam will be the attempts to make moves, had the right balance between being strategic and being a threat. jury frustrated with ken since they think he started to play on day 33.

    Zeke – wrangling votes, wants to vote for strategic player, hates hangers on, jury was frustrated that david was not taken earlier.. move was to take david. People who can take credit for David’s ouster will get the win! Wants Hannah to articulate her strategy to get the win. Knows Adam was playing hard.. not necessarily playing well.. makes the point about not being to execute his plans.

    Will – credits hannah for david move. adam – sound strategy.. no execution.. not his fault that he could not control things.

    Sunday – did not like how 2 people in F3 played, liked one. Ken made one big strategic move… nothing else, Hannah can’t say anything to get her vote.. Adam was good at bringing people together

    Jay – credits adam for david going out.. he did good in his opinion.

    Bret – hates kennah, in the tank for adam – thinks adam was the one who got dave out in the end.

    David – does not explicitly states but video makes it clear that he is strongly leaning towards Adam. Thinks Hannah made irrational moves and that players considered Ken a goat, being a provider is not enough. Adam had right strategy throughout and played hard. Does mention that a Jeremy style speech can sway him.

    So even for the FTC .. Bret, Taylor, Michele, Jay, Chris, Sunday are already in the bag for Adam. On top of that.. David, Jessica strongly leaning towards Adam. Even Zeke says he was trying to sway jury towards one person and it has gotta be Adam. Will’s the only one left…

    I think for Hannah it is damning that David thought that she made poor strategic decisions. Same for Ken, even his closest ally David said he had no clue about strategy. No wonder neither got credit from jury for the david vote out.

    • This is just so bizarre. I am not confused by Adam’s win, but I am confused by the shut-out based on these reads. For a season with wild strategy moves, only one really counted for most of the people and some of them miscredited that move.

      • Crappy

        Ken and Hannah simply did not create any narrative about their move to vote David out. If you break it down

        – Jury since F7 thought targeting David was the best move.
        – Only Adam out of the final 4 starts to espouse targeting David, at tribal councils or in game to future jurors like Jay, Bret and David himself. If Hannah does want to vote David off at some point, she never openly expresses it.
        – At F5 Hannah goes out of her way to save David.
        – It does not help that when Ken and Hannah finally turn on David, it is after Bret openly congratulating David on the win.
        – This leads people to think that it could have been Adam who got both Hannah and Ken to change their mind.
        – Like I said, David himself not crediting either of them for that move, hurt them the most.

        Adam openly telling David that his number one goal was to vote him out or that he would rather not be in F3 than lose, tell jury that he only went to FIC to stop David from winning – helped him a lot IMO.

    • Roswulf

      It kind of feels like Hannah was doomed by the fact that she was really frustrating to work with, and by virtue of her bouncing about, every jury member had at some point had to work with her.

      • Crappy

        I don’t even buy her whole strategic plan. I mean at F5 she only got to change the vote to Bret due to Adam finding the idol. Otherwise she would have had to decide between David and Adam. What does she do then? It contradicts her strategy.

        • Roswulf

          Sure, but it’s no sillier than some of Adam’s moves that no one held against him. It wasn’t that this thread was talking about Adam as a guaranteed loser.

          Hannah and Adam were similarly flawed players from the outside- but Adam’s demeanor (and, lets be honest, maleness) allowed him to sell his play far better than Hannah.

          • Crappy

            Just replied to this in a different comment. But don’t see this at all.

            Ken lost because he was seen as being not-strategic at all.

            Hannah lost because she was perceived to have executed wrong strategy for her. When her ally, David, who she saved, said that her move was irrational.. then that is not a good move at all.

            Adam, in jury’s mind, had the right strategy but could not execute it.. partly due to people like Hannah and Ken playing badly.

            Someone like Michele paid Hannah a compliment, yet recognized Adam as being more strategically sound.

          • Agree with this. Hannah only really had four moves that she could point to in her name – the Bret and Sunday vote outs, flipping on David, and flipping on Zeke.

            Adam was able to successfully argue that the former moves were bad moves, and the jury (unsurprisingly, given that Bret and Sunday were on it) agreed with him. Given that she had repeatedly refused to pull the trigger on David earlier, she was always going to have a lot of trouble convincing anyone that that had been her move, rather than Adam finally managing to execute.

            The Zeke thing never even came up, but that was probably for the best. “My other big move was when I screwed up the game for you, Jay, Will, and Bret and Sunday (again!) by flipping to the other side. Accidentally sending you home as well, Jessica.”

    • Purple Rock Emma

      Kinda surprised that Michelle went into it wanting to vote Adam, considering her question to Hannah. Also kind of eerie that David says a Jeremy style speech can sway him… did he mean one based on strategy or did Jay let the jurors know what’s been happening in Adam’s life? In any case, I’m glad it shows Adam had the vast majority of the votes even before his reveal.

      • The more memorable Jeremy speech was the pregnancy and knowing that David is a writer, I can see him going “That’s a good story”.

      • Crappy

        My personal take is that David valued the emotional weight with which Jeremy played that season , typified in that speech. I think Jay has said that he did not discuss it with the jury.

        Interesting tidbit in Michelle’s video was the info that she had a personal connection with Adam.. the edit did not give that up at all.

        • In one of Adam’s exit interviews he explained that his strategy was to build one-on-one relationships – he apparently had long private conversations away from the rest of the tribe with pretty much everyone. Most people thought they had a personal connection with Adam, but they didn’t know everyone else did as well.

    • Thirty-five Sandcastles

      Mostly what I’m getting from this is that if a guy tries to make moves and fails, it’s not his fault because there was an irrational woman “going rogue”. But if a woman makes moves and succeeds, she gets no credit because her motivations are suspect.

      • Thirty-five Sandcastles

        It’s cool tho because Hannah’s transformation reached it’s apex when she became confident enough to think that a good looking man might be willing to have sex with her. Maybe.

        • andythesaint

          While that’s not ideal, it’s slightly better than being the person who was considered to be a beautiful trophy to commemorate Hannah’s transformation.

          • Thirty-five Sandcastles

            Truuuuue

      • I really do think it’s more that final tribal council is too late to start trying to rewrite the narrative of the season. The jury is kind of like an oil tanker at that point – it’s got a lot of forward momentum, and if you want it to change direction you need to allow for a large turning circle.

        As far as the jury was concerned, Adam had been leading the charge to get rid of David for several days. It doesn’t MATTER who actually got rid of David; Adam was still going to get the credit because he was the clear owner of that narrative. It left Hannah no room to work with, because she was trying to fight Adam for ownership of moves they had already mentally assigned to him, and she didn’t have anything she could point to separately from him that could compensate.

        • Thirty-five Sandcastles

          I’ll grant you that FTC is too late to steer a story, but sometimes a person was making moves the entire time while someone else was getting the credit. Or making moves in a more subtle way than the person that gets attributed.

          The thing she pointed to was that a ton of people on the jury were put there by her, via conscious decision. But Adam got credit for “trying” to take people out and failing miserably.

          • Two of those people were Bret and Sunday and…did you see their faces when Hannah insisted SHE was the one who voted them out? They weren’t interested in crediting her with that, they were interested in blaming her.

          • Thirty-five Sandcastles

            I agree. That’s why I say it wasn’t a winning strategy, but it was a strategy. And one where she steered the ship (into disaster, but hey, live and learn) as opposed to “I hatched a lot of plans, none of which turned out, but I lucked into still being here”.

          • Thing is, Adam’s moves were just more visible, and more memorable. And also, the jury was pretty much in agreement (as someone above said also) that his plans were the right plans. You’ve gotta bet they’re sitting around at Ponderosa discussing strategy and what everyone should be doing, and they’d all have been in agreement that someone needed to take out Jay, and take out David. By making himself into the most visible proponent of those moves, Adam became their proxy.

      • Assistant Dragon Slayer

        I don’t think Aubry and Hannah are actually very similar at all, but they invite the comparison because they’re both jittery nerds. A lot of women have won Survivor, and they don’t have a whole lot in common, but “jittery nerd” is about the last thing you could call any of them.

        Or maybe it’s just small sample size. It took 15 seasons for there to be a male winner who was anywhere close to being a jittery nerd, and 11 seasons after that until a genuine nerd won.

      • Crappy

        Don’t agree with this take. Hannah’s moves do not make strategic sense to me as well. It is not just her anxious nature that led to jury thinking the same way. Her move to cause the rock vote to happen or the move at F5 make very little strategic sense. David who was saved by her at F5 thought it was an irrational move too.
        I don’t buy this ‘ women can’t be strategic in survivor’ argument that someone like Kass pushed forward. Dawn was recognized as being strategic but got burned due to her social game. Plenty of winners/non-winners females have been big strategic threats and have been recognized as such. Likes of Kass and Hannah get heat for their moves not because of their gender but due to the moves being highly questionable. Some one like Spencer, despite being a fan fav, got the same heat after Cambodia.

        • I think part of the reason Kass got so much hate from the jury was that she didn’t explain her motivations for flipping on people (at least that we saw).

          I disagree that Dawn was recognized as being strategic, though. I haven’t seen Caramoan since it aired, but I don’t recall anyone giving a confessional or jury question implying that Dawn was the mastermind.

          • Crappy

            I think Malcolm’s question at Dawn in FTC was an invitation for her to own the strategic game. He recognized that she was the key cog in big moves that season.
            I don’t want to start the Kass thing again. I don’t agree with the some what revisionist take on her game by many fans because of her colorful off show persona. Her move at the merge had no rational reason IMO.

          • Having freshly rewatched the Cagayan merge, I agree that there is no logic to Kass flipping. But that is because it is purely Kass being super emotional about Tasha not standing up for her to Sarah. As we sorta witnessed in Cambodia, Tasha has a tendency to be nice to a person until she no longer needs him or her (obviously the example here is Abi-Maria) and that was what Kass was picking up on. Kass wanted to have the power like she did during the J’Tia/Garrett boot, plain and simple.

        • Thirty-five Sandcastles

          Adam made nothing but highly questionable moves until last week. Until show before last, Adam was the “I destroyed your game. Me. Look me in the eye as I remind you that I voted out your girlfriend. I ruined you. Me. I did that. Did you hear me” guy. Or maybe in some quarters he was known as the “I told our rival about my secret advantage while I watched him eat stolen food” guy.

          Questionable strategy. And yet he swept

          • As Rob and Josh noted on Know-It-Alls, that strategy from Adam seems to have actually worked in his favour – it looks like the jury ended up viewing it as Adam owning his moves, and making it clear that it was from a gameplay place, not a personal place. It certainly didn’t stop Taylor from voting for him.

            In Adam’s exit interviews (backed up by stuff Michelle, Jessica and Bret have all said in the past few days), Adam actually had quite close relationships with pretty much everybody. Bret on EW, for example, said he and Adam had a side-alliance going ever since the merge. We never saw that. I think that didn’t translate to television well, but it’s clear that everyone genuinely liked him, and he maybe had a much stronger social game than we were shown.

          • corndogshuffle

            I’ve changed some of my thinking about Adam as a winner since hearing some post game press, specifically the bit about how he had “secret friendships” with almost everybody. It sounds like his social game was significantly better than we were shown. Unfortunately, the show wanted us to think he won because of strategery. Which I get, it’s easier to show that on TV as you said.

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            1) One of the jurors pointed out (as a criticism of Adam) that he was constantly on the wrong side of the vote. As gameplay it’s not great, but it also made it less likely that jurors would blame him for their ouster, even if he had burned them in some other way.

            2) I never felt those “yes, I screwed you” conversations were intended to rub it in peoples’ faces, and this jury (Jay, Zeke, and David especially) appreciated him owning his game.

            3) I always felt like those conversations didn’t make any sense unless they were setting up something like “I hope you can understand that I had to do what I had to do to stay in the game. It was nothing personal and I didn’t enjoy messing up your game. We’re still both in it and I hope we can still work together”. Now I think maybe he did say those things and we just weren’t shown it.

          • Crappy

            I have said it before here but I always though PRP went overboard in their criticism of Adam. I have myself said that he is a weak-ish winner and had a lot of flaws in the game.
            -Heading into merge he seemed to be in a good position, with relationships with both Gen X and millennials.
            – He overplays at merge, Taylor thing is very very bad but recovers and takes a back seat for some time.
            – Once Zeke-David war is settled, he tries to take the control again- Gets Will voted out and then tries to get David and Jay out.
            – Now ideally if he is the one who succeeds in getting both of this moves to happen, playing an idol correctly in the process, he would probably be seen as a very good winner. But circumstances and Hannah ensured that he kind of kept stumbling, even through he had the right strategic idea. Ofcourse telling Hannah of the idol was another big goof up.

            I the end, that was enough for jury since in their view – Ken had no strategic game, Hannah had a bad one and Adam could not execute his, but it was more sound.

            Funnily, in a season so dominated by strategy talk, Adam’s best move was a social one, when he mended his relationship with Jay.

    • Ms. Sweaterfan

      Thank you for doing that research so the rest of us could avoid it 🙂 I have been a bit on the fence about whether this was a case of unanimous jury group-think or if Adam maybe swayed a handful of votes with his emotional story – but now it definitely sounds like decisions were made well before FTC. I’m not mad at an Adam win, but I would so much prefer if the jury questions actually mattered :/ I wouldn’t want to go back to a sequestered jury, because then we would miss out on all the Ponderosa videos, but there’s got to be something they can do to liven up the jury (and I believe I saw an interview with Jeffy on that topic that a while ago…)

      • Alycia Swift

        Well at one point the jury was not sequestered but was not allowed to talk about the game. Maybe that would be the compromise. Or not let them talk about the game until some point at final 6 or 5 or 4. It just seems like there is too much influence. And I know real juries (in the Courts) work that way.

      • Crappy

        Most interesting bit of the jury videos was that Zeke openly indicated that he was trying to sway others. I think he is a big reason that jury hated Hannah that much, he likely sandbagged her entire game IMO.

        • Diego Armando

          While, she did tank his game, so payback’s a bitch.

  • Ken made history last night. He is the first “old” person to make it to the FTC in a young vs. old season.

    • Kemper Boyd

      so old at 33!

      • Yeah, but I never trust anyone over the age of 30, so he’s old.

        • Kemper Boyd

          Are….are we not friends anymore?

          • Are you over 30?

          • Kemper Boyd

            Since September…

          • Dang it…I don’t trust anyone over 33. There, we’re friends again.

          • Kemper Boyd

            Even 31 will do…

          • Well that way, I can also count Ken in that group as well.

          • Alycia Swift

            He’s now 34. Said it on Rob’s interview when he said Hannah said he and David were too old for her. It was very cute.

          • Well, I am not raising my standards ever again. Also, isn’t Hannah 24 or 25 now?

          • Alycia Swift

            Yes. I think so.

        • gouis

          Damn hater.

    • Hornacek

      Well done, you old fogie!

  • Something Quirky

    For Hannah fans – Myles made a post on the AV Club about how she was underrated by the other players.

    I don’t understand why Jeff had to keep going on about Adam’s mum, and ask about details we did not need to know. It went way too far into the exploitative.

    I am also confused about why they just showed part of the cast, and didn’t mention Zeke.

    Ken did not get as aggressively questioned about voting out David as I expected. I was flashing back to the Tocantins jury, and the thing they were annoyed about was only hypothetical! But that jury liked JT a lot more than this just liked David.

    • Ms_Woozah

      Thanks for flagging. I enjoy Myles’ takes.

    • Roswulf

      Instead we had a jury hypothetically annoyed at Ken for NOT being willing to vote out David.

      • Purplerockmatt

        when he did in fact vote out David

        • Roswulf

          Apparently that was all Adam. That rascally Adam, always convincing people to do things! Like that time he…uh…

          • Hornacek

            Like the time he convinced Taylor and Jay to throw him under the bus by saying he had stolen food.

        • Thirty-five Sandcastles

          But he did it in an old school way so it totes didn’t count

    • Crappy

      I think they had to talk about his mom.. since that was a storyline from the season and Adam’s main motivation for playing. I don’t think it was exploitative since they were also plugging a charity for donations. Besides it is a story line you can not script.. learning his mom died 2 hrs after he reached home was pretty heartbreaking.

    • Other Scott

      I don’t know how to feel about Hannah. On one hand I completely understand why she lost and I myself would have a hard time giving her my vote, even though she 100% controlled the post merge of this game.

      On the other hand, the reasons why she lost just seem so unfair to her.

  • gouis

    @andythesaint:disqus alerted me to the fact that Ken drops a Bright Eyes quote in his exit interview with Josh.

    Bright Eyes has recently released a vinyl boxset of all their (main) albums, which have been remastered. You can also get them individually, and I can attest that “I’m Wide Awake It’s Morning” sounds incredible.

    This has been “Ken’s Vinyl Corner”.

    https://twitter.com/purplerockandy/status/809467873252941824

    • Alycia Swift

      This is actually a pretty interesting interview. Wigler’s always are.

      • Wigler may be my favorite Survivor reporter and it is not even close.

        • andythesaint

          Love his interviews.

          Hate his puns.

          • How do you feel about the song parodies?

          • Alycia Swift

            Bleh. Ditto for all of them.

          • corndogshuffle

            He’s relied a little too much on Wanda recently.

          • Maybe, but that is his signature impression. Although I am just happy to have tweeted a suggestion to Wigler and that song is magically the exclusive. I would like to think that I caused that.

          • corndogshuffle

            Oh… you definitely caused that. It’s indisputable.

            I get that it’s his signature impression and I really do like it… but it’s a bit like Tabasco (or insert any tasty seasoning). There can be too much of a good thing and I think Josh is pushing the limit recently.

          • Maybe that is why he is holding back on song exclusives…Also, you don’t know what song I recommended.

          • corndogshuffle

            Good point about the exclusives.

            I don’t need to know what your song was, I just know that the PRP crowd is the smartest funniest and savviest Survivor fan base on the internet. If you suggested a song that he did, it was your doing.

          • It was the Layla parody. I did suggest him doing Ghost Busters for Trust Clusters but he didn’t do it.

          • Hornacek

            I heard Josh was going to do that one but Bret heard about it and told him “Come on! Gimme a break!”

          • “Break me off a piece of that Bret-Bret bar”…oh wait, I am turning into Josh Wigler….no.

          • Hornacek

            If you start bringing Wanda into your comments I am blocking you.

          • I really try not to, but you left me open there. Please don’t block me.

          • Hornacek

            I guess I did ask for it.

            I just bought TEOS this year, just finished Thailand this month. While I am enjoying it, I am kinda dreading the Palau chapter for what I expect will be non-stop Wanda songs.

          • Rough estimate: there is probably two or three songs per chapter/season, but they are really short.

          • Hornacek

            Lord, give me strength.

          • I figured I would give you a head’s up.

          • So I just started relistening to the Palau chapter, and one of the first words out of Josh’s mouth is that he hates Wanda.

          • Hornacek

            So he’s a self-hating Wanda fan?

          • I guess…I was a little taken aback by it.

          • Hornacek

            Sometime after the recording of that episode, he was replaced by the Wiggler from the Mirror Universe!

          • MsFjordstone

            I hope this isn’t considered spamming the board, but with all of this talk about song parodies I wanted to mention my Christmas band. We’re called Bah & the Humbugs (“America’s Premier Satiric Christmas Rock Band”), we’ve been on Dr. Demento, CNN, lots of radio stations, on stage in New York and Philly, and we have buttloads of free downloadable music at bahandthehumbugs.com. Most of it’s funny (although this year’s single is more poignant than funny), and it’s on the smart, irreverent side of the scale (contrasted with, say, the Bob Rivers kind of stuff). (And, we don’t do parodies — these are all originals.) Happy all-midwinter holidays, everyone! I was so happy to find a home here after AV Club ditched the reviews (and yes, I know they are back in mini-form, but it’s not the same!).

          • Hornacek

            Recently???

          • Alycia Swift

            He did say on the season wrap-up that he was gong to get away from that.

          • andythesaint

            Prefer the puns.

          • prettyboyprobst

            *rimshot

          • Purple Rock Emma

            We really do have so much in common, Andy.

  • Alkanarra

    Even not being a big fan of this season (for no specific reason – just didn’t click), I must say it was soooo refreshing not to have any nasty characters. No attention-whoring villains, no ugly confrontations or lingering grudges, and everyone – Chris aside – was quite forgiving at Ponderosa.

    This will no doubt carry over to season 34 and the ebullient group of Ozzy, Troyzan, Culpepper, and – let’s face it – Sandra and Tony. Gracious and humble, each and every one of them.

    • Kemper Boyd

      The friendliness and good nature of this cast (minus Figgy) really is the best thing about it. It was an enjoyable season, I’m not sure I’d revisit it too soon.

      • Alkanarra

        I think it’s the perfect time for PRP to do a Thailand off-season re-watch. From Adam to Brian: practically the same player!

    • Alycia Swift

      Troyzan, Ozzy and Culpepper? Gracious and humble?

    • Purple Tentacle

      What did Chris do at Ponderosa?

      • Alkanarra

        It wasn’t anything egregious: he was aloof with Jess (which makes sense since they never clicked) and straight up wouldn’t talk to Zeke, which was far more surprising. By normal Ponderosa standards it isn’t anything unique, but everyone else there was so forgiving that he kinda stuck out.

        He and Brett did get an adorable scene though.

    • Assistant Dragon Slayer

      I know it’s too soon to start in on this, but if Sandra and Tony even get to Ponderosa, 18 people need to be sued for Survivor malpractice.

  • Thirty-five Sandcastles

    I hated Zeke casually dismissing Ken’s play as Old School Survivor and saying that only “advancing the gameplay” would earn his vote. While there may be some truth to the statement, doing what’s required to get to the final is a feat in itself. GTFO with your style points. 1. Not standing out and putting a target on your back. 2. Not making enemies. 3. Forming social bonds you can trust. 4. Winning immunities when the target is finally on you at the end. To say none of that has value is just crazy (cue Bret) to me. There are different paths to play and they all have merit.

    • Alycia Swift

      Agreed.

    • Thirty-five Sandcastles

      Along those same lines, while I don’t think Hannah played a good game, I give her a TON of respect for standing up for the game she did play and making a much stronger case for her gameplay than I would have thought possible. Adam was like “you went rogue” and she looked him in the eye and said, “no, I went Hannah. You don’t run me.”

      She was the Anti Amanda Kimmel

      • She way exceeded my expectations for her. My only gripe is how she didn’t pounce on Chris’s question.

        • Diego Armando

          I think Ken declaring that no one manipulated him cut off her avenue. Hannah would (correctly, as far as we know) declaring credit would yield another Ken outburst and make her look like a liar.

    • Roswulf

      Has anyone ever pulled off what Ken did before? Making a clear pair at the start of the game, taking the secondary role, and actually pulling the trigger to take out the lead partner right before FTC?

      It’s like the opposite of Tony- making it to the finals in as few moves as possible.

      • Alycia Swift

        I do not think so. The closed might be Ethan and Lex since Lex was the leader but Mama Kim pulled that trigger. I may be wrong. Most of the time, they go with their partner even if the partner (Stephen and JT) is strong.

      • Assistant Dragon Slayer

        Tom in Palau, although maybe not in as clean a fashion as you’re looking for.

        ETA: “Secondary role”, never mind.

        ETA #2: Denise in Philippines surely would have, but she didn’t win the final immunity challenge.

        • Roswulf

          I think Palau is the great example of how HARD what Ken did is. Ian came so close to getting there (and unlike Ken, getting there meant winning)…and instead he had a series of nervous breakdowns culminating in effectively quitting the game.

          Denise is indeed probably the closest

        • Alycia Swift

          I did not even think of him.

        • Kemper Boyd

          Denise is definitely the closest. But she spent enough time out on her own and was liked and respected in a completely different way by the jury to Ken. She also talked strategy and didn’t talk loyalty and morality.

          • Plus she had a fantastic story of surviving every tribal council and only having immunity once. I believe in the Philippines finale, they talk about how Denise and Malcolm have a somewhat similar resume.

      • Other Scott

        The closest one I can think of is Earl, but who was actually the lead and secondary role in that situation is debateable.

        • But Yau-Man is so clearly the target in that relationship because of his likability and his story.

    • I’ve got a whole rant planned for the podcast about this, and you touched on some of my points.

      • Thirty-five Sandcastles

        Sweet! I hope you’re planning on using the sabermetrics based rant that I have in my mind!

        • Ken’s VORP is off the charts.

          Note: We’re pushing the recording back until tomorrow night, so the show will probably post this weekend or Monday.

          • gouis

            VORP? What year is this? 2002?

          • Electorally, it’s closer to 1999/2000.

    • Ms. Sweaterfan

      What are the chances that Zeke singlehandedly inspired the “Game Changers” theme with that jury question?

      • Hornacek

        150 to 200%

      • I would love to know. Maybe that is why they wanted Zeke on Season 34 so much, they failed to promote him in the season 34 preview.

        Although I did realize something: All of the people spotlighted either in person or in the preview for 34 were the parts of the cast that some fans would be excited for. Notice that we got no mention of Brad, Troyzan, Hali, Sierra, Andrea (although you did see a blonde jumping in the water), Sarah, Zeke, or Varner. For the first four, I bet Production thought that the casuals would not be excited for them to come back.

    • Alycia Swift

      Me 2. Because what did Zeke actually do to “advance” the gameplay in his short time. He convinced people to go to rocks but did not go himself.

      • Hornacek

        I loved Zeke’s exit interviews where he talked about how he convinced his entire alliance to go to rocks but omitted the part where he knew that he wouldn’t have to draw a rock. Most (all?) of those people knew the rules of a rock draw but in the heat of a moment (“We’re going to rocks!”) they probably forgot and thought “Zeke is willing to go to rocks just like the rest of us! What a great guy!”

    • gouis

      I love Zeke but he was being more than a bit arrogant.

      • andythesaint

        I love Zeke in part because he’s gloriously arrogant.

  • Alycia Swift

    I am accomplishing nothing today.

    • That’s like the secondary Purple Rock motto.

      • Hornacek

        Now I want to see a t-shirt that says “The Purple Rock Survivor Podcast – We get nothing done at work 26 Thursdays out of the year”.

        • Sylvisual

          I’ll design it, but I don’t think I can wear it.

        • Alycia Swift

          I would buy that. I just starting laughing so hard at work.

  • I just clicked on a page and it had a leaderboard of top commenters, which scared me because it made me realize how much I truly lurk around here. Yikes

    • Alkanarra

      For those curious:
      https://disqus.com/home/forum/purplerockpodcast/commenters/

      Ms. Sweaterfan better watch out, ’cause I’m one post closer.

      • Ms. Sweaterfan

        I am only posting this for my stats.

        • Kemper Boyd

          me too, not that I need it.

      • corndogshuffle

        Top twenty baby! Top twenty!

      • That is actually not the right page…

        • Alkanarra

          Well now you’re just being a tease. Give us the goods, B.

          • For once, I am not going to disclose a Survivor-related secret.

          • andythesaint
          • Hornacek

            Top six baby!

            I am proud I am ranked above some of the actual staff.

          • gouis

            Only 13th? I’m a failure.

            I’ll just have to rely on my longevity for self esteem.

            I wrote two player summaries for a bracket once!!!!

          • Assistant Dragon Slayer

            So close to the Top 10! Just like this season!

            This is weird, though. The list I saw had me just behind @purplerockemma:disqus.

          • That is because the prior list was weirdly ranked.

          • Diego Armando

            Holy crap, none of us were close to the queen.

      • Alycia Swift

        I seem to be the only one without a Twitter. I may have to change that soon.

      • Diego Armando

        I’m 9th. I am kind of disappointed in myself that I am not higher.

    • andythesaint

      Oh no! You’ve seen behind the curtains.

      • I didn’t mean to. I just click on a central page and it showed me that and now I have valid proof that I have no life. What is even sadder is that I didn’t even start posting around under this Disqus name until the 30 for 30 series.

        • andythesaint

          We may or may not have commented behind the scenes that you have almost as many as John and I combined.

          • Oh no….I just think I am a little too enthusiastic.

          • andythesaint

            The comments were with love.

          • Okay…I guess I just feel more open to reply here than I do in other places, which is another sign of how open and welcoming this community truly is.

          • Alycia Swift

            Its like we are actually having a conversation and respect and listen to each other instead of:

            -No, you are wrong because on this date, this Survivor contestant did this and here is the quote or the statistic to prove it-

          • corndogshuffle

            As long as I get a trophy regardless of whether my answer is right or wrong I can live with being corrected.

          • Alycia Swift

            But you don’t get a trophy. And its not just corrected, its slammed into submission as said above.

          • corndogshuffle

            Does this person have the same initials as if their name was “douche bag”? I’ve seen at least one or two multi page rants from this poster where the tone fits with what you’re saying.

          • Alycia Swift

            One of them.

          • He’s the worst though. Other people are more generally unpleasant, but not as soul-grindingly single minded.

          • andythesaint

            Seems weird that someone wouldn’t just cut that guy out. What’s one guy in the big scheme of things?

            We don’t do anywhere NEAR the numbers Rob does, and I’d cut a muthafucka just to do it. I WISH a muthafucka would.

          • prettyboyprobst

            He’s the posterchild for that kind of behavior. My impression is that you can find two rants like this from him in every rhap-discussion.

          • Hornacek

            “DB” and I have been going back and forth for a few weeks on an RHAP comment board about whether Dreamz stole the truck from Yau-Man in Fiji (I said he did, he said it was a gift with no strings attached). At this point I don’t care about being right or wrong, just don’t want to give him the satisfaction of thinking that he’s won by flooding me with multi-paragraph responses, so every few days I reply to his last response, only writing 1-2 sentences, knowing it will make him write another 8-10 paragraphs to respond.

            I started listening to the RHAP Survivor episodes a couple of years ago from the beginning (HvV) and have been binging them to try to catch up to present day (I’m almost up to the WA episodes now). Along the way I’ve skimmed the episode comments and I gotta say this “DB” person seems like an miserable person. Very much a bully, posting 8-10 paragraphs per response, verbally attacking a couple of commenters and saying “We have history” to justify it, always talking about how he’s studied the game for years and has notebooks full of research and analysis, and often dropping that he works in the entertainment industry (and it does not come organically). It’s rare that you see him discussing anything on RHAP where he lets someone else get the last word. He’s a real piece of work.

          • Alycia Swift

            I love that you are doing that. I could not be bothered but more because I would not be good at it.

          • Hornacek

            I’ve just been repeatedly telling him that there’s visual proof right there in the episode, and that all of his opinions don’t count against actual proof. Plus I keep telling him the definitions of “deal” and “steal” because he seems to hate that. And I remind him that Rob agrees with my opinion and that Rob knows more about Survivor than either of us will ever know.

          • Diego Armando

            You were right.

          • Hornacek

            I need a clip of Michaela saying “Hornacek! Your right! Hornacek! Your right!”

          • I’ve just blocked that guy because I couldn’t deal any longer. RHaP threads are much, much quicker to read now.

          • corndogshuffle

            The few times I’ve read RHAP threads I’ve been a little turned off because some of those people take themselves *way* too seriously. Was that a knee jerk reaction on my part or have I pegged them about right?

          • That’s why I don’t actively post over there. I will post on Post Show Recaps though.

          • corndogshuffle

            I posted there a few times. Mostly on Game of Thrones podcasts. I have enjoyed my few commenting experiences with Post Show Recaps.

          • prettyboyprobst

            And I’m far more likely to read through PSR than RHAP-threads (they’re usually really short, too short)

          • Yeah, the only PSR show I am an active subscriber in the SNL recaps and there is not really a community over there for it.

          • Mostly it is one guy, whose comments are very much as @disqus_b0GMy37Pwf:disqus said. The standard comment goes as follows:

            – refuse to acknowledge that anything you have said might be of interest or value
            – laser in on one minor comment and proceed to inform you, at length, of ALL THE WAYS THAT YOU ARE WRONG
            – blah blah “leader” blah blah “leader” “leader”, every single time in double quotation marks please god make it stop
            – lengthy list of cherry-picked examples of things other players did that ‘prove’ whatever boring point must be made
            – repeat until subject is battered into submission

          • corndogshuffle

            I think I know who you’re talking about, but I’m not certain.

          • I think I might have interacted with this person in the few times I’ve commented on Rob’s site.

          • Roswulf

            It’s driving me nuts that I can’t figure out the right phrasing to turn this into a cruel joke at Andy’s expense. It’s just sitting there right out of my reach.

          • andythesaint

            Same.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I like that when any of us here do the “ALL THE WAYS THAT YOU ARE WRONG” it is so obviously tongue in cheek.
            Because as we know every PRPer is wrong about SJDS it’s magnificent.

          • I love how you Brits speak the same language as us, but there’s just those little quirks where some words mean different things across the pond. Like how “pissed” means drunk to you guys, and apparently “magnificent” means hot garbage. Delightful!

          • Kemper Boyd

            that would be hot rubbish in our parlance and SJDS is a masterpiece of idiocy and the best end game.

          • I love how you Americans speak the same language as us, but spell most of it wrong. Like ‘aluminum’ when you mean ‘aluminium’, and ‘color’ when you mean ‘colour’, and ‘garbage’ when you mean ‘damn, Natalie Anderson is a queen amongst survivor players’.

          • Kemper Boyd

            I have never felt more proud to be European.

          • *mic drop*

          • corndogshuffle

            We cut extra/unnecessary letters out of words because we like to trim unwanted fat. Except when it comes to our waist lines.

          • Kemper Boyd

            They aren’t unnecessary, colour wouldn’t be pronounced the same if it didn’t have the U in British English. The ou makes a different sound to a single o.

          • prettyboyprobst

            At times I think about spelling words the British way here because I think a good friend wouldn’t encourage faulty behaviour (and they do spell things wrong!), but I’m too afraid to look stupid should I get inconsistent with it.

            Otoh I always want to slap the Brits on CNN for over-pronouncing every single word, it’s like they are performing sexual acts to a language – on daytime television, no less!

          • Kemper Boyd

            We pronounce the letters in the word, except where we don’t and Americans over do it, like pronouncing the W in the the word town in names of places, if it ends town, it’s pronounced ton. My favourite is probably Wymondham or Cholmondeley which are pronounced “windum” and “chumly” respectively.

          • prettyboyprobst

            Seems necessary to shorten these names, or else nobody could use them in a sentence without tripping up.

            And I usually like the sound of British English (I know, a ton of different accents, so who knows what percentage of Brits I actually enjoy to hear talk), but some of these newscasters just overdo it (which is probably what they are taught in broadcasting school).
            I don’t experience the same problem in movies or more casual discussions (but then I also have often more trouble to understand what is said).

            Germans of course are way too accurate to just lose letters at random. To us, every letter is a command to the tongue and lips, and they better obey, and do so orderly!

          • Hornacek

            I am Canadian and even I think spelling “colour” instead of “color” is dumb. And don’t get me started on “centre” instead of “center”.

          • prettyboyprobst

            I rarely reference (or read the comments about) music here, but this is from one of my favourite albums and the chorus seems way too fitting for me not to leave that here.

            (Lyrics in description in case you don’t have the patience to listen, or if you’re having trouble to make sense of what you hear, like me)

          • Alycia Swift

            Yep. But now there are 3-4 or 5-6 guys.

          • Alycia Swift

            Right. I still go there to read and Christine L has gotten it to be a little better but I post once or twice but usually something innocuous because I do not want to get into a war. I get enough of that in my job.

          • Trust me, we would never complain that you post here too much.

            If we were playing Survivor against each other, then maybe I’d complain because you have better relationships with everyone than I do. And also I’d complain about your witchcraft.

            Fortunately, this isn’t Survivor.

          • I don’t know about better relationships. I would just say that I talk way too much.

          • Alycia Swift

            If you were playing Survivor, you’d have a fire to burn her for her witchcraft too.

          • Convenient!

          • Are you trying to Skupin me?

          • Hornacek

            Most of @disqus_GpYJ355BVM:disqus ‘s comments are just gossip.

          • I would wager 15% of my posts is Survivor gossip, 25% is Fantasy League stuff, and 20 % is general Survivor stuff. That remaining percent is gossip.

        • Alycia Swift

          How do I get to this?

      • Assistant Dragon Slayer

        I may not catch you in Outcasts League, Emma, but I’m gonna take. you. down. in this leaderboard.

        • Purple Rock Emma

          No.

          • corndogshuffle

            These comments appeared in reverse order in the thread when I read them. So it looked to me like you said “Won’t You No.” I was very confused for a second.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            I realized that when it was too late. I suppose I could have edited them to be the right order, but that would have gone against the PRP brand of laziness.

          • corndogshuffle

            I can relate to the laziness. Unfortunately what I’m pretty sure is “teacher OCD” (I call it that because this sort of thing didn’t bother me until I started teaching) would have kicked in and I would have edited the comments so they appeared in the correct order.

          • Purple Rock Emma

            Huh. Now it looks right to me except our conversation interrupts the flow.

          • corndogshuffle

            Go home disqus, you’re drunk.

        • Purple Rock Emma

          You.

        • Purple Rock Emma

          Won’t

    • Kemper Boyd

      Oh no. I saw it and now must question what I’m doing with my life.

      • I’m quite competitive, so now I mostly want to know if this ranking is based on number of comments or number of recommends. Basically do I need to increase my volume of output, or merely my sycophancy?

        • Increase volume…absolutely increase volume

        • Thirty-five Sandcastles

          WNB?

        • andythesaint

          Total comments.

          Your efficiency rating is pretty high tho.

          • Kemper Boyd

            oh no, is mine low, I’m inane aren’t I?

          • Higher than Hannah’s.

          • Better than mine, that’s for damn sure.

        • Upping your sycophancy never hurts, though.

          • You’ve always been my favourite of all the PRP staffers named John.

          • Hornacek

            You should have said “second favorite”.

          • The best bit of this comment is that originally I thought it was an in-joke about my use of British English over American English, rather than…the other thing.

    • Other Scott

      I’m not sure if I’m higher or lower than I expected. That probably means I’m right where I should be.

      At least I have the fact I was commenting here when almost no one else was

      • You’re a total Purple Rock hipster.

        • Other Scott

          Their posts around the time they were doing the ultimate survivor player bracket were clearly the best

          • I definitely voted, but I don’t know if I posted during those days.

    • gouis
      • Purple Rock Emma

        Upvoted for using the PRP staff’s favorite gif.

      • I just have a lot of feelings, okay?

  • In other Survivor news, I just got a notification that someone has ‘liked’ one of my instagram photos, and that person, bizarrely, is Kelly Wigglesworth.

    The photo is of a seagull sitting on a pontoon. In Montenegro. Of all the Survivors I’ve hoped to come to the attention of over the years, this isn’t exactly what I was envisaging.

    • Congrats!

    • Assistant Dragon Slayer

      One degree of separation from Joey Amazing.

      • *squeals* *fans self* *runs off to continue writing that Joey Amazing fanfic*

    • andythesaint

      So. Much. Mana.

      • The seagull does a great Downward Dog.

  • Dutch

    First off, a huge “Thank You” to all of the Purple Rock Podcast staff for keeping us entertained, competitive, and involved in the best game on earth!

    Now – random thoughts:

    1)

    • Thirty-five Sandcastles

      2)

    • andythesaint

      A post will be made when the Pick 4 starts, yes.

    • Kemper Boyd

      If some steals my all name team I am going to be PISSED

      • Dutch

        Same here! Although, my “draft your personal favorites” strategy for Survivor 2nd Chances failed rather horribly. I’m just worried that the Queen of Survivor will be a pre-merge boot.

        • Kemper Boyd

          I genuinely don’t care, the team I want is awful but I want it anyway.

          • Dutch

            Completely understandable, and probably will be the same for me!

          • Kemper Boyd

            I don’t even like 2 of them and none are physical threats. I will probably decide to pick a real team I think can do well by March but right now the Sandra, Sierra, Ciera, Cirie team is a good joke to make.

    • Assistant Dragon Slayer

      2) Enjoy!:

      http://dai.ly/x4z261a

      ETA: D’oh! I was so excited by 2) that I forgot what you wrote in 1).

      • Dutch

        Haha – Australian Survivor was one of the best pure Survivor season’s I’ve seen in a long time. Great twists along the way as well (shame Phoebe was booted pre-jury, though). Glad to see it has been renewed!

        US Survivor nowadays hypes up the temptations for lengthy endurance challenges too much that they don’t play out like they did in the old days. Perhaps with the “evolution of survivor,” they will revert back to this as people are less trusting of their so called trust clusters.

        • Kemper Boyd

          I’d like a middle ground between the utter shitshow of the final 8 boots of Survivor Au and the BIG MOVES game of Survivor US.

          • Dutch

            Same here! The middle game of Australia was great, because there were people who came to play – and I can respect that! It will be interesting to see the evolution of Survivor Australia now that it’s been renewed and has pulled decent ratings in AU and across the world.

  • Jeezaloo, I don’t even know how to read these comments anymore. We’re approaching Infinite Jest here. I need annotations and a stiff drink.

    • Other Scott

      Doesn’t help that the featured comment instead of being relevant is just a sappy puff piece.

      (Just kidding, don’t hurt me!)

      • andythesaint

        Agreed.

  • Heads up: the backlash on Hannah and Ken is real and it’s happening right now.

    • What/where?

      • Roswulf

        And why was there ever a frontlash on Hannah?

      • Apparently they were bitter/arrogant in their exit press. I am going to give them benefit of the doubt that they knew they lost, but they didn’t know that it was a shut out.

        • prettyboyprobst

          I listened to Rob’s and J&S’s and Hannah was just her usual, happy and adorkable self. It wouldn’t be out of character for her to say something awkward in one of the many others, but I have a strong guess that real backlash on her would be an overreaction. Or just another day on reddit.

          Ken missed the J&S interview in the AM and sounded just generally down with Rob and Kim. Missing an early interview after the finale + after party makes him only more relatable (and he needs that) and I can’t remember anything egregious from him either, so I judge that an overreaction too, but with a little more room for error.

          But as I said before, I also think they both have every right to be a little bit miffed after the finale played out the way it did. I’m sure constant questions about it are not helpful if you’re not happy with the result or your perception in the public after the finale.

          • Fun story: apparently that place you just mentioned has actually been hacked. So, yeah it is a great day to be over there. I think some people did not like the fact that Hannah needed to watch the finale separately from everyone else (besides Zeke, who watched it with her). You know, it may be because a) she knew she lost and b) she has social anxiety and she is about to be on stage live in front of millions.

        • Other Scott

          I mean it’s really frustrating when you feel like you do everything you can to get to the end and still no one respects you. There’s probably not a more bitter place to end up than losing finalist, especially a zero vote finalist.

          • Agreed, especially if the jury may have awarded a flawed winner (in their opinion). I think Hannah will definitely turn the corner and being a positive presence in the Survivor community, but I could see Ken either unplugging from the Survivor community or really buying into the Facebook page’s opinion that he should have won.

          • Other Scott

            Also I think Hannah really has a point, I don’t think there was anything she couldn’t have done differently. She was one of those people that they kind of cast to fail. In the jury’s mind they only kept her around because she was a goat to them just based pretty much on who she was, and they aren’t going to give their goat their vote. Even though Hannah controlled nearly every post-merge vote.

            I really don’t think there was any possible path for Hannah to win this game, maybe even from the start.

          • Ms. Sweaterfan

            Very good point, but depressing to think about. I’d add FTC losers like Aubry and Dawn to that same category.I’d kind of like to see a final three made up entirely of that type of player to see what happens. Kind of like an all female version of the Nicaragua final three…

          • She was definitely cast to be the stereotypical “whiny and anxious” millennial who would be a pre-merge boot. I mean, she’s a barista, which just screams “I am a fresh college graduate with a fairly worthless degree” to most people. I think there are two big things that would wildly change her game: 1) Not take so long in voting out Mari and 2) Lie to Zeke about David being the biggest threat. However, if Zeke goes there instead of Jessica, Hannah does not make FTC.

          • Diego Armando

            I thing the game’s inherent sexism played a part in this. Players tend to give men a lot more of a pass in the flipping game than women.

            However, I will not absolve her of all blame. I think her anxiety and emotional neediness made her alliance jumping look erratic instead of strategic.

          • Ken does seem pretty bitter right now, but it’s probably the first time in his life that just being really, really handsome hasn’t resulted in people giving him stuff, so I will grant him some leeway whilst he tries to come to terms with this shift in the world.

          • I made essentially this same point in the podcast. This is the first time that being Ken hasn’t worked out for him.

          • Like I stated in the comment below, Ken is going to have a harder time coming to terms knowing that part of the fanbase thought he should have won and part of them think he is a laughingstock.

          • Something Quirky

            So he’s Jon Hamm’s character in 30 Rock?

  • Alycia Swift

    It seems Ken missed the morning interviews. I was listening to Joanne and Stacey’s interview with David, Bret and Jay. I liked Bret a lot more. There’s one for Hannah and Adam but no Ken.

    • It does happen from time to time, usually to someone who has a bit of a way to travel (Tasha/Cydney comes to mind).

    • prettyboyprobst

      Did you hear the handler at the beginning of the hannah-interview? He was supposed to be on the line with her, but they “couldn’t locate him”. But hey, they were probably only hours before at the finale-party and after-party…